2013, what did we learn. some thoughts | FerrariChat

2013, what did we learn. some thoughts

Discussion in 'F1' started by Ferraripilot, Nov 24, 2013.

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  1. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    John!
    I don't think it's too soon for this. Still digesting it all a bit though.

    On a personal note, I have conceded Sebastian Vettel is a fabulous driver when in prior years I was still tepid to the guy. Fantastic driver, not necessarily a great sportsman, but a fantastic driver nonetheless.

    2013 is the year Red Bull started to be picked apart with Newey's right hand man being the first to go, to Mclaren.

    Ferrari can build a wonderful car, but can they manage and develop the car? This year the didn't. I believe Montezemolo is getting a whiff of reality for the need to alter its current management organization.

    Mercedes know how to build an awesome car, and they learned how to out-develop the field and they did until they moved efforts to 2014. We now know what they're capable of.

    Lotus built a great car, but lost and pissed off a great driver who they still cannot pay. Bell at MB scalped more of his prior engineers to MB. I fear for their future.

    Mclaren spent too much time developing their 2012 car which hosed 2013. Losing Lowe was a big blow but I believe they are turning it around, they are a strong organization albeit not my favorite.

    Then there's the rest and I can't stop thinking about Hulkenburg. He deserves a good seat.



    As far as drivers are concerned, there was more of the same at most teams. Alonso and Vettel laying waste to their teammates. I cannot believe how sloppy Webber has become since the RB6 days. I still very confused as to why Red Bull didn't hire Kimi, if Seb is so good why wouldn't they want an incredible teammate? Sounds fishy.

    Massa did not crash out nearly as much as prior years.


    Ham/Rosberg not getting the upper hand on either all year. I actually did some crunching on this as they were so close all year. Average qualy position Ham: 3.21, Rosberg: 3.68. Average finishing position Rosberg 5.36, Hamilton 4.89, and this includes Nico not finishing 1 more race compared to Ham due to a mechanical failure early on. Ham's finishing position average is obviously disputable as Ham himself doesn't believe he deserved that podium in Malaysia.....4 podiums Nico to 5 podiums Ham. Massively close between these two so next year should be entertaining again.



    Nothing interesting happening below that other than Hulk and Ricci, both seem to be good, especially Hulk. I'm hoping we see Bianchi in a better ride too.
     
  2. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Andreas
    I'm glad you came around on Vettel. We are witnessing F1 history in the making.

    Meanwhile I have to concede that a big car manufacturer is indeed capable of building a top notch car. MB has shown that Renault wasn't just an exception.

    I'm looking fwd to next season. Would be great if MB could continue their uptrend.
     
  3. Aircon

    Aircon Ten Time F1 World Champ
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    Peter
    Wait...sorry not to gloss over this.....so all the assertions you made....all the arguments you had....all the aggressive, disdainful and cocky posts you made on this subject of Mercedes....you were actually wrong?

    No disrespect intended, but I think it's time you get off your high horse and admit your opinions over the years are just that, your opinions...instead of trying to ram them down our throats as fact.

    Just sayin' :)
     
  4. freshmeat

    freshmeat F1 Veteran

    Aug 30, 2011
    7,289
    I really hope Hulk gets the Lotus seat, even though my guy in Brazil said it's a done deal at Force India for him...he needs a top seat to prove his mettle.

    As for RB+Kimi, I felt the same way even though deep inside I was praying Kimi wouldn't sign with RB, because I really can't sport RB gear...I follow driver first then teams, so it would have been a personal tragedy for me if Kimi had signed to RB.

    As you can tell from the pitstop fiasco earlier today at Brazil, Seb is clearly their #1 driver...they completely botched Webber's planned pit and pulled Seb in instead. I strongly believe Seb+Horner, behind closed doors, said "no" to Kimi as he would clearly pose a threat to his #1 position within the team and Horner wants nothing to threaten his baby.

    Also why I suspect, Horner always tries sooooo hard to speak highly of Webber. It's all a parade for the media...
     
  5. RP

    RP F1 World Champ

    Feb 9, 2005
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    Tone Def
    We learned that no matter what changes, F1 is a boring show. In the last 10 years, what percentage of events gave the fan the feeling of uncertainty as to the race winner? 5%? 10%?


    Only the appreciation of poetry in motion in international venues makes it interesting. And addictive. At least for me.
     
  6. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    John!

    Wait wait wait, it takes a pretty big person to own up to such things. My hat is off to Andreas. I've thoroughly surprised myself in reconsidering my position for Vettel as well, I never thought I would alter my opinion of him. I WAS WRONG :D
     
  7. Aircon

    Aircon Ten Time F1 World Champ
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    This is a thread of revelations!
     
  8. Far Out

    Far Out F1 Veteran

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    Kimi has shown that he can be extremely fast, and extremely sloppy if he isn't motivated, and he is already quite old nowadays. RB has a dedicated team just for future drivers. Hiring Ricciardo means planning for the future, Kimi would have just been an interim soultion. And a risky one, too.

    +1

    Group hug! :)
     
  9. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    I suspect it is simpler than that: RB already have a #1 and Ferrari wanted to make sure they do too (LdM/Fred feud).
     
  10. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    John!
    It was a 12 step program. If I didn't realize his (Seb's) skill then I would be looking at years of therapy later haha.
     
  11. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Andreas
    I would have had to send you a set of golf clubs for Xmas :p

    But seriously enjoy the Vettel ride while it lasts. In the history of the sport it is a phenomenon (as was MS era). We are just getting spoiled because both super talents are following each other so quickly. Look back into the 60 years of the sport and you see how unique this all is.

    That said I still prefer a Ferrari WDC
     
  12. NeuroBeaker

    NeuroBeaker Advising Moderator
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    Andrew
    It could be said that you don't need to ram someone's concession down their throat. Just sayin'. ;)

    All the best,
    Andrew.
     
  13. Aircon

    Aircon Ten Time F1 World Champ
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    Peter
    It could be said, but there are exceptions to everything. There are still many not conceded.
     
  14. zippyslug31

    zippyslug31 Formula 3

    Sep 28, 2007
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    Kevin M.
    Well said and this is where I'm at now. I can't say I'm a fan, but I've come to realize that he's a 4-time champ not solely due to blind luck.
     
  15. GTE

    GTE F1 World Champ

    Jun 24, 2004
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    Marnix
    you don't see all that much Vettel flags or even Red Bull flags in the grandstands, but ok, there is no denying the guys superiority behind the wheel of a formula 1 racingcar.
     
  16. Far Out

    Far Out F1 Veteran

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    In my observation, the number of fans depends on the age of the team.
     

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