308 Cam Belt Drift

Maybe. But they care too late. A reception inspection of the parts, after they have got it from their manufacturer would be much better, than caring afterwards when the complaints are coming.
What Wayne describes could be easily diagnosed with a vernier caliper (taper) and a good eye (burrs) after receipt from the manufacturer. I would not forward such junk to my customers.

But this is typical for a pure sales business as opposed to a shop mainly run by technicians. I miss the good ol' Mike Elliot times regarding SF.
Imagine, you don't perform the job yourself, but purchase the parts and entrust the actual work to a shop.
Who pays the necessary double labour?

Wayne,
who pays for the shipping costs from the U.S. back to the UK?

Best from Germany
Martin

 

Hi Martin. My guess is it was a bad batch of parts. I've been buying from SP for many years, and they have always handled any issue very quickly and fairly. Once in a while there will be a problem. My guess is they are quite surprised by this issue, but at least I know they will make it right. I would certainly raise the issue of the cost of the work already done. I think your suggestion of a more thorough inspection of the parts when they first get them is a good policy they need to incorporate. I suspect they do that, but this batch got through the system. Let us know how it eventually turns out Wayne. Cheers.

 

It would be interesting to know how they (SP) would have made it right with the subsequent damage that would have resulted had the OP not noticed this and the belt had ridden off the pulley at 7k+ RPM...

 

Yes, that’s the $20,000 question.

 

Every manufacturer / supplier sometimes gets it wrong. I'm not affiliated in any way with SP, just a customer. Over many years, they have been extremely good in the customer service dept (at least in my experience). Not much point speculating on something that didn't happen. Let's see how they handle the complaint with Wayne. My guess is they will go above and beyond. (btw, not much point in pushing those little 3 ltr engines past 6K )

 

Well, as far as 6k limit - my 328 gets to redline (and sometimes to rev limiter) on a regular basis.

I will admit the fact that SP is doing anything at all is favorable. I have dealt with suppliers whose only response to any issue is "you installed in incorrectly; we are not responsible!"

 

At what rpm does the rev limiter activate? Did not know my '87 had one.

 

Someone once told me that was the valves floating (!) but a Ferrari tech in Vegas where I had the PPI done told me that the 328 does have a limiter that cuts the ignition at 8200 RPM. I can confirm that approx RPM...

 

You're pushing your luck.

 

I find much past 6K you are making more noise but not really more power. 4-6K is the sweet spot in the motor.

 

Nah, not really. The engine is perfectly capable of it; it's not the least bit fragile...well, at least a 328 isn't as mine has proven for the past 11 years. I'd call the 328 motor pretty much bulletproof.

 

Of course it's your car so do what you want. Just remember, it's over 30 years old. Those are famous last words.

 

Mike talks about his 328, while you -and I- have 2V 308s.
But I agree with you on the 4-6K being the sweet spot of this engines. It even applies to my Euro carb GTB without any anti-pollution crap.
Regarding noise; Even if it doesn't deliver significantly more power, the noise alone is worth pushing the engine near 7k occasionally, if I'm in the right mood for this kind of music.
I still love it after all these years. But remember, a Euro car doesn't have the noise deadening device in the airbox and I don't have the stock Euro carb single pipe exhaust, but a well aged ANSA 4-pipe muffler.
If I would push my engine permamently that way, I'm sure it would have gotten as boring as listening to the same record each and every day.

Best from Germany
Martin

 

So, does anyone have access to a torque/Horsepower graph for the 328? After reading the above I would like to know where max torque is... for scientific reasons... ;-)

Lester

 

There are some dyno charts posted on the site somewhere...

Keep in mind that shifting at max torque per a dyno chart will not even be remotely close to shifting at max HP as far as acceleration is concerned. Remember that the torque curve crosses the HP curve at 5250 RPM. IOW torque automatically drops below HP from that point on. It's a function of how torque/HP is calculated. So essentially, since torque falls off beginning at 5250, if you shifted based on "peak torque" per the graph, you would shift at 5250...and be left looking at rapidly disappearing taillights if the the 3x8 next to you is shifting at peak HP.

 

Hi Lester,

from the german book from the 1980s "Ferrari 308/328 - Autos, die Geschichte machten [cars, that made history]". Our 3x8 bible for a certain period and still one of the most comprehensive books about our cars without a lot of bla-bla and BS.

Sorry, metric SI/77-units. But I think it's not much of a problem for you to convert to imperial units.

Ferrari 328 Euro:

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328 US:

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For comparison 308 GTB Euro carb:

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Best from Germany
Martin

 

Torque doesn't have to fall off above 5252 RPM. It's just HP>T above 5252, HP<T below 5252 because T = HP x 5252 / RPM, torque in lb-ft. But that says nothing about whether torque rises or falls or is flat, at, above, or below 5252 RPM.

 

John is EXACTLY correct. The 5250 rev/torque number is an "artifact" of the calculations when measuring in US units and is exactly the same for every car, my 3 cylinder SAAB engine does the same thing, just a lot lower on the graph. ;-) Shifting at Max Torque (all things being equal) will give you the best acceleration. As the saying goes, HP gets top speed, Torque determines how quickly you get there.

Lester

 

Thanks Martin!

If only I could figure out which line goes to which units! ;-)

Lester

 

Lester,

the flat curve is torque, the steeper curve is horsepower. Ignore the lower flat curves on the 328 graphs.
You can see this, because there are no more Nm-values on the right Y-axis for the peak of the steep curve. Especially on the 308 graph. So it MUST be the left Y-axis with the hp-values.

Best
Martin

 

Got it. So that makes peak torque on a US 328 at 3800 to 4000-ish.

Lester

 

The number 5252 comes horsepower being 550 ft-lbs/sec multiplied by 60 sec/min divided by 2*pi.

 

Right...so, as stated earlier - shift at the "peak torque" per a dyno chart and you are going nowhere fast. SHIFT at the peak HP per the dyno chart if you want to maximize performance.

I have always hated the typical US dyno charts because all they do is confuse people. There should simply be one power curve - HP, KW, Joules, or whatever. Ironically, even though HP is computed from torque, the HP curve is the one that matters as far as figuring out how much power you make at any RPM as far as operating a vehicle AND where to shift to make the most power.

Torque with no RPM produces nothing. RPM coupled with torque produces POWER and that's what gets you acceleration and speed.

 

You guys are giving me a headache !