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328 died and wouldn't restart

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by sideways1, Jul 1, 2006.

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  1. sideways1

    sideways1 Rookie

    Apr 19, 2006
    26
    Sacramento, CA
    Full Name:
    Dylan
    #1 sideways1, Jul 1, 2006
    I was driving my 1987 328 B tonight and it shut off like the key was turned off. I tried to restart and it would just turn over and not fire, I couldn't smell fuel. I had no tools but I did have two relays and replaced both of the fuel pump/pump-starter relays and checked fuse. I tried it again and no fire, let it sit for awhile and it fired up and ran for about a mile then same thing. One thing to note I noticed earlier that the tach was not responding as it should (very slow and not keeping up with true engine speed). I started it and did the 1 mile run two times. I can't feel the pump run when the key is turned on or engine cranked. Any ideas? This sucks since I was going to the breakfest meeting in Sacramento tomorrow morining and I've only owned (first F-Car) it for ONE WEEK. Please help if you can. Fuel Pump???????????? Fuse Box??????
     
  2. rickyx

    rickyx Karting

    May 9, 2006
    117
    #2 rickyx, Jul 1, 2006
    It happened once to me that the car shut off suddenly while I was going through a corner. Lack of oil (pressure) was the cause. Luckily the car shut down otherwise I would have ruined the engine.
    Do you have enough oil (pressure) in your engine?

    Ricky
     
  3. sideways1

    sideways1 Rookie

    Apr 19, 2006
    26
    Sacramento, CA
    Full Name:
    Dylan
    #3 sideways1, Jul 1, 2006
    Yes, no problem with oil pressure. It won't fire right up like it does every other time I started it until tonight. But if you let it sit long enough it will run for about one min. or so.
     
  4. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
    Vegas+Alabama
    Full Name:
    Mr. Sideways
    #4 No Doubt, Jul 1, 2006
    Did you hear a sound similar to poker cards getting stuck in a fan (thrrrrrummp) when the engine stopped?
     
  5. carlrose

    carlrose Formula Junior

    Nov 25, 2003
    324
    #5 carlrose, Jul 1, 2006
    Hi Mr. Hill,

    Just a moment here before I have to run: the tach signal is derived from (as I recall) the posterior flywheel sensor (you may be getting an errant signal). Possibly heat-related phenomenon.

    Best,

    :) Carl
     
  6. wolftalk

    wolftalk Formula Junior

    Jan 27, 2004
    367
    san franciso area
    Full Name:
    phil
    #6 wolftalk, Jul 1, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    As a quick check, you can use an ohmeter on the diagnostic connector
    between pins 4 and 5 (see attached pic). You should get around 750 ohms, but anything 600-1000 is ok.

    Ideally, unbolt the ignition ecu plate (drivers side trunk under carpet) and take off the ecu connector plug, then measure between pins 1&2 for the TDC sensor, and pins 3&16 for the rpm sensor (see attach again). That'll check all the connectors along the way, and you can check the ecu ground while there.

    the flywheel sensors connect to the ecu through a plug. It's the little black 4 pin one attached to a bracket on the oil cooler duct (under the upper oil cooler line where it attaches to the cooler and below a bigger connector). Piece-o-cake through the wheel well with liner removed, but you can get to it from above....however, it'd opt for checking at the ecu connector.

    If you take out the 4 pin connector, you should get the about the same values on two sets of pins. If I remember right, that connector has two male and two female pins in it. Measure across the pins of the same sex. That'll give you values for both the TDC and the rpm pickup sensors.

    There's another connector near one of the the sensors. Pretty much under the oil vapor recovery canister on top of the bell housing. Follow the plastic ribbed cable cover to get to find it.

    The fuel pump runs when cranking or when air is getting sucked through the intake. You can bypass the safety by unplugging the blue connector on top of the fuel distributor. The pump will then run with the key in the on position.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  7. Meister

    Meister F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 27, 2001
    5,516
    Duluth, MN
    Full Name:
    The Meister
    #7 Meister, Jul 1, 2006
    I had my fuel pump die on me 50 yards out of my driveway a couple of years ago. Start with the simplest things first... fuel, air, spark.

    Once I got the car back to the garage, I unhooked the large rubber hose that goes into the plenum. I sprayed a few seconds of strarting fluid directly into the plenum, cranked it over and the car would run for 5 seconds or so. This simple test told me I still had spark but wasn't getting fuel. Ordered new pump, replaced most of the fuel lines while I was in there and haven't had a problem since.

    Good luck.
     
  8. sideways1

    sideways1 Rookie

    Apr 19, 2006
    26
    Sacramento, CA
    Full Name:
    Dylan
    #8 sideways1, Jul 1, 2006
    Thanks Phil, I will check this out. I had to get some sleep since I didn't get it home until early this morning. It is so low we had to rope tow it. I didn't want a tow truck driver tearing the front off my car.
     
  9. sideways1

    sideways1 Rookie

    Apr 19, 2006
    26
    Sacramento, CA
    Full Name:
    Dylan
    #9 sideways1, Jul 1, 2006
    Well, I removed the blue connector at the fuel dist. and got under the car and hit the pump and got it to work so it must be the pump. I still have a few questions.

    1 Do I replace the accumulator when I do the pump?

    2 Phil you said to check so wires that aren't at my ECU. I have wires 2 4 5 6 7 8 12 15 16 and that's it. The unit has Jettronic on it is this right? Location P/S trunk area.

    3 Where is the best place to source Parts for this in Sacramento area?

    4 I still need to test the tach once I get her running.

    Thanks again to all of you, this is a great site..............
     
  10. wolftalk

    wolftalk Formula Junior

    Jan 27, 2004
    367
    san franciso area
    Full Name:
    phil
    #10 wolftalk, Jul 2, 2006

    take off the vent line leading up from the accumulator. If you don't find fuel in it, the accumulator is ok. It's just a big can with a spring-loaded diaphragm. The normal failure is tear/leak in the diaphragm, which results in fuel making it behind the diaphragm and out the vent.

    that's the fuel injection ecu. The ignition ecu is same place, but drivers side.


    I think http://www.ferraripartsexchange.com/ is out near sacramento someplace, and I vaguely recall seeing a salvage yard that has some exotics.
    I usually get stuff from GT car parts (623-780-220), trutlands, ricambi, or rockauto.com.

    check the voltage at the fuel pump before replacing it, and verify the connections are solid. If you have to replace it, this thread has good info:
    http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=70515&highlight=328+fuel+pump

    note the pump is standard bosch...unless you gotta have a yellow box with horses, it's usually best to shop around for the parts. Problem is that none of the big chains have ferrari in their databases, so you usually are going by oem part numbers, and that means going to a parts place that knows what they are doing (i.e. they can cross reference things).
     

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