308 Dash top heat vent flaps???? | FerrariChat

308 Dash top heat vent flaps????

Discussion in '308/328' started by chairpilot, Sep 15, 2009.

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  1. chairpilot

    chairpilot Formula 3

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    #1 chairpilot, Sep 15, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I pulled my dash to see if I could do it! Not really, I actually wanted to fix some things behind the dash including seeing if I could clean up & improve A/C flow to the outlets. It was actually very easy to remove the dash as other recent posts have mentioned.

    I discovered that my two outer dash top heater/defrost outlets have leather like flaps which (when new) appeared to act as one-way valves (i.e. leather diodes), allowing center A/C air to flow to all three vents but in heater mode would close off the routing the heat to the center outlet.

    Does anyone else have this? I do not see this feature on the parts diagram. The picture shows the dirver's side vent with the flap dislodged from the fixed pins that appeared to originally hold it in place. The passenger side flap is in place. Both flaps are dried out, curled and very stiff so they do not operate as intended. This could be contributing to poor A/C air flow into the cab, no?

    Should I resurrect this feature or block the center off permanently?

    OR...maybe block off the heat portion and have just A/C on the three center outlets.
    I figure the bannana outlets may be enough for defrosting the glass and the two lower knee outlets would provide heat to the cab on cold days.

    Comments - recommendations?
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  2. BillyD

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    #2 BillyD, Sep 15, 2009
    WHAT???????????????? I thought the windscreen had to be out to remove the dash!
     
  3. chairpilot

    chairpilot Formula 3

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    #3 chairpilot, Sep 15, 2009
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2009
    NOPE!! piece of cake, at least on my car. First time it took me about 45 min (my steering wheel was already off). I bet I could do it in 20 next time (wheel off) or 60 min including pulling the steering wheel and stalk housing off.
     
  4. Owens84QV

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    #4 Owens84QV, Sep 15, 2009
    Please post instructions!! I as well was under the impression the windshield needed to come out. The leather/vinyl around the kidney shaped vents in the corners has shrunk and the only thing preventing me from getting this fixed is I didn't want to risk cracking the windshield/bending the molding.
     
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  5. speedy

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    #5 speedy, Sep 15, 2009
    HUGE Myth.... 4 screws (two on each door jamb). Slides right out.
     
  6. speedy

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    #6 speedy, Sep 15, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    My dash came out with a little effort. It had been in there for the better part of 25 years so some muscle was required. Anyway... Take the steering wheel off with your allen wrench. You don't need to remove the collar and everything like chairpilot did. Then remove the 4 screws (circled in blue), loosened the lower bolt for the steering wheel adjustment (circled in green) and tilted the steering column down. It gives you a better angle to slide it out. I eventually removed the bolt and tilted it down a little further to give even more room. As you can see, it's not necessary to do the last step.

    IMPORTANT:

    DO NOT TRY TO REMOVE THE CRESCENT VENTS UNTIL THE DASH IS OUT!!! They will break and you will have to get creative when reinstalling them, like I did. They are attached with some tiny metal post clips on the underside of the dash.

    The three center vents should pop out without much of an issue. They're held in with a simple wire spring setup.
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  7. speedy

    speedy Formula Junior

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    #7 speedy, Sep 15, 2009
    Bob,

    Your flappers need to be rebuilt. You might be able to drill out the rivets, unhook the hoses from underneath and take out the unit from the top. You should be able to clean the whole thing up and replace the flappers with something similar. I think they're rubber aren't they?

    Good luck man.
     
  8. chairpilot

    chairpilot Formula 3

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    #8 chairpilot, Sep 15, 2009
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2009
    DO NOT forget to undo the one screw to the right of the radio housing and just left of the relay panel. You'll have to drop away the relay panel to see and access it

    Ultimate Pedals posted the procedure last week which is how I found about about all this.

    Go to his "I'm fed up with my 308's lack of AC" and to post #144. He's got pictures and everything!!!

    P.S. - I got the memo on the side bananna outlets too late and had already popped them out (!$#%%$%!). But I think I can make them work again.
     
  9. chairpilot

    chairpilot Formula 3

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    #9 chairpilot, Sep 15, 2009
    Do I really need them? I'd like to make the whole triple thing all AC (only) to increase my outlet capacity when I upgrade my AC evaporator (the whole AC system upgrade currently pending). Heat does not seem to be a problem in these cars - in So. Cal. winters. As for defrost, I could reverse the outlets and make the center one heat and the two outer's AC.
     
  10. speedy

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    #10 speedy, Sep 15, 2009
    That's right... 5 screws. Forgot about the other one.


    If you don't think you need the flappers, cut them off... or leave them be. They're not doing much anyway.
     
  11. SoCal308GTSiQV

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    #11 SoCal308GTSiQV, Sep 15, 2009
    Nice work Bob, I thought I had my car apart! Man, weren't we driving these cars a week and a half ago!

    Well, I need to get into my dash as well, I want to make sure all the vents are hooked up and working.

    I'll be following this thread...
     
  12. Owens84QV

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    #12 Owens84QV, Sep 16, 2009
    Thank you!
     
  13. miketuason

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    #13 miketuason, Sep 16, 2009
    Is this also the way how to R&R a heater core if you need to?
     
  14. Martin308GTB

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    #14 Martin308GTB, Sep 16, 2009
    No, the heater cores are in the front compartment. Fairly easy to access.

    Best Regards from Germany

    Martin
     
  15. miketuason

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    #15 miketuason, Sep 16, 2009
    That's good to know Martin, thanks.
     
  16. bwassam

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    #16 bwassam, Sep 18, 2009
    Man, those pictures are scary. I had my airplane in that condition. It took years for me to get it back together.

    Bob
     
  17. Jdubbya

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    #17 Jdubbya, Sep 18, 2009
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2009
    Bob,

    Try pulling up on the center section of the vent plenum. If I recall it should pop out and you can then replace the flaps. They are just held in by the plastic pins you see.

    You will also probably want to replace the foam gasket around the outer edge too before putting the dash back in.

    It's great you got your dash out without taking the glass out. I tried for like a week and couldn't get it to budge. Is there still a piece of black trim right at the bottom of the windshield that the dash has to fit under on your car??
     
  18. chairpilot

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    #18 chairpilot, Sep 18, 2009
    Yes John, it is still there (the metal trim piece). My dash was sticking a bit, but only from age - vinyl sticking to metal. once I worked it the dash slid right out. The shop I took the dash parts to said all my vinyl is still good and so I'll get it back repaired like new - WITH ALL ORIGINAL MATERIALS INTACT!!

    Tomorrow I tackle the dash vents and clean things up for the dash homecoming next week.
     
  19. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    #19 Jdubbya, Sep 19, 2009
    That's great. I guess I should have tried harder to get mine out but when I heard cracking I pretty much stopped. Didn't want to have to replace the dash itself instead of just the covering! Would have saved me a lot of money too, new windshields and trim are not cheap :eek:
     
  20. chairpilot

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    #20 chairpilot, Sep 19, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    As I speak, today I'm cleaning up the vents and discovered a gap AND tear in the left heat duct line (red arrows in photo). I also now realize those two "flaps" (originally) were only covering 1/2 the outer heater discharge outlets when the AC was blowing (WTF??). I'm not sure what good that was doing.

    Can anyone confirm if theirs is a half or full coverage flap? I'm inclined to make my new ones full coverage (see photo with red dashes) so the AC blows 100% into the three top center vents and no backflow towards the heater cores.

    I'm also going to need some advice from everyone on what flap material I should use.
    BTW - what is the original flap material? It looks like it was clear vinyl at one time and has turned very dark yellow/brown and has even shown cracks like dried leather does. It is about .050 in thick at the (still) plyable edge (roughly 18-16 ga.)

    Help me! I want to put this all back and DRIVE ASAP!!!

    Bob
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  21. SoCal308GTSiQV

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    #21 SoCal308GTSiQV, Sep 19, 2009
    This is a great thread Bob, I'll be working on my dash next summer, I'll be saving this thread for that!
     
  22. jsa330

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    #22 jsa330, Sep 19, 2009
    Great thread, should be a sticky.

    I learned the hard way about the crescent vents.
     
  23. chairpilot

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    #23 chairpilot, Sep 19, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I did some checking in my CD parts manual and there are no components listed for these flaps or the three holed plastic drop in insert that holds them (???). Does anyone have a different manual that shows the flap components? I can also now see why the flaps are "half" size. When the heater/defrost blows, the flaps rise up to a vertical position (from the heater blowers) against the top of the drop-in insert frame to seal and block off heat from the center (AC) vent. See attached photos for more clarity.
    I can also see that the idea of increasing the flap size mentioned in my last post will mess up heater/defrost flow to the two outer round vents. So maybe that is not such a good idea.

    Still, my main objective is improving/increasing AC flow. Heat flow has been very good so a potential reduction may be worth the modification for AC flow improvement.

    Hmmm....I'll have to do some more thinking here........
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  24. chairpilot

    chairpilot Formula 3

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    #24 chairpilot, Sep 19, 2009
  25. chairpilot

    chairpilot Formula 3

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    #25 chairpilot, Sep 21, 2009
    Does anyone have these flaps in their top outer dash vents visible? If so, do they seem to be working or are they stiff and dried out liked mine?

    Does anyone have a parts manual that shows them, and the three holed plastic insert retainer, as factory parts with a number?
     
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