308 glass-fibre values

Not sure if this is normal but my 77 US 308 with a Tubi and Euro bumpers is a little faster than my friends 85 Euro QV especially over about 85mph. The power to weight seems to favour the earlier car to me so I though the difference would be most noticable of the line?

 

You are right, IMO....

Remember the later 308QVs approached the earlier car's HP but by then they had added serious weight to the bumpers, etc as well as interior features....

The old adage applies:

"To go faster, add lightness!"

 

The Mustang Ranch car was a wet sump as well.

David, I think the wet versus dry sump is pretty much academic unless you just wnt bragging rights to having a dry sump. The glass cars are all going to be the most collectible, no matter what type of oil system. And there is no way to compare the injected car to the carb in terms of sound, throttle response and the act of being a "real" Ferrari!

(I'm just busting on the injected guys...they are all real Ferraris).

I'm not biased, I have one of each and each engine has its good points. The injected engine is more tractable and everyday useable. The carbs are more fun and sound better.

Birdman

 

Testing procedures in the 60s and 70s were extremely subjective to who was driving and how much they were willing to really get performance out of the car. For instance, the magazine in question could test performance with a driver who is not familiar with how to drive a Ferrari, or they will only rev the engine to 7k shift points, or the car would not be tuned correctly at the time of the test, or they are not able to get the wheel-spin factor correct to launch correctly. The list goes on and on. My personal guide book for 308s driven by people who KNOW how to drive a correctly tuned stock Ferrari 308 goes back to the Bob Bondurant '76 Euro glass 308 test drive. Bondurant got a best 0-60 of 6.4 out of that car. That figure is a pretty good baseline for the rest of the 308 series. I figure early US steel carb 308s get about .5 second behind that, and late carb 308s have another .2 behind that with the early injected cars being slowest with another .2 behind the late carb 308s. Makes sense to me.

 

Where exactly are you based and looking for a car. There always seem to be glass cars for sale in the UK.

 

Really the figures I have seem have them showing similar HP with the early cars being slightly lighter. I can see now way there is a 3-6 seconds difference to 100. That would need a massive power to weight difference.

I think in reality a Euro glass car is about 2650, US glass 2800, Euro steel 2950 and US steel 3100 when stock. Another chatter recently weighed his 77 and it came in at 2950 or so with US bumpers I think which was lighter than expected. Its pretty easy to loose the initial 150lbs of a US car by changing bumpers, exhaust, spare wheel and going to one distributor. After that it begins to cost a lot more as you start on the lighter battery, brakes, radiator etc. I think just with bolt on changes you may be able to loose 300lbs of a US.

 

Not Verde Scuro, but Pino Verde

http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=57786&highlight=verde

........and probably the best example on the planet

 

There is no way that the honkin' Kjet system/plenum isn't WAY heavier than 4 webers! Unless they lightened the QV elsewhere, it has to be heavier than a carb car.

I couldn't care less about how fast a 308 gets to 100 or 60 or does the 1/4 mile. I just like to drive it and my '77 is more than peppy enough. The period magazines are all over the map on 0-60 times and this can only be because they didn't want to beat on the cars or they didn't know how to drive them, or conditions were not good, or all of the above. But drive an early 308 and you can tell by driving it that it's not a 9 second 0-60 car!

Anyway, dry sump glass cars are available in europe...you just have to be willing to pay for them! The days of the cheap fixer upper in that model are gone. They have mostly all been scooped up and restored!

I guess the answer is....do you really want that dry sump glass car, or do you really just want a good deal on a 308 to restore?

Birdman

 

I am going to venture a guess to say that magazines did not *really* begin to beat on Ferrari's for high test figures until the QV. QV test figures that I have read seem to be pretty consistent. My '76 steel will pull away from a US '84 QV all day long and the QV test figures are far better than that of the tests performed on early '76-77 308s. My guess is they just did not have anyone who knew how to drive it and they did not want to beat on it. I am not about to hook up my g-tech meter and beat on it all day because as Birdman said, it is more than peppy enough, and for my dollar, I would not pay that much of a premium for a glass car. Not enough of a difference IMHO.

 

Phil Hill also has shared that many Ferraris required immediate attention to carb sync, before running properly........

 

FWIW, i picked up a 76 US spec 8,065 original mile 2 owner (proven CDN car) all books and records with original radio...original spare tire and original rims (got the 328 rims included) and fully serviced for 85k CDN...put about 800 miles on it, and runs perfect, no leaks, engine and all suspension work redone to new and have the invoices to prove. Worth every penny.

 

oh yeah, orignal paint, rugs, seats...never touched, same owner from 76-20...second owner 2001-last month.
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