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308 2v sodium valves

Discussion in '308/328' started by AREA, Jan 21, 2015.

  1. Nabga

    Nabga Rookie

    Oct 31, 2017
    17
    CT
    Full Name:
    Barry Enis
    can i save this piston
    3mm deep groove ..... no cracks
     
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  3. MrDino308GT4

    MrDino308GT4 Formula Junior

    Sep 2, 2009
    671
    Geldermalsen NL
    Full Name:
    Arian
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  4. sp1der

    sp1der Formula 3
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    Jan 10, 2009
    2,134
    UK
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    Simon Ashley
    I would say very lucky escape in terms of damage looks like a new valve seat and piston only.
     
  5. Nuvolari

    Nuvolari F1 Veteran
    Sponsor Owner

    Sep 3, 2002
    5,658
    Toronto / SoCal
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    Rob C.
    The piston is garbage. Original pistons are cast and with a mark like that it is prone to failure. You got off lucky once don’t expect a second.
     
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  6. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 6, 2002
    74,307
    Houston, Texas
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    Bubba
    Well you have won the lottery in way......

    Bad news is that pistons are not available, unless maybe a good salvage one??
    Trouble is you still have seven good ones!

    But, you are very lucky that happened and did not trash the engine badly.
     
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  8. 308 milano

    308 milano F1 Rookie
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    Kim
  9. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 6, 2002
    74,307
    Houston, Texas
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    Bubba
    Nice work......
     
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  11. Patrick Dixon

    Patrick Dixon Formula Junior

    Mar 27, 2012
    791
    UK
    If it helps, I may have a serviceable piston from when my engine was rebuilt 20-something years ago. I'm in the UK.
     
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  12. kiwiokie

    kiwiokie Formula 3

    Aug 19, 2013
    1,058
    Tulsa, OK
    Looks great!!


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
  13. Albert-LP

    Albert-LP F1 Veteran
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    Sep 1, 2010
    6,880
    around Modena, Italy
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    Alberto
    2v USA cars with cat and high mileage: God bless you if you still have OEM Sodium exhaust valves.

    Change them, unless you own a low mileage car (and you don't want to drive it much agian)

    ciao
     
  14. derekw

    derekw Formula 3

    Sep 7, 2010
    1,336
    London, UK
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    Derek W
    #64 derekw, Jun 16, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2020
    Buy a used piston. I have some if you don’t find them in the US. I have updated 21-4N stainless valves for £10ea and you’ll need the guides lined (good engine shops will have the 8mm guide sleeves and tool.) I have viton stem seals £1ea. Change the rings and bearings while it’s out along with all seals (diff, shifter, cam drive bearing etc)
     
  15. JuLiTrO

    JuLiTrO Formula Junior

    Nov 2, 2017
    276
    Full Name:
    Julio Saiz
    Ciao Albert,

    Bold question, does it apply for non-cat cars too?
     
  16. Albert-LP

    Albert-LP F1 Veteran
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    Sep 1, 2010
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    Alberto
    Yes, of course: but for the cat cars the problem comes out earlier, as the cat raises exhaust temperatures and so the exhaust valves thermal stress.

    But It's not an age problem, like it happens for rubber parts: it's a mileage only problem.

    ciao
     
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  17. JuLiTrO

    JuLiTrO Formula Junior

    Nov 2, 2017
    276
    Full Name:
    Julio Saiz
    Good, thank you. That was my guess

    I do have that "Damocles Sword" on my neck, there is only one carbon copy invoice from the 80's mentioning 'valves' but not the work done in a almost ilegible hand written.
    So I dont know whether those d**m valves are still in the car
    My guess is that they are not as I reached 63K documented miles and nothing happens yet so.... they were replaced... hopefully....

    We love these cars, dont we?

    Regards

    Julio
     
  18. ferrariowner

    ferrariowner Formula Junior

    Feb 21, 2014
    804
    Mansfield, TX
    Full Name:
    Ron
    Is there anyway to look at the valves with a bore scope and determine if they are sodium or SS?
     
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  19. Portofino

    Portofino Karting

    Sep 17, 2011
    228
    Yorkshire UK / Switzerland/ Cote d Azur
    Full Name:
    Portofino
    Apparently the stainless steel aftermarket ones are not magnetic.
    The OEM sodium/ steel are magnetic.
    Perhaps the best access is from the top .....under the cam covers .....try a small magnet from that end .
    You might be in there anyhow....fixing oil leaks , doing the clearance etc .
    Or if the exhaust manifolds or Carbs are off ...,,you could turn the engine and try the magnetic test .
    Obviously taking necessary precautions not to drop anything in .
     
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  20. Nuvolari

    Nuvolari F1 Veteran
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    Sep 3, 2002
    5,658
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    Rob C.
    To access the valve tip with a magnet you do need to remove the cam cover, camshaft, and cam bucket. Quite a lot of dis-assembly to run a test that can be deceptive at best.

    I changed my OEM valves to Stainless a few years ago and, out of curiosity, tried a magnetic test between the two installed valves and there was not a definitive difference in pull between the stainless and non stainless valves. I believe that the steel keepers and spring retainer make it difficult to determine if the valve is stainless with a magnet.
     
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  21. derekw

    derekw Formula 3

    Sep 7, 2010
    1,336
    London, UK
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    Derek W
    Look at my engine rebuild— google Derek’s 308 and I describe how to test the valves via the plug hole. There are a lot of 2V engines with high miles so it seems random or perhaps related to oil quality, driving style, fuel quality etc. As many know, the guides are soft, wear, and the eccentric closing of the valves with over-specified springs causes fatigue at the weld joining the head to the stem.
     
  22. thorn

    thorn F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 7, 2012
    2,931
    Tallahassee, FL
    I thought high-mile 3x8 cars were more proven, and reliable? ;)
     
  23. Nabga

    Nabga Rookie

    Oct 31, 2017
    17
    CT
    Full Name:
    Barry Enis
    are the valves still available??
     
  24. derekw

    derekw Formula 3

    Sep 7, 2010
    1,336
    London, UK
    Full Name:
    Derek W
    Yes, lots left both inlet and exhaust. I have a range of lengths (.020” range) so depending on your seat wear I can usually find some to give a usable shim thickness. Get your guides lined if they are loose (don’t buy new guides unless they are undersized and you can index cut them concentric with the seats. If you fit new guides and cut the seats you will sink the valves into the heads and the shims to give correct clearance will be too thin. £10 per valve, £2 per viton stem seal (butyl seals in most gasket sets are not suitable for exhaust valves.)
     
  25. miketuason

    miketuason F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Feb 24, 2006
    14,321
    Cerritos, CA.
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    Mike
    Just to let you know not all stainless steel are none magnetic. I have some SS valve from or for my Fiat/Lancia and I can still feel some kind of magnetic in them.
     

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