308 Practicality Modifications

I'll bite. How much of a faffle was this? More or less drop in or a ton of fabrication?

 

For me, because its me and I'm an idiot there was a ton of fabrication.

But there are basically bolt-in setups:
https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/ez-power-steering-kit.637557/

 

Not one specific area but for owning your car as a practice -

• Start shopping for parts now. Build a collection of seals, gaskets, and nuts/bolts, hoses. if you see a good deal on a part on ebay or any marketplace, go get it. you never know when you will need something

• look at systems you can modernize without sacrificing the soul of your car (everyone has a different needle here) - Fuel, spark, charging, AC, stereo, lighting.
  
• Safety - modern seat belt mechanism. (keep your old stuff)
• Save your old parts - you never know what can be repaired or refurbished.
• Bushing and rubber materials.
  
• Find someone who can 3d scan and 3d print or machine broken parts - and we should all share the files in a repository. Make things look original but manufacture them better.

As for particular areas:

• Wiring - we are all in these old cars that are in some areas wired very inefficiently. Additionally, the wires are very old. We commonly overlook and work around what a hindrance or possible hazard old wires are.
  
• Hoses - Keep up to date on changing these. Scuderia Rampante in Colorado makes a nice and expensive set of silicone hoses for fuel and cooling systems.
• Cam Pulleys - I got a set of Derek's that saved me a couple bucks on the upgrade. And there are Nicks Forza ( ping @smg2 ) that are extremely high quality - as in they invested in Gates tooling to make sure each belt tooth is 100% correct to fit the belt. I think most people look at these as a very expensive timing adjustment option. BUT if you do the math, you can upgrade to the Gates RPM blue racing timing belts. These belts have a different rounded and deeper tooth design, thus they are much less likely to slip. They are much stronger materials that when on a road car most people say they have a 100K lifespan, even though we would probably time out between 8-10 years if you want to push it. They give you fine tuning capabilities.

 

I might have found a much less expensive packaged option for this...

 

Anytime you modify your car you are second guessing the team of engineers who quite literally do that for a living.....its easy to make something different, better is a bit harder, "better at what and what are you willing to give up?" are the questions that follow. Stock 308 suspension is tuned like a touring car, I assume because that is how they figured most buyers would use them. I personally found driving it a little scary, just so mushy and SOO much understeer, I bought my car pretty rough and just thought everything was whooped but no, that is how they built it and I know many (most?) owners just love it stock. The factory builds for the many, turners rebuild it just for you.

 

iirc I spent about $300 including the 2:1 steering quickened I added at the same time (easy and FAST steering ) but had to cut and weld on the steering shaft to fit it.

A cheap bolt-in(ish) option would have been awesome

 

You sir, are from a different cloth. Can I send you an email - I am working on something and wanted to get your thoughts. I have your address from a previous post or on Grassroots...

Spencer

 

Cool project discussion is always welcome! [email protected]

The post I almost wrote for this thread a few days ago was "The first thing I'd do is...oh wait....I know nothign about PRACTICAL modifications"

 

What advantage did you gain from this?

 

Perhaps stock by USDOT standards but not OEM European ones. Not only were the 5mph bumpers mandated, but many Euro imports were forced increase ride height (spring spacers, etc.) for USDOT bumper height regs. Heavy bumpers and higher ride height made for inferior road handling compared to OEM Eurospec.

 

Of course it did. But what I have recently discovered after riding on a Neuspeed Sport suspension on the Scirocco since the late 80's and a Ward and Dean racing suspension on the Alfa since 1997 - there is a lot to be said for factory springs and shocks and simply adding or modifying anti-sway bars. Particularly in the case of my Scirocco.

It's been a refreshing change after 30 years the other way

 

Great perspective, and as you say, different strokes for different folks!

Honestly, even with my worn suspension I always found my car to be pretty neutral in pretty aggressive street driving, like in our canyons here in SoCal. But that's not autocross or track driving which is a whole 'nother beast, and for that level of aggression I can totally get why your setup is the way it is.

Side note: After a hard canyon drive my back is soaked from the non-assisted steering inputs. I'm definitely considering the electric assist option.

From my perspective (take it for what little it's worth), the OEM softer springs and oil-filled shocks really soak up the crappy roads here, and for most (as you've alluded to) of us who don't track these cars it works pretty well, even when pushed a bit.

-w-

 

Mine has been a daily driver in sun snow and being Britain rain!

Only issues I've had was
1. Steering shaft came out of yolk after going over pot hole. So no steering. Issue was a very worn grab nut on yolk and ferrari replacement had a far longer raised shaft so they probably new it could be a problem.
2. Best tyres you can for your driving conditions. Mine are for rain.
3. Swapped to short front chin spoiler as sick of hitting sleeping policemen.
4. Birdman fuse box.

Other than that very nice car to drive and easy fix if anything goes wrong. Enjoy the experience.

 

@ATSAaron Hey Aaron, you have power steering mod, right?

 

I disagree. I did this recently, and I wish I had done it years ago. It allows me to proactively keep temps in check when I know I am about to get stuck in traffic--or as I roll slowly off the track and back through the paddock. I also rigged a status light so I know whether the fans are getting power. So far, it's been so effective that If I ever swap the stock radiator for an aluminum unit, it will ONLY be because of the weight savings. (I've already stripped more than 200 lbs off my car, so that IS a thing with me.)

But to each his own--I'm curious why you don't see a benefit.

 

My understanding the original equipment fuel
pump was a weak spot in the fuel system. The Hill upgrade was done purely for resiliency and reliability. Especially for an injected car maintaining consistent fuel pressure is critical for smooth/high performance.

 

Having driven myself to the edge of madness trying to fine-tune my cam timing with the crude factory pin system, I came to the conclusion that the next time I do my belts, I'm investing in a set.

 

It's not just my personal opinion, but how the system works.

So that we're on the same page, the modification I believe we're talking about is doing a switch bypass - such that the fans turn on with ignition power, not when the coolant temp activates the switch at 90C.

All this does is make it take longer for the coolant to warm up, which means it takes the engine longer to warm to proper operating temperature. I don't believe the time delay to be of benefit.

 

I did a fair amount of mods on my '77 but by far the best was the large racing radiator followed by the Tubi exhaust.

 

Oh, no no -- I agree that would be counter productive. You absolutely WANT the engine to warm up quickly. The modification I made is a *manual* bypass switch in the cockpit that I can activate in advance of slowing down in traffic or pulling into the paddock at the track. I also rigged a status light to illuminate when the fans are receiving power through the fan relay. That way, I know if and when it kicks on or off automatically, due to coolant temps or the air conditioner.

Is anybody really just hard-bypassing their coolant temp switch so their fans are on all the time? That's like deleting the water pump thermostat.

Thanks for giving me the chance to clarify--sorry if anybody else misconstrued.

 

Yeah, a larger/better radiator+ better/larger fans made all the difference in my general driving.....before I lived in fear of traffic or hot days, staring at the the temp gauge, watching it creep up, wondering if I'd need to pull off . After, just kind of wishing the AC was better but not need to even think about engine temp, 195 right where its set is all it ever saw. Now I've also installed a 160 t'stat and set the fan to 180 and that is where it sits. night and day difference new big aluminum radiator to old sad brass radiator.

 

If there is a problem turning the fans on early isn't going to solve it. When you say "keep temperatures in check" you're not actually doing anything. As I posted in another thread the boiling point of a 50/50 coolant mix at 1 bar is 253 degrees F so your "in check" range is most likely severely constrained and not backed up by any real data. In effect on the 308 temp gauge the range between 140 and 250 can be considered NORMAL. Outside of that is when you've got a problem and it is above 250 when the light comes on.

 

250 degrees is most certainly NOT in the normal range for a 308--and the stock pressure cap is not 1 Bar (14.7 PSI) either. It's closer to 0.8 (12 PSI.) That makes the boiling point of the coolant just 238 degrees F. Let me quote the owners manual for my US spec 85 QV:

"As the mixture circulation is under 12 p.s.i. pressure, max permitted temperature is 230-240 [degrees] F. NOTE: It is necessary to reduce immediately the engine RPM in case the temperature exceeds 240 [degrees] F."

I agree that "if you have a problem," IE: a coolant leak, air in the system, or a failing pressure cap, turning the fan on early isn't going to solve it--though it might allow you to last a little longer and get to a safer place to pull over. But the reality is, keeping coolant temps within a narrow range and well below boiling has benefits for the longevity and reliability of an engine--especially an imperfectly sand-cast aluminum engine. What do you think is going to happen if you're running at 249 degrees when you park the car? Let assume you have upgraded your pressure cap like I have to a full 1 bar, so the fluid *isn't* boiling yet. The sudden stagnation of coolant and the inability to even run the fans after shutting the motor off however, will cause your temps to rise an indicated 20 or more degrees--and probably much more in the actual water jacket near the exhaust valves. Yes, it will cool off fast without any combustion taking place, but it doesn't take long for there to be serious impacts. Best case scenario, your car burps some coolant out the overflow pipe, then draws some air in as it cools and shrinks. Worse case scenario, you've already got plenty of air bubbles in your coolant. When you start the car again, the fluid cavitates in places, eroding aluminum, and steam pockets prevent proper coolant circulation. Your temp gauge lies to you and say's everything is okay, but damage is being done, quietly and out-of-sight, and one day, you notice white smoke coming out of your exhaust or foam in your oil. Then things get expensive.

You may quibble with all that, but next time you're at the track, have a look inside the cockpits of the all the serious machinery, and you will see radiator fan switches in each one. I suppose it's possible they're all completely unnecessary and redundant, but in absence of "real data" I will defer to the accumulated wisdom of several generations of race car builders.

 

Well I was just suggesting that the vast majority of us don't need to lose sleep over this and that the fear of a catastrophic overheating event is maybe a little bit over-hyped. Hey, maybe I'm wrong but in my experience whether on the road or the track you could keep your foot on the floor all day and the thing ain't gonna blow up unless there is something wrong. You know it's not a race car, right?

 

I think race cars like switches because they are light and reliable. No doubt switching the fan on as you roll to a stop will by you a little time if the system is not up to snuff, it shouldn't change anything if the cooling system is working correctly, well, I guess the temp will then be controlled by the engine t'stat instead of the radiator fan t'stat switch. I'm pretty sure the fans t'stat is 195, but don't recall if the engine got a 180 or a 195? I thought 180 so a little cooler running the fans on a switch. On my car I tried to automate as much as possible so fans and such are controlled by the ecu, but that is getting way past simple, practical mods