308GT4/Mondial 8/Mondial QV comparisons

I own a 1975 308 GT4… but before I owned that, I did get to experience a Mondial 8, 3.2, and T, as well as a 308 GTSi and GTS QV. So, I got to drive a number of different Ferraris before I landed on a GT4. And I chose the GT4 for a reason.

In general, they were all good cars. At the time, I didn't know any of the "known issues" or "common problems" or anything like that, I was literally trying to find out which car I enjoyed the most. For me, that was the GT4. It offered everything I was looking for in a Ferrari: fun, excitement, looks, and character. I honestly thought the GTSi and the Mondial 8 were "sluggish" in comparison to the others, but I didn't think they were bad. I found the GTS cars (both of them) more cumbersome to drive than any Mondial or the GT4.

I'm no expert on any Mondial or GTS/GTB, but now I know a lot about the GT4 (maybe not expert level yet), but I just enjoyed the GT4 much, much more than the others.

Just my opinion. However, I would own a Mondial and GTS if given the chance!

 

GT4 / Mondial.

If the latter, I'd go cabrio. Fun for the whole family.

https://ringofcolour.com/en/archives/39099

 

I’ve owned a 1977 GTB, 1980 GTSi, 1982 Mondial 8 and now, a 1978 GTS.

My opinion only is my disclaimer based on separate ownership:

The GTB and GTS were/are the best cars because of that Weber whistle.

The GTSi was the most user friendly mostly due to FI; I really enjoyed it.

The Mondial 8 was the funnest to drive. It was also nice because it didn’t draw attention like the others.

 

The 308 GT4 spent decades as the b**tard child of Ferrari.

It was designed by Bertone rather than Pininfarina.
It was an off the shelf design that had previously been rejected by Lamborghini for their Urraco (Look at them side by side and see the similarities)
It was a 2+2, and not a 2 seater.
It started off being badged as a Dino, rather than as a Ferrari.

For many, many years, it was the cheapest way into Ferrari ownership.

It was unloved, it was uncool.

Then, around 10 years ago, something quite weird happened - So weird, it was worthy of an episode of the X-Files!

In a motoring equivalent of Han's Christian Anderson's: "The Ugly Duckling", the 308 GT4 went from being ugly and unloved the one day, to being cool the next day.

Nobody can explain how or why it happened - One day people just woke up and the 1970's design just looked cool!

Up until this period, the Mondial edged out the 308 GT4. Even the Mondial 8, who's performance was quite woeful compared to the 308 GT4's, was seen as the better, more attractive option.

The performance of the later Mondial's improved, first with the 3.0 (actually a 2.9 litre) QV cars, then with the 3.2 cars, and ending with the 3.4 Mondial T's, but they still didn't set pulses racing in general.

One issue with the Mondial has always been its proportions. Because of it's 2+2 layout, to achieve the required headroom in the rear, and keep the design looking reasonably coherent, the roof-line had to be raised higher than was ideal. This compromise can make even tall drivers look short in the car, and driver's tend to look like they're sitting too far forward in the car. This is a big reason why the convertible Mondial's look better to many, than the coupe's - No high roof-line with the soft top down.

The fact is, the Mondial is a better car than most people give it credit for.

Sure the Mondial 8 is lacking in performance (and always was, even when new), but it's still far more interesting to be out and about in, or heading to a "Cars and Coffee" event, than most other cars for the same money.

The QV/3.2/3.4 Mondial's are even better still, and right now, they still offer good value for money when it comes to owning a Ferrari.

Will they one day be as cool as a 308 GT4? - Hard to say. One good thing is, if they aren't ever as cool as a 308 GT4, prices will always remain affordable, and those "in the know", will be able to buy and enjoy a great car that flies under the radar!

 

I currently own a '75 GT4 and an '82 Mondial 8. The Dino is an amazing machine that starts up every time and goes like hell. The Mondial is a piece of **** that never wants to run right and has countless gremlins all the time. I don't even try to drive the Mondial anymore, it sits in storage waiting for the day that it's worth enough to pass along to someone who wants to spend the money to get it running/keep it running.
You can guess which one gets my vote!

 

I think I found you a Mondial 8 ^

 

To toss in my two cents I think there is a lot of over-defense in regards to the GT4 these days. As far as I remember it was never considered a "bastard child" or particularly unloved or disparaged. There was the GT4 and there was the GTB/S and the GTB/S just happened to be more popular. Part of that obviously was the 2+2 nature of the GT4. The GTB/S was seen as the true successor to the popular 246 and if you look carefully at the history it appears that all of them were originally intended to be badged as Dinos but economic conditions at the time changed that. There certainly was a market for a 2+2 though as Lamborghini and Maserati also produced models and the GT4/Mondial continued in production up until 1993. So the idea that it was hated is a myth in my opinion.

 

They were probably "hated" by the same group that ignorantly claim that without 12 cylinders it isn't a Ferrari.

That is without a doubt one of the most absurd, ill informed comments one can make about the brand. Nothing could be further from the truth.

 

I think GT4 falls in the same type of situation as the Porsche 996—it was the first water-cooled 911, the first 911 that didn't use the original chassis, the first 911 that didn't have round headlights, and the first 911 that was mass-produced. Just like the 308 GT4, the 996 got a lot of positive press, both cars were still dogged for their design/appearance. I happen to have both a 996 and a GT4, I guess I'm just a glutton for punishment. There are people who harbor strong negative opinions of both cars, even to this day (believe me, I've encountered them), despite the fact that both cars are strong, solid, and everything their respective brands meant for them to be.

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Completely agree with that assertion!

 

I had a Mondial 3.2 and now have a GT4. Both terrific, I’d happily own another Mondial. These cars have tremendous character that almost nothing else can approach, at least for me. Maybe a carb Boxer, old 911, Muira, 250 SWB, Espada or LP400. That’s about it. I’m totally fascinated by mine.

 

Totally unbiased opinion

- My father has owned and driven a '76 Euro GT4 for over 30 years, then totally restored it a few years ago. I did get to drive it too, occasionally
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- I have owned for 13 years and driven close to 100k mls in '83 Euro Mondial QV, then totally restored it recently.
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The Dino is compact, firm, demanding, wants and needs to be driven, looks fantastic outside, has a beautifully stylish dashboard, sounds intoxicating, has quite some punch (ours has bigger carbs and apparently a special Ansa muffler that doesn't do what its name says), is hard to get in and out, only admits up to teens in the back, has just sufficient headlight power to actually be driven at night on country lanes, somewhat limited IP illumination. The last one of the carrozzieri-style built cars, with integrated front wings/end, no reasonable way of corrosion protection or keeping water from getting where you don't want it. It's a raw, racy, addictive and stylish driving machine. It also feels somewhat old by today's expectations, is more demanding in terms of maintenance and the controls demand quite a firm grip and push. I would take one any day, but not as a daily driver.

The Mondial on the other hand feels two generations younger, has fine handling when pushed, a superbly tractable and free revving engine that sounds, if totally different from the Dino, great (still mixed intake, mechanical and exhaust notes) and pulls strongly in the second half of the rev band. It's refined and civilised with much improved entry and egress, decent rear seat space, elegantly understated design, actual rear and rear/side visibility, an almost normally functional HVAC and is quite a bit quieter inside. You can even read all the instruments at night and the rear view mirrors work. In the Dino, you cannot not drive. In the Mondial, you can just trundle along uninvolved as long you keep the revs in the Diesel range. Go past 3'500 and it's a surprisingly agile and involving machine that betrays its 2 rear seats and useful trunk. Maintenance is quite simple due to the electronic ignition and fuel injection. I am not regretting one mile I've driven the Mondial. As a daily driver it's great.

PS: This is what it might to do our kids
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Not unloved? - Really?

I guess Hemming's know jack s**t about cars then: https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/1973-80-ferrari-dino-308-gt4

Looks like Haggerty's know nothing either: https://insider.hagerty.com/trends/the-unloved-ferraris/

Autocar's take on the 308 GT4 - "unloved" (But what would Autocar know about cars?): https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/used-cars/best-second-hand-ferraris-used-buying-guide

The 308 GT4 yet again described as being "unloved": http://www.simoncars.co.uk/dino/dino308.html

More "unloved" comments: https://www.sportscarmarket.com/profile/1979-ferrari-308-gt4

Starting to see a theme here: https://jalopnik.com/the-death-of-a-dino-308-gt4-1767844837

Hmmm......Another "unloved" comment: https://drive-my.com/ferrari-dino-308gt4-vs-ferrari-dino-246gt/

And that's just a small sample of the number of sites that describe the GT4 as being: "unloved"


The 308 GT4 was rated highly for how it drove (it's longer wheel base making it a more stable platform than the 308 GTB/GTS), but it's angular looks were just too much of a move away from the curves that Ferrari had become known for, and it resembled the Lamborghini Uracco far too much, being deigned by the same designer, Marchello Gandini. The 308 GT4 design had previously been offered to Lamborghini, but they didn't want it. Ferrari came calling at Bertone, and Gandini took the Lamborghini rejected design off the shelf, and made it into the 308 GT4.

It struggled in part because it was a 2+2 layout (always an issue with Ferrari's), it was an angular Bertone design, instead of a curvy Pininfarina design (How many cars did Bertone design for Ferrari after the 308 GT4? = None! - Ferrari realised they needed to stick with Pininfarina and curves), and it was originally badged as a Dino, and not a Ferrari.

For several years, the 308 GT4 was the only Ferrari that was officially sold in the USA, and those sales didn't really take off until the Dino badge was replaced with the Ferrari badge (some early cars being fitted with a Ferrari badge on the nose by dealers, to go with the factory fitted Dino badge, to try to help sell the car). The US sales helped make the 308 GT4 a commercial success for Ferrari, but it was never really highly sought after, especially in the used car market.

For decades, the 308 GT4 was the cheapest way into used Ferrari ownership, and not by a slight margin - They were massively cheaper than any other Ferrari model, including the Mondial. Here in the UK at one time, you buy a Mondial QV for @ £10K, or you could buy a 308 GT4 in the same condition for @ £5K (and a 308 GTB for @ £15K)

The fact is, the 308 GT4 was unloved "back in the day", and it was looked down upon (especially the Dino badged cars that weren't seen as being a "real" Ferrari). They were once the cheapest used Ferrari for a reason. To try to deny it, is to try to deny history and reality!

As I say though - Today, the 308 GT4 has suddenly become cool, and good examples are are fetching good money.

 

I was a bit surprised, too, when I read Paul’s comment. I was friendly with an authorized Ferrari dealer when the 308GT4 was introduced and he frequently mentioned the low regard that most “enthusiasts” had for the car. And of course I recall the press was unimpressed, as well. On the other hand, that same dealer’s lead mechanic adopted a GT4 as his daily driver for about ten years, and I considered that a very strong endorsement.

 

Good summary above by 4rePhill covering all the media commentary on the GT4. I seem to remember all Dinos - 246’s included - getting the odd negative remark from “purists” back in the day. 12 cylinder elitism I suppose. Of course the poor GT4 also got a bit ribbed for being a 2+2 Bertone design. I really never gave it any thought having been smitten at a young age by a red GT4. Its all history now anyway so far as the Dinos are concerned. They are so rare, and the GT4’s styling adored for its 70’s futuristic vibe.

 

Phil, you are demonstrating exactly how myths are perpetuated, by citing claims that are repeated over and over with absolutely no supporting data. That's someone's opinion, never was a poll taken or recorded. How about the numbers? There were about 4,000 GT4's built (if you included the 208) and then about 6,000 Mondials (which, let's admit, is the same car) As far as I know, every single one of them sold.

It's true that in 1975 it was misunderstood because people thought "what? this is the new 246 Dino?" but it wasn't, it was a new 2+2 model and that picture above posted by afterburner of his two kids smiling in front of Dad's Mondial pretty much sums up the reason for it's popularity - which continued up until 1993.
it was, in fact, one of Ferrari's most commercially successful models.

The whole "unloved" thing is just a meme that every journalist over the past twenty years has cut and pasted into his bit because it has become practically expected to be there right alongside "not fast by modern standards"

Maybe you should run a poll here. See how many fchat members personally feel "unlove" for the GT4?