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308 Stainless steel brake lines frustration!

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by Birdman, Nov 7, 2006.

  1. ferrarifixer

    ferrarifixer F1 Veteran
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    Jul 22, 2003
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    Phil Hughes
    yeah, it's called modulation....
     
  2. Beta Scorpion

    Beta Scorpion Formula 3

    Jun 22, 2006
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    Here is a picture of the plugs that were mentioned. They fit just fine. http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showpost.php?p=135931695&postcount=34
     
  3. hanknum

    hanknum Formula 3

    Nov 1, 2003
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    I think Jonathan is talking about greater torque. The further the caliper is from the axle centerline, the greater the torque applied and thus greater breaking force. Also, as the rotor size grows it will most likely increase the brake pad "swept area". The down side is, as the rotor grows in size so does the unsprung weight.
     
  4. Verell

    Verell F1 Veteran
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    May 5, 2001
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    Verell Boaen
    There are shops that can weld magnesium, then the wheel could be refinished...

    I'd try for a UPS damage claim anyway, what have you got to loose?
     
  5. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    Right! I always think about torque as twisting force, but in braking it's the same thing. The further from the center of rotation the brake caliper is, the more force it can apply to slow the wheel for a given amount of pressure.

    Verell, the chip is so tiny, they wouldn't really need to weld it. I'm not making a claim because I know how that process works and it's not worth my time. If the damage was greater I would, but it's not worth it.

    Birdman
     
  6. chrismorse

    chrismorse Formula 3

    Feb 16, 2004
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    #81 chrismorse, Dec 11, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Here is a shot of the rotors that are going on the front of my 77., 355x32 from a chevy suv Brembo Big Brake Kit Calipers will be F-50, Back will be 360 challenge, 328x28 with 36-40 calipers. Jeez, I hope this works.
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  7. hanknum

    hanknum Formula 3

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    Don't you mean CHEESE (as in swish cheese). Wow, look at those things. Let us know how it all works out. I've got stainless lines and have been thinking about going with Porterfields so you've got me beat by a mile.

    Good luck and keep us up to date.

    Hank
     
  8. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    So the "plugs" came today and I opened this HUGE box that was to contain a tiny pair of plugs and found.....one single plug. I'm like "what the....?" so I called them up. "Oh, those come in singles, not pairs." Well the website kinda implies they come in a pair because the description is "914 Rear Brake Caliper Plugs" . Doesn't that mean a pair to you? "Plugs" being plural, and referencing "rear" meaning both of the calipers in the rear.

    Nope. You get one.

    So I had to order a second one today and pay shipping AGAIN. Not too happy about that. I asked them to please update their website and make it intuitively obvious to apparently stupid people that if they actually want a pair they need to order two.

    On the plus side, looks like they will fit. I'll get back to you on that.

    Birdman
     
  9. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    The other one arrived. I'll put 'em in tomorrow and report back. I'm also hot on the trail of some Ferrari logo decals for brake calipers. I'm having a run of them made. heh heh heh gonna be cool. Let me know if you want them, I'll have some extras.....
     
  10. hanknum

    hanknum Formula 3

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    I'm interested.
     
  11. RVIDRCI

    RVIDRCI Formula 3

    Dec 1, 2005
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    Luigi
    +2
     
  12. stephenofkanza

    stephenofkanza Formula Junior
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    I'm interested in both do the screws fit and the LOGO's.

    stephen
     
  13. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    I just sent the moolah to the vinyl place. I'm having a few dozen made in 3 colors (red, yellow, black).

    I probably won't have them before Xmas, but I'll keep you posted.

    Birdman
     
  14. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    #89 Birdman, Dec 16, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    A little follow up. I had one fitting that was leaking and I pulled it apart. This is what I found. The little cone-shaped copper crush washer got cock-eyed and wasn't sealing. They are a little tricky to get in there. Fortunately, Orme had put 9 of them in the bag, allowing for one screw up. Good thinking!
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  15. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    #90 Birdman, Dec 16, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Now, about those ridiculous plugs on the inside of the rear calipers. Egads, what a lousy design. In the first shot you can see the plug on the caliper, with a giant gash in it where I whacked it tangentially with a cold chisel to pop it loose. In the next shot, the pair of them removed. Not looking too good!
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  16. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    #91 Birdman, Dec 16, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  17. hanknum

    hanknum Formula 3

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    Yeah, they're a little tricky. I think I put a little brake fluid on mine to hold them in place. I think Orme sent me a few extra too.
     
  18. Pizzaman Chris

    Pizzaman Chris F1 Rookie

    Mar 13, 2005
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    hehehe... He said c***-eyed.:)
     
  19. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    LOL!!! :D

    Update....today I took it for a drive. Gotta love driving in MA on DEC 17. We had some very light snow a week or so ago and they OF COURSE dumped salt on the roads. But we had rain this week and it washed the roads clean. Today was sunny and 50's. We have a standing informal meet of the NE Ferrari dudes at Starbucks in Beverly, and we actually had 4 Ferraris show today. So anyway, the pedal was softer and had more travel than before, so I definitely have a bit more bleeding to do. (I got a lot of air in the system because I let someone talk me into completely blowing all the old fluid out of the brake system with my power bleeder before I took all the fittings apart!! Not mentioning names....) Not a biggie. I'm hoping that driving it around worked the bubbles loose.

    I also have a less effective parking brake than I did before, but I think I will post the question about that in a parking brake thread. In summary, I adjusted it to spec when I installed the new pads, but I have too much travel on the e-brake handle and it's not grabbing as hard as it did before. So I need to find out the best way to re-adjust.

    Birdman
     
  20. jwise

    jwise Formula Junior

    Apr 2, 2003
    781
    Portland Maine
    Thanks for not naming names ;) Yep- that was me.

    Seriously- it worked on my car. Like you said, bleed her again after the drive and I bet you will be fine.

    Also, make sure you do a bedding procedure. Porterfield must have a procedure they like.

    jwise
     
  21. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    I wasn't going to name names!! Anyway, no big deal. They brake well enough that I have 98% of the air out. One more bleed and it will be fine. I have to put the car on the lift again for the new shocks, the front brake decals and to inspect the fittings again anyway.

    Birdman
     
  22. synchro

    synchro F1 Veteran

    Feb 14, 2005
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    The key to the parking brake is pad alignment.
     
  23. hanknum

    hanknum Formula 3

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    Here's what I received from Porterfield regarding "bedding" the brake pads:


    Henry,

    Just install and drive normally for the first two days or 100miles they
    will
    bed themselves in. After that you can drive harder on them. Just try to
    avoid stops from 60-0mph some people do this to see how good they work
    but
    this can thermal shock the pads and then they will squeak and it will
    take
    several miles to get the glaze off.

    Thank you,
    Wendy


    This is straight from the source. Anyone have any comments? Otherwise, I'm gonna slap 'em in there and drive.

    Henry
     
  24. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    Sounds good to me!!!!
     
  25. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

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    I just realized that I never officially "ended" this thread with a final summary.

    I bled the brakes again, got a little more air out, all is fine, pedal is firm. I bedded the pads by driving and stopping. Funny how that works! (I didn't do anything special, just drove the car and used the brakes as normal. After a tankful of gas, they gripped a tad better and I assume they are "bedded." I re-adjusted the parking brake and it's fine too. The gap on the rear pads is very very important. You need to set the parking brakes with a feeler guage, and you may need to tweak them after the first drive when the pads settle a little. That's what I experienced anyway. I set them with the feeler, did a drive and the parking brake handle was coming up too high and not fully grabbing the rotors, so I set them again with the feeler. Now they hold pretty well actually.

    And my analysis of the new lines?

    Honestly, they feel the same as the stock ones. I can't tell the difference. The only thing I got out of it was peace of mind, knowing that I have new brake lines. The OEM rubber ones looked old and nasty. The rubber was all hard and crusty, and they just didn't look reliable. I expected an improved feel to my brakes with the new lines and I didn't really get much change, at least that I can notice. I'm no Michael Schumacher...this is a street car that I drive on nice days, so I am not one that will notice extremely small changes, espcially considering that it was spring before I really got a chance to drive it again and bed the brakes. So now it's a year after the installation and the lines are still fine, no leaks. As a follow up, I still have my yellow Ferrari logo stickers on the brake calipers front and rear and they look great, have not unstuck, burned up, or fallen off. But again, I'm not a track guy, so my brakes don't get worked that hard.

    That's about it!

    Birdman
     

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