RobzWorkz #7: Improving the 328 Coolant System

Greetings again, FChat!

I have just finished improving my 328's coolant system! This includes replacing all flexible connections and hoses, cleaning and checking the water pump and the piping system, replacing WP gaskets, replacing the thermostat and installing a new and improved radiator and fan system (including reconfiguring the air flow around the radiator). As part of the effort, I also restored my chin spoiler (to be shown in another thread) and improved my intake ducts for the intake and oil cooler (shown in this thread).

FYI, my old (original, brass) radiator had significant leaks, so I chose to replace with an aftermarket aluminum one and (later) restore the brass one (to be shared in a later thread). So now, it resides in a box.

Another FYI, earlier, I fully removed my heating system (AC too). Thus you will have to know the heater core lhose ineups to replace the hoses therein. This is easy enough if you know the lineups and can remove and replace conventional hoses.

So, let's begin. First, place the car on jack stands or a lift (review other threads for this one); see pic 1. Then remove the battery cover and battery (pic 2). Afterwards, remove the wheels and wheel well liners (pic 3 for an example). "While I was there" in the driver side front wheel area, I cleaned the horn assembly and insulated its connector (pic 4). Pics 5, 6 and 7 show the other wheel wells.

Afterwards, remove the panels under the chin spoiler and remove the chin spoiler (this may be deferred if you are keeping the radiator in place. Since my chin spoiler was well-worn, I pulled it anyway; this became a project worthy of another thread); see pic 8.

Also, remove the ducts for both the intake and the oil cooler. I found that both needed reinforcing with steel plates riveted into the fiberglass. I also installed grates for the intakes as well (to keep the birds out). See pics 9 and 10. After priming and painting, the both looked great.
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Now, it's time to remove the intake air cleaner (see pic 1; most remove before the right duct). Also, remove the blow-by braided hose that goes under the intake plenum; it will allow more room to replace hose couplings on top of the engine. Additionally, pull out the air injection hose and place out of the way. I like to cover the air intake on the air flow sensor chamber with a towel to prevent non-desired stuff from entering the intake.

Now, remove the sheet metal panel below the steering area (pic 2). Afterward, since I am removing the radiator, disconnect the radiator fans electrically and remove them (pics 3 and 4 show the bolts) by removing the 4 bolts each fan. Pic 5 shows the radiator area with fans removed.

Looking at the radiator, you can see the coolant leakage where paint has dissolved and coolant drops are visible (pics 6 and 7).
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Draining coolant can be a bit messy (pic 1); however, after the effort, I found that draining at the heater hose connection to the radiator return line (pic 2) would be more manageable by simply disconnecting the heater hose itself vice using the radiator drain cock. However, I first started draining from the radiator drain cock (pics 3, 4 and 5; it's the screw on the lower radiator left side as shown in post 2 pic 3 where the wrench is) PRIOR to opening the radiator bleed screw (pic 6) and the thermostat housing bleed screw (pic 7). I found that gradual draining was good for adequate coolant drain control and that opening the expansion tank cap (pic 8) finished the job very well. It would still work best by draining from the heater hose line at the radiator return line. Anyway, after draining, I put all the coolant in an old kitty litter pail, made ready for the recycle station (pic 9).
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Excellent insight Mike1 Since my radiator was leaking, I decided to pursue a method of replacement, while later fixing the radiator itself for my own edification. So far, my effort at fixing the brass radiator has been unsuccessful and is deferred until later. Thus I chose to replace with an excellent Griffin radiator with a single fan unit that would remove more heat than the dual fans of the OEM system.

Please note that, if your OEM radiator and fans are in good order, keeping them is certainly sufficient for engine cooling in all operating conditions.

Rob H.

 

Now it is time to disassemble the cooling network by cutting/loosening/removing the flexible pipe connections in the system. The best way to remove is to loosen the hose clamps and force remove the couplings while disassembling. It may be necessary to slice the couplings to remove; you will make that choice (pic 1). BTW, save your old couplings so as to provide protection for other assembled items (I used old rubber to protect the piping under the intake plenum. Pic 2 shows one of the removed couplings. Pics 3, 4 and 5 show other couplings (note, you will remove the couplings from behind the water pump after removing the water pump assembly).

Pics 6 and 7 show disassembly of the pipe entering the water pump from in front of the (left side of) the engine. Be sure to unbolt the pipe mounts as necessary.
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To remove the expansion tank, remove the bolts with rubber insulators first; then remove the isolator (pic 1) from the rear wall. Then disconnect the coolant sensor electrical connectors (2 tabs). Afterwards, remove the electrical connections to the aux air valve and remove the aux air valve from the expansion tank (two nuts: sorry, no pics of these, but it is easily done). Then remove the hoses attached to the expansion tank...NOTE:there will be remaining coolant, so clean up as needed (pic 2 shows three of the hoses).

Also, it's a good idea to keep the aux air valve connected to its hoses; however, removing a hose connection may be useful to gain access to the system later (be ready and keep track of disconnections). Refurbing the aux air valve is really part of refurbing the fuel system.

FYI, I cleaned out the expansion tank by putting a fistfull of washers and nuts in it and rinsing it out (shaking with the washers/nuts in it removed accumulation therein). After water from rinsing exited clear, I then removed the washers/nuts.

Pics 3-6 show my repainting of the expansion tank. Keep it on hand for reinstallation later. I painted finally with gloss black (unlike other areas in the engine compartment, which were low gloss black).
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To remove the water pump, I first removed the thermostat cover (pic 1). The thermostat remained installed in its housing (pic 2). Then, I removed the thermostat (pic 3). Pic 4 shows the gasket removed. Then, I loosened the hose clamps on the flex couplings behind the water pump (not shown). Then, I removed the water pump housing (includes the thermostat housing section) as shown in pics 5, 6 and 7 (note: only remove the 4 larger bolts to remove the water pump; also, pic 6 shows that I placed newspaper under the water pump to minimize the amount of coolant drips onto the engine timing area). In pic 7, you can see that I removed the housing and retained the flex couplings.

While I was removing the flex couplings from behind the water pump housing and cleaning the area, I found a snail shell (pics 8 and 9). Over the time of my efforts at restoring this 328 (over the last 3 years), I've found many of these shells. I believe they are of California origin, so, if anyone knows about them, please chime in. I personally think they are indicative of the car being in adverse weather in CA. Anyway, I think this is the last one I will encounter since I have thouroughly cleaned everywhere else.

The last pic (10) shows an ensamble of parts removed from behind the interior area.
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To remove the radiator, first be sure to remove the fans (see above); then move the fan wiring out of the way (the wires are attached to the walls in the radiator area with clips and need to be pulled out of the way; see pics 1 and 2). Also, be sure the supply and return pipes have been removed, along with their flexible couplings (see pic 3 where the two pipes were removed from the area where flex couplings were located below the steering rack; BTW, it is necessary to loosen the pipe clamps for holding the two pipes together to remove these couplings...same at the rear clamp area just in front of the engine).

To remove the radiator, remove the clamps at the foot of the radiator on each side as shown in pics 4 and 5. Then remove/loosen the rubber-insulated joints on the radiator at the top of each side (pic 6 and 7). Then remove the upper clamps by removing the two bolts on each (pics 8, 9 and 10).

After removal os all in the way and checking as such, remove the radiator from the car (pics 11 and 12).

Pics 13 and 14 show all the items removed from the front of the car.
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Thanks SMG.
I haven't found indications of rodents and I've refurbed a lot of electronics.
Any other advice?

 

Sorry guys, but I will be going to bed now and returning tomorrow. For now, it's best to say that, after each effort or day of work, clean up areas with 409 on the underside (pic 1) and clean the body paint (I use Meguiar's Final Inspection to clean the pain on the body). Please be aware that coolant will damage paint.
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FYI, when most remove the water pump, it seems that they are either going to rebuild or replace. The symptoms associated with either include:

1. reduced cooling capacity;
2. bearing noise or other wp related noises;
3. coolant weeping through the hole in the body or elsewhere, and;
4. replacement with something better.

Since I was not experiencing any of these, I simply chose to recondition the wp seals and reinstall. I had no play in any of the bearings (even with the belt tensioner), nor any coolant weepage. Since the cooling was sufficient, I felt no need to replace the pump (however, recall that I am replacing the radiator/fan system).

I did replace the thermostat and all gaskets as well as the pump housing O-ring. See next post for that.

After removal, disassemble the system and clean thouroughly, and remove all gasket material with a razor blade (see pics 1 through 4). The fully-cleaned system can be shown in pics 5 and 6.

After all is clean and ready, install the water pump with a new gasket. I used Permatex Ultra Black, and I used fairly liberally (pics 7 and 8). BTW, I had some comments about my application being too much: first, there are no "micro-passages" to worry about like with engine oil passages; in fact, the smallest coolant passages will generally be inside the radiator, which is much larger (> 1 mm) than engine bearing tolerances(<.01" in some places); thus I chose to maximize the amount of sealant without having too much overkill, so I could minimize leakage and galvanic corrosion (steel bolts in aluminum). So, after installing the wp with its housing and gasket, wipe clean with rubbing alcohol; also, note that the housing has flanges in the bolt vias which should be sealed as well (pics 9 and 10). When cleaning, use a paper towel and Q-tips (pics 11, 12 and 13). Use clamps to keep the assembly in place while curing and leave overnight (pic 14).
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As with the wp housing, I used a liberal amount of Ultra Black when installing the thermostat housing. Please see pics 1 through 6. Also, as before, clean thoroughly after assembly with rubbing alcohol, paper towels and Q-tips. Let cure overnight (along with wp housing at same time).

To install the new wp housing O-ring, I first cleaned the passage well with alcohol, and then, using a small amount of Ultra Black, attached the O-ring into its recess (pics 7 and 8). I used a Q-tip to apply the small amount, just to hold the O-ring in place.
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NOTE: AS PART OF INSTALLING THE WATER PUMP HOUSING ONTO THE ENGINE, I REPLACED THE FLEXIBLE COUPLINGS JUST BEHIND THE WATER PUMP HOUSING (I USED NAPA GOLD FLEXIBLE COOLANT HOSE...USE SAME LENGTHS AS SECTIONS REMOVED); THERE ARE NO PICS OF THESE...SORRY GUYS!

To install the water pump housing onto the engine, as before, I used ample amounts of Ultra Black, especially in areas around the bolt vias and outside the O-ring itself (not inside...see pic 1). Pic 2 shows installed water pump.

One thing I did, that I felt was important to prevent galvanic corrosion and bolt loostening, was to apply some blue Locktite on the wp bolt threads and some Ultra Black on the bolt shanks (pics 3 and 4). When I disassembled, I noticed significant corrosion on some of the bolts (including one of the wp tensioner bolts...so, remove and recondition those as well). Thus my desire to prevent that as well as holding in place. To recondition the bolts, I used a Dremel with a wire wheel.
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FYI, since I removed my heating system, replacing the heater hoses for me consisted only of replacing the hose from the aft engine head to the radiator return line. However, for those interested in improving their heating systems, it would be beneficial to fully-disassemble them (watch for extra coolant and clean up), clean and replace hoses, and, if necessary, the heater cores (pm me if you want to buy mine). The heater assemblies are well-pictured at Ricambi's and Rutland's sites, so use them as a guide. If you remove the heater cores/control valves, clean electronics with alcohol and replace foam areas with new foam (other threads disclose actual foam to use, but I also have used AC rubber tape as insulation for heater cores). Also, it would be good to remove the heater ducts and wash them out (use CA glue to tack on the strings wrapped around the ducts). Also cleaning the heater blowers is recommended. FYI, I have all heater components available for sale...pm me if interested.

FYI, I removed the heating/AC system becouse I felt it was out-dated and the AC interefered with inspecting my engine. Also, I plan to develop a novel AC system using engine heat from the heater hose line. Since I live in GA, heating my interior will not be an issue.

To replace the heater hose from the aft engine head to the front of the vehicle, first remove the hose mount below the engine oil cooler; then cut off the hose next to the engine (pics 1 and 2). Note, you should have already removed the oil cooler duct. Then, attach the new hose to the old one in the rear left wheel well with a coupler and "messenger" the new hose through the left hose route below the driver's door (sorry no pic). Pull the old hose through (old hose is the messenger) enough to obtain enough hose to connect to heating system. You may have to go to front and back iteratively to rout the hose, but it should go through. Pic 3 shows the arrival of my new heater hose (NAPA red silicone), soon to be attached to the front radiator return line. After getting enough host through, install the rear end into the aft head attachment (pic 4). Temporarily mount the hose with its clamp below the engine oil cooler (pic 5: you will have to remount when reinstalling the oil cooler duct after everything else is completed).
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Since I am replacing my radiator with a Griffin aluminum, I will be showing this vice showing how to restore your OEM brass radiator. FYI, my OEM radiator had leaks and I tried to braze to fix, which was unsuccessful because I did not have silver solder available; I only had bronze, which was too hot to use on used brass (it worked well with fresh brass). When I care to later, I will repair my brass radiator and present my work in another post. However, I will show a primative method to test your radiator for leaks (using my Griffin).

To prepare your OEM radiator, first clean the outside well by scrubbing with a bristle brush. Then use pressurized air to flush out the fins from both sides. Fill with water and flush well (forward and back). With radiator filled with water, do a basic pressure test (see pics). Then reinstall into the car (installation is basically the reverse of removal; just be sure to wait to tighten everything until after all fasteners are finger-tight installed...then tighten into place. Don't forget to recondition the rubber parts (I clean well and lube with oil or WD-40) and, if necessary, replace the side foam (I use AC rubber tape, which has been successful for me).

First, see my new Griffin radiator (pic 1)!!! I chose to test it for leaks just for fun. First, place the radiator on a surface flat with the inlet/outlet pipes up. Then fill with water (pics 2 and 3). Then pressure test (I found this method online): to do this, acquire a basic bycicle inner tube (16" wheel with large tube diameter works well...pic 4); cut the tube and clamp rubber to close the outlet (pic 5); cut the tube section with the valve and clamp onto the inlet pipe (pic 6); inflate and monitor (tighten clamps if necessary...tire gauge was unessential...pics 7 and 8); if it stays pressurized for 30 min, it should be good; if not, try tightening the clams and doing again; if still not, investigate for leaks. FYI, this is not a system pressure test, but it should reveal leaks.

FYI NOTE 1: you will notice that the Griffin radiator has a radiator cap installed. I deliberately chose a cap which had a relief pressure significantly higher than the expansion tank pressure of 0.9 (or 1.1) bar. Thus I do not have to install an additional expansion tank up front.

FYI note 2: installing the Griffin was specialized enough for me to NOT document here. I had to fabricate clamps and use rubber hoses, etc. to seal up to the car's opening so as to maximize cooling. If you want details, I will advise accordingly. Just install your radiator as necessary to work. BTW, I actually had to use two special radiator elbow hoses to attach the pipes to the radiator (these were HPI silicone hoses purchased off ebay and the work great); additionally, I had to cut down my radiator inlet pipe (the black one) to fit the elbow there. Thus I had to spend "quality time" to effectively install my new radiator; it wasn't a chore, and it was worth it, but it could pose confusion for those conducting a basic, OEM, refurb.
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Sorry Fchat, but I really don't have pics on this. However, in concept, it's real easy; just attach all piping with their new flex couplings.

In reality, the practice can be quite frustrating. When attaching couplings, emplace clamps very loosely and connect the pipes without tightening. Sometimes it is useful to lubricate the flex couplings with spit D yea, that stuff from your mouth...very lubricious without adverse chemicals and usually readily available ). Also, it's best to fully assemble all parts prior to tightening so as to be able to move things around and out of the way of moving parts and items which may chafe the couplings. Three areas posing the most challenge to me were:

1. the coolant pipe located in front of the engine timing area; be sure there is plenty of room between any belts and pulleys and the piping and couplings; after positioning, then install and tighten the pipe clamp ring to the alternator bracket (pic 1);

2. around the shift shaft near where the longitudinal pipes are located; I placed old pieces of rubber to protect the area as well (pic 2...prior to initial removal);

3. the pipe from the water pump on the left side of the engine, especially the hose connected to the expansion tank (pics 3 and 4); to gain access, remove the oil filter; then move the hoses for the blow-by and air injection systems out of the way (they may need to be removed); there is a pipe clamp to hold down the pipe to the engine block; I also put some old rubber to protect the pipes from heat and chafing.

After instaling and replacing any final hoses, button up the system and make ready for filling. Be sure everything is tightened well all around. Also be sure to reinstall the expansion tank with new hoses and attach electrical connections. Reinstal items previously removed like the fans (and radiator fan switch), the oil filter and the aux air valve. DO NOT REINSTALL THE OIL COOLER/INTAKE DUCTS NOR THE AIR FILTER ASSEMBLY UNTIL AFTER FILLING AND TESTING [AND CERTAINLY NOT ANY OF THE WHEEL WELL PANELS].

Reinstall the battery at this time.

As a bonus, in the next post, I will show pics of my newly-installed Griffin radiator, HPS coolant coupling elbows and the fan (GM) and thermal switch (has a probe installed in the radiator fins). All of these items were obtained from Summit Racing. In the pics, you will see various brackets and rubber insulators used for the setup.

Also, in order to install both the fan and radiator and retain the proper air flow out of the front bonnet, I had to design and install custom-shaped baffles. These can be seen in the pics as well. FYI, prior to installing the baffles, I drove the vehicle for a test and the interior got up to 137 degrees in the cabin...don't take your girlfriend out until all the air flows around properly .
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As said before, I installed a new Griffin radiator witha a new fan/switch and HPS coolant elbows. In order to do this, I had to cut down the radiator supply line (the black one). Also, in order to re-establish good air flow through the front bonnet, I removed the top front fiberglass panel (the one shaped like the spare tire with the top seal to the bonnet), and rebuilt the baffle to direct air flow. Materials were sheet aluminum with one steel angle for the new seal area to the bonnet and the fan and radiator brackets were fabbed from steel. I unsulated with Ultra Black and weatherstrip adhesive, painted with etching primer, then low gloss black engine enamel. I used rubber AC tape to make the bonnet seal better. Assembly was with pop-rivets. This should last many years. After installing all and driving, all worked superbly!!!

Please enjoy the pics!
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Now, be sure everything is replaced and installed as desired. The battery should be installed. Again, wait on installing the oil cooler and intake ducts, intake filter assembly and wheel well panels. Now's the time to fill the system with coolant and test it.

To fill when cold (DUH, no engine heat yet!), it's best to open the radiator bleed screw and the thermostat housing bleed screw. Set heating valves to open by setting for max heat. Place ample WHITE paper towels around both openings and monitor them while filling. Begin filling at the expansion tank with adequate 50/50 mixed coolant. The first place coolant should emerge is at the radiator bleed screw; when the paper towels get wet, close the radiator bleed screw tight. BTW, if coolant shows up elsewhere, mitigate the leak before continuing to fill. After that, coolant should emerge at the thermostat housing bleed screw opening; when that happens, close that bolt tight (no torque specs here, but tight is estimated at about 5ft-lb--13mm wrench hand-tight). After that, continue filling untill you see coolant remain in the expansion tank. The spec is coolant level at about 6cm below the fill spout.

After this filling effort is done, check for leaks and mitigate them. Initial filling is done. Note: there may be some air trapped in the heater area...don't worry; that is why you will run the engine and pressurize and make up coolant after heating it up.

Now is time to test and make up coolant in the system. PREPARE THE ENGINE FOR RUNNING: battery connected; intake air open to atmosphere...BE SAFE AND AWARE!!!

Close the radiator cap and start the engine. Monitor temperature (ideally with an IR thermometer). Continuously check for leaks; if any show up, turn off the engine and cool down and fix. While engine is running, feel/check for heatup to open the thermostat, admitting hot coolant to the radiator inlet. Monitor temp gauges and engine heat with thermometer (best place to measure with thermometer is at inlet on the black part of the pipe); if coolant gauge or thermometer reads > 230 degrees F, stop engine, let cool, and check for leaks, trapped air and other problems. Engine fans should start at about 180-190F (read manual for exact, but don't expect a perfect temperature response) and stop at around 150-160F.

If all goes well and fans turm on and off, stop engine and let cool down. Make up coolant in expansion tank to reach the 6cm below inlet mark. This should fill the system very well so that all you need to do is make up coolant until it stays at a steady level. It may take a couple of times depending on trapped air (esp. in the heating system). This should be sufficient to get the system full and at pressure.

For some, it may be necessary to allow for a hot pressurization of the system. This is done at temperature when the thermostat is open (>140 degrees F). Get some gloves and a thick rag. While the engine is running and hot with thermostst open, crack open the radiator bleed screw until coolant exits...then close tight. After that, crack open the bleed screw at the thermostat housing until coolant emerges, and tighten shut (you will need a 13mm wrench for this bolt).

Properly filling and pressurizing should take only one or two make-up fills at the expansion tank. If you find it necessary to make-up more than 1-3 times, depending on your skill and system, check for leaks and mitigate. Worst case would be something wrong at the engine (not assessed in this operation); normal case would be tightening clamps and other boundaries (water pump, etc). Nominal pressurization is 0.9 bar (13.1 psig). Some like to use the 1.1 bar expansion tank cap (16 psig). Both should work well (BTW, for those concerned that my Griffin radiator has a cap, I provided with a 16+ psi cap to ensure that the 0.9 bar expansion tank cap opens only).

After a successful test, go ahead and prepare the car for driving; reinstall oil cooler and intake ducts; install intake air filter w/assembly and install wheel well panels and anything else. Lower the car to the ground by lowering your lift or removing the car from jack stands. Then go drive and monitor engine temps and ensure normal operation.

That's it FChat!

Enjoy!


BTW, as an interesting update, see the pics of my newly-installed duct grates...woo hoo! Also shown is my rejuvinated front spoiler/vent assembly.
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Excellent catch, Chris. There was a significant gap above the radiator: I installed a bracket which could hold a long piece of coolant hose in there to block it (NAPA white stripe...cheaper than gold stripe)...should last forever. There was no significant gap below the radiator, especially since the chin spoiler is close and the airway directed into the radiator. I also placed sections of rubber hose in areas to cushion and keep the radiator in place.

 

No real difference in cooling capacity between the two radiators, but the new radiator was <$300.00US and about 1/3 the weight. You can still use the OEM fans, but you will need to make brackets and get a new thermal switch (<$50.00US). You will also need to find ways to fill the gaps (I used a long piece of coolant hose for the top gap). I chose the new fan since it had greater cfm than the OEM fans together. I also didn't care about retaining the OEM spare tire area, since I will be designing a novel AC system and putting it there vice the space-saver spare. It was a fun project.

Thanks for the feedback,
Rob H.