To all the naysayers about construction: have you seen the pics of India a few months before the race? Construction is not the issue here. $ is and that seems settled according to Bernie
Its a year away....Road paving...10 days max.....garage construction....12 weeks max...this is NYC after all
Construction and $$ are not separate issues Also .. Bernie only "sees" a small piece of the entire business model: namely, does he get his check, or not? He couldn't care less about investor profit schedules, or interest payments on bonds to financing banks. He doesn't need to care about any other details of the business model for this (or any other) track, because there's always many others waiting in the wings, waiting to pay him his full sanctioning fee ... OF COURSE it's all about money But instead of using Bernie's satisfaction as a "barometer" of progress, i'm using asphalt work as a "barometer". Asphalt work tells me there's real investment dollars behind the track. Pit buildings don't impress me a whole lot, because the cars don't race on them; road-side condos and retail shops don't impress me a whole lot, because that real estate isn't owned or controlled by Hindery (i suspect). YES ... it's ALWAYS been about the money ... that's what the doubters (myslef included) have been saying all along. I hope it happens ... but i'm looking forward to real progress on the track, before i get too excited.
Hope you're right. But here's what I've learned about F1 asphalt, particularly when Tilke puts his name on the track: - ASPHALT STABILITY : Tilke will absolutely examine the ground under the asphalt, up to 5 meters beneath the track, to look for stability problems due to : moisture, bedrock movement, etc. Massive "cracks" or "shifts" just can't happen on Tilke tracks ... their "figure of merit" is 5 years with practically zero maintenance, no matter what climate (as i understand it). - ASPHALT QUALITY : unlike typical road asphalt, where vertical (or "normal") loads are the major concern, modern F1 asphalt is much more concerned with lateral (or "shear") loads. Tilke has a very special (no doubt proprietary) asphalt mix that is used on all new Tilke tracks, including street tracks (as far as i know). - ASPHALT SHAPE : the "crown" in typical road surfaces is a non-starter for F1 tracks. Charlie Whiting absolutely dis-allowed the "crown" on the Jersey roads, during an inspection last year. (has that changed?) I think there's substantial work to be done on the Jersey asphalt. I'm not saying it can't happen ... if there's enough money, there will be enough road crews to get it done on time. But they better get started ... soon.
Residuals from the HBO series "The Sopranos" !!! No worries about bedrock stability as it is all solid granite underneath which is why they are able to construct tall buildings on it without resorting to deep pilings
All jokes aside I hope this still goes through. Since its public knowledge that Bernie injected some sort of funding, my guess is that its a definite go ahead. I don't really see him as the loosing type. However, I'd like to see an updated map from Tilke. There has been so much new construction down here in the past year that surely the orignal layout has to be changed some how? All those photos on pitpass don't actually show how large the waterfront is. They are putting in 5 condos on the water front called The Avenue Collection. Home Page In lincoln harbor the whole new interchange by the tunnel is completed and they are putting up new condos/rentals there as well. The Estuary I believe is the name? I think all construction went ahead as scheduled with buildings regardless of the race. Obviously all parties involved hoping it does happen and they make out on the deal. I agree the front of the paddock area will have to be wider, but last I talked with waterway management they said that whole front area is going to be ripped up and done over. They needed the army corp of engineers for approvals since its a major water way which is why they were delayed a year as well. "Supposedly" Pavement wise....how many tracks are street tracks? I don't see Tilke worrying about what is 5 feet down when 5 feet down is the Palisades cliff rock. Also, of the current tracks how many are paved up to Tilke standards aside from dedicated tracks? Crowning in the roads? What about a few corners there in Monaco... I feel like if the money is in place its a done deal. I just want to know what week to take off next year for a possible back to back Montreal---->NJ party!
Bingo While Bernie is known for playing games, it seems unlikely that he puts up his own money to then suddenly walk away. Donington was different: He would make money if it didn't happen. IMHO that's pretty much a given: We know when Monaco is and Montreal is two weeks after that. NY will be one week after Montreal, therefore the GP is on June 15. As I said, I made my NY hotel reservation already.
Latest comments & Q's fom Pitpass; Very odd indeed...... Cheers, Ian pitpass - More questions than answers
Just thinking quickly maybe "PIRA" is actually a cloaked Bernie? It wasn't formed until months after the inital annoucement. If all goes well he can keep it or sell it at a higher profit then he put in?
Hmmm.... Good point. Anyone know anything about this 'mysterious' PIRA? If its a legit 'company' the names behind it must be listed somewhere, surely? The infamous 'Bambino Trust' maybe? Cheers, Ian
Good point, I was thinking about something like this... Perhaps he's also "diversifying" his assets in expectation of a criminal or civil judgement. Also could be securing a future position of power within F1, if he has to step down from his official one. Basically buying controlling shares in long-term, promoter-friendly F1 agreements from the other end. Perhaps Montreal will suddenly land a new 15 year deal with the backing of new investors.
If Bernie is accepting a lower sanctioning fee from Jersey than he could get easily from other venues, he's losing money. I don't see Bernie losing money for 15 years ... that's not the Bernie we all know and love. Best evidence is that all the condo construction has nothing to do with the race organizers/promoters ... the property around the street is not owned or controlled by Hindery. It's already known that some of the NJ paddock area construction has to be ripped-up and done over? Please take this up with Charlie Whiting. He visited NJ last year for a preliminary inspection, and concluded that the crown in the Jersey streets was unacceptable for F1. Is the money in place?
Very odd indeed ... what exactly does "strong support" from local townships mean, since we know it doesn't mean financial support? Good luck and best wishes?
From Indy experience in Houston, you DO have to grind off the normal street crown (for drainage) and then lay down the high tech asphalt coating required, to flatten the racing surface. You don't go deeper than that, on existing concrete. Don't forget to weld down the manhole lids ...
Not true. Bernie is willing to take in less revenue if it suits his plans. Turkey was a losing proposition yet he did it anyway for some time (owning the track btw). Monaco is paying the smallest fee because it is Monaco. Bernie really wants NY and is therefore willing to make a different price. I can't wait for this race. This will be the best F1 event in this entire hemisphere.
I have a second cousin who lives 1-1/2 blocks away from the proposed course. Although his apartment windows unfortunately face the wrong way, we may still be able to watch some of the action from the roof of his building!
Not true. Monaco's small fee is not Bernie's choice ... it's grandfathered-in. Accepting a lower sanctioning fee in NJ ... a fee which he could easily get, today, from other venues ... IS Bernie's choice. Therefore, accepting a lower sanctioning fee from NJ is equivalent to Bernie losing money. If his desire for a NJ race is the primary, or sole, motivation here ... he can pour unlimited funds into it, anytime, to make it happen. I'm merely suggesting that his "desire" for a NJ race is not such a big factor after all ... he may vocalize such a thing in the press, but behind closed doors his wallet doesn't seem to be expressing the same desire Oh ... the best F1 event in this hemisphere already exists and will happen at least twice before Jersey
