2009 GranTurismo F1 pump/relay

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by Jdubbya, May 17, 2022.

  1. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    OK, I'm just not finding much info out there about this car in particular. My 2009 Maserati GranTurismo with the F1 transmission will not start. When I turn the key to on the car shows being nuetral but when I turn to start it does nothing.

    The F1 pump is not coming on when I open the door as usual. I hear something clicking in the trunk but I can't seem to even find in the manual which relay is for the F1 pump.

    There is a 50 amp relay in the trunk fuse panel but it's not even shown in the diagrams in the owner's manual so I have no idea which relay is which.

    Just for background the car drove fine into it's spot in my garage last time I had it out, but the alternator light had been coming on intermittently while driving. I had a brand new alternator the previous owner had bought and not installed so I tackled that job this weekend. I also put a new battery in, it was over 3 years old.

    I haven't been able to find much info or a workshop manual for this car since they only sold 300 of them with this trans in the US. But they did sell them in other countries so it's not a real unicorn.

    If I could at least figure out which relay to start with I might have a fighting chance of figuring this out. I'm almost sure it's the F1 pump not coming on that is keeping the car from starting.

    I know it's similar to the 430 and 599 system but they seem to be just different enough that I'm having trouble finding any good info.
     
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  3. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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  4. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    No red relay that size. There is the one off to the left of the trunk panel that doesn't show on the diagram in the owners manual. And looking it up online it's the same part you posted. Probably it. Gonna see if I can figure out how to test it.

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  5. flash32

    flash32 F1 Rookie

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    It is always live if like Ferrari ..so if you jump it the pump should run.. do for a second .don't want to over pressure the system

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  6. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    OK well pulling the relay and testing it, it seems to be fine. Good resistance across the switch side and when I put power to it it clicks. Looking at the fuse panel in my pic I started pulling fuses. The green 30amp maxi fuse 2nd down on the right is blown and is shown as a blank in the diagram. So I'm gonna guess since it's supposed to be blank and the book doesn't show the relay either, the two may be related?

    I don't have any spares for the maxi fuses so I'll grab some tomorrow and see if that does it.
     
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  8. windsock

    windsock Formula Junior
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    Pump has likely failed and blew the fuse. Common issue on that car. If it blows again you are going to need a new pump. We upgrade to a late model 430 pump as the pump is larger and runs less. You will also want to replace the relay and fuse.
     
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  9. flash32

    flash32 F1 Rookie

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    Once you figure out what the issue was/is

    Make sure you come back here with pump cycle times ..in/off .. with key in on position as well as running

    Also how many shifts before it cycles again key in and engine running

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  10. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    Bought a couple fuses today and sure enough, the pump came on and shut off just like it should when I opened the door. I was able to start the car but then I'm guessing the fuse blew again (I know it blew but guessing about when) and it finally threw a trans code for low pump pressure P1778. So yup, looks like I'm looking for a new pump now.

    Still seems odd to me that it drove just fine last time and made it all the way into the garage and just didn't start next time I went to drive it but I guess I should be thankful it didn't leave me stranded somewhere. :)

    Any good sources for a new pump?
     
  11. flash32

    flash32 F1 Rookie

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    Before we jump to a pump ..could it be that something else is causing pump to run too often and long and caused fuse to blow

    Give us the timings i mentioned above to help us help you

    Also does the pump sound "normal" or strained

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  13. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    It could be but it didn't stay running long enough for me to do any of that. It came on and shut right back off when I opened the door just like normal, I didn't time it but it usually only stayed on for about 2-3 seconds. Then it blew the fuse again probably just after I started the car since that's when it threw the trans code. And once it did that the pump obviously wasn't running any longer and the trans wouldn't shift at all.

    Logic tells me it's probably the pump/motor but I'll check other stuff out first if there's something else to look at. I only bought two of the big green fuses at $3.something each. I'll throw the 2nd one in tonight and see if it sounds ok or not. I honestly was just happy to hear it turn on. ;)
     
  14. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    Being a 2009 I thought this car came originally with the later/bigger motor? Looking up parts online I'm seeing 248087 as the part number.
     
  15. flash32

    flash32 F1 Rookie

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    If it blew that fast .. then most likely pump ..I understood that it was working fine after you put new fuse in

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  16. flash32

    flash32 F1 Rookie

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    If you try another fuse .. don't start car ..just open door ..turn key and keep shifting from 1to n to r to 1 etc ..see if pump comes in and for how long ..

    If you want i can speak to you on phone ..I will PM you my number

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  17. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    I'll try that tonight or tomorrow and see what happens.
     
  18. flash32

    flash32 F1 Rookie

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    Anything new

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  19. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    No sorry. Haven't spent any time on it but will this weekend. I need to get it up in the air to be able to get to the pump, someone else suggested checking to see if it gets hot before the fuse blows. No semi-easy access to it on this car like on 430's.

    Isn't it usually the motor that goes though? I found a place that sells just the motor, if it's the correct one, instead of having to buy the whole unit from Maserati. $300-$400 versus $1,500-$2,000. Big difference but I need to get to it to even see which motor it is. I'm seeing these two, the smaller one (top pic) being the older one. But I think mine is the larger one (2nd pic)....

    But I'm gonna make some time this weekend to get the car up in the air and get under there and see. I'll see if I can keep the pump running to get the times mentioned earlier.


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  20. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Yup, just swapping the motor works. Juri sells them on E-Bay.
     
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  21. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    OK, spent a few minutes messing with it tonight. New fuse in... pump came on when I opened the door, back off in about 4 seconds. Didn't quite sound normal. Turned the key on without starting and was able to shift into first and back to neutral and that was it. Fuse blew again. Guessing the pump was just gonna come on again when the fuse blew. Getting it up in the air now to see how bad it's gonna be to get to.
     
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  22. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    Well this is gonna be fun. Pulled the right muffler and a heat shield and I can see the pump and touch the motor. But I don't see how I can get to one screw and the ground wire and the motor is pretty much hard up against a cross member on the top. I think I'm gonna have to take the whole pump out. Maserati did not make this easy. I was gonna check the fluid level while I'm in there but I can't even touch the cap.
     
  23. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    So spent some time last night. Didn't get much done except some stuff out of the way. Finally just started unbolting the fittings and screws from the bottom of the pump and dropped it off the motor and then was able to slide it just enough to get it out. What a pain.

    But it's out, new motor ordered. Need to find a piece of new hose, the one just off the pump looks pretty weak and Maserati wants to only sell me the whole pipe and hose combo for $1,500.

    Probably gonna take out the other muffler while the motor is on the way, it's gonna have to be out to get to the reservoir to refill and eventually bleed.

    Pump then motor...

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  24. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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  25. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Veteran
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    Looking at the email link, I'd say it was likely.

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    Not exactly a good feedback score, though, from 362 sales.
     
  26. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    I noticed that too. But it was honestly truly the only place online I saw the same motor as mine. There seem to be three different varieties. The smaller older one, then the two bigger ones with either short plug or long plug like mine. Odd that there are so many different ones. Someone else mentioned my pump doesn't look factory stock and I don't know why it has the blue spacer on it. But it's what there and it's close to the parts diagram and there is other stuff in the diagrams that is different too. Odd.

    But hopefully I can get this, get it back together then figure out how to bleed it and get this car driving again. After doing the alternator over the last week and weekend, I'm dying to go for a drive. :)
     
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  27. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Juri sells lots of stuff to amateurs who expect miracles and have not done proper diagnostics. That results in some unhappy customers.
     
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  28. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    I really wish Maserati had set this up better though. I know on older CC cars (Coupe and Spyder) they could go in through the trunk.

    These cars though that's where the battery and one main fuse panel are.

    I now have both mufflers out, several heat shields, had to move the trans oil cooler, and I'm still not sure I'm gonna be able to get to the lid of the reservoir very well to refill and bleed it.

    I did look and find the bleed screw, that's not too bad except I only lifted the back end of the car and it's just far enough forward I'm pretty much all in by the time I reach it.

    May have to have a skinny friend come over to help with the bleeding. ;)

    But I guess I'm about done till I get the new motor. Will take a little time and clean a few things up while so much is apart but it's honestly fairly clean under there.
     

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