328 to 308

I went from a '82 308 to a '85 308 QV and IMHO I also favor the more classic less plastic interior of this era car but like the drivability and easy starting of FI. I had a multi-carb Jag E-type 1969 and yes they have their charm but what a PITA, synchronizing carbs, points to gap, jetting to change when going "in the mountains". Kinda like why go for stick when they have automatics? Well, some of us have a prefrence. You might want to consider an '80s FI and still have the classic leather and chrome interior without the difficulties of carbs. From the reading that I do on this forum there is no doubt a unique sound,smell,etc with these cars but I also read that parts are getting harder to find. That may be something to consider too. Having been there with multi-carb setups I really do admire those that have them and learn to make them work. When they, do they sing. Tradeoffs, it's all about tradeoffs. Good luck which ever way you go.

 

The build quality and detailing on the early (although 1979 is right on the cusp...LOL!) carbed cars is NO comparison to the later fit and finish of the QVs and 328s, IMO.

I see a pristine injected car at my service shop and it's like a car from another manufacturer!

Part of it surely the age and use factor of the older cars, but even among my early examples they "did it this way" on one, but "used this fastener" on another, and details like weatherstripping and windows has a restless evolution to them.

That said I obviously prefer the driving experince of the earlier engines.

Loud, smelly....fast....isn't that why you want one???

Someday maybe I'll 'sand all the rough edges out' but truthfully that's how the early ones look, when compared to later versions.

HTH

 

3 years and $5,000.00 to get my carbs and distributors from "misfire" to 'running right'.

Now they are newer, but the body was left outside, giving corrosion and mildew a head start!!

 

I would agree with Big Tex, the quality really stepped up as the model continued, with the 328 being a comprehensive re-do of all the 308 weak spots (electrical, ignition, rust proofing, window mechanisms, cooling, etc.)

As far as internal styling, it's a mixed bag. I always thought the "extruded pasta" 308 door panels were pretty ugly and the 328 door panels among the best ever in a modern-ish Ferrari, but the 308 plastic toggles are classier than the plastic knobs in the 328. The 328 stitched dash is much nicer, but the orange gauges are kind of '80s. The 308 console sags over time. 328 switches are expensive, 308 switches seem easier to find. Etc.

Seeing as you're in Oz, you could presumably avoid the U.S.-spec 308s, which would spare you our crappy bumpers and smog equipment. That makes a 308 more attractive than it is here in California.

But if I were to get back into Ferrari ownership now at that price level I'd probably go for another early 328 GTS. I just have zero patience for cars that don't start and run properly whenever I want to take a drive. The quality of the 328 was probably Ferrari's high watermark.

 

I think you are right I was assuming a '79 in Oz would be a NON CAT 'good cam" example.

I'm not sure about the other specifications but recall Euro GTBs were NON CAT dry sump thru 1980.

 

There's a 99 point restored example of a North American 1979 308GTB at Sphere Motorsports.

If I give him my correct Paint Code sticker, it would be a 100 point car.

No telling how much money was spent, but it's beautiful.
I guess that's how I would get there.....I just try to keep 'em running!

Like you I'd much rather hear it crank on the first try, and worry about paint and trim down the road. Makes me pretty much a pariah at FCA functions, tho.....

The kids on the street love me, that's all that matters.

 

The AUS Fiberglass GTBs (left) were much like mine (right); wet sump and air pumps...
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My 1976 Fiberglass is noticeably asymmetric. Those guys in the Factory must have had a hell of a time putting it together. Things improved when they switched to steel.

 

From a driving experience perspective, which is very important of my Ferrari ownership. The 328 is more civilized and the 79 carbed 308 is raw. They are very different. It all depends on how do YOU use the car. Have one of each if you can...
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Exactly how I feel ...

...The difference between a 308 GT4 and 328 GTB is HUGE. They are totally different cars. Personally, I like the 328 more, but the GT4 gives more tactile feedback.

 

i have a 76 glass carb - 4 yrs plus ownership, never an issue with carbs - it actually starts better than my injected TR when they are cold.

The 308 carb is much different than the 328 - i had a TR already, so for me , it was an obvious choice to go for a carb 308 - if you like the raw primative feel , then the carb is the way to go - it truly is a throw back to back in the day. If you really like the luxury and comfort more, then stay with your 328. They are two very different cars - trust me.

 

I went from early-87 US 328 to 83 Euro 308 then to late-87 US 328. There were big differences even in my 87s - the late one having a big jump in fit and finish as well as feel for the controls.

I went from 328 to 308 because of the better looking (IMHO) Euro 308. The engine was also more revvy. I would not go from 328 to a US 308. I then went back to 328 because of the specific 328's condition and driveability. I would have easily spent the difference in value between the two to get the 308 the same level of the 328.

Re carbs: my days of carbs might be behind me unless they are in a 50s or 60s historic Ferrari or Porsche race car. In the street, the relatively instant driveability and smoothness of the FI win out over the carbs. Just a preference with my driving lifestyle...

 

IMO, you have to really want to own a carbed car, have to love to tinker or pay to have someone tinker. Cant beat the sound.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4Mqj1B1CfU[/ame]

 

But I agree with Leslie, own one of each (like him)
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I owned a 1987 328 GTS and then a 1977 Euro dry sump 308 GTB. Hands down the 308 GTB was WAAAY more fun to drive - far more engaging, sounded much better, lighter, just as quick, MUCH better throttle response, just a far superior driver's car. The 328 was simply too refined for me. But...to each his own. I actually like the 308 QVs more than the 328s, as they are more of a sportscar than the 328 (which I feel leans towards being a GT car) and, accordingly, maintain a pretty raw feel, though not to the degree of a carb car.

Also...If you purchase a "U.S." carb car, you MUST remove all of the insulation crap from the airbox. I drove a U.S. 308 GTS last week and I could not even hear the carbs through the passenger-side air intake, nor anywhere else. In my GTB, that induction roar was LOUD!

 

when my 911 or 328 sells I am going to get another euro spec QV. I wont own another 2v carb car unless its had the sodium valves replaced.

I have had 5 carb 308s, so for me its been there , done that with carbs.

 

First I a bought a '87 328, than a ''83 308 Qv and than a carbed 308 from '78

No downsides. IMHO these cars should not be compared but taken as they are. What's the point in comparing?

Trully, i never sit on one of them thinking that "this or that" is better with that car. Never.
It simply never crossed my mind comparing

 

On the subject of carbs vs injection, has anyone ever converted a carb 308 to a modern pulsed injection using separate throttle bodies? That would give the best of both worlds, great response and the same sound but without the fiddling around of carbs.
I did that in a Lotus Esprit several years ago with great results.
Its a big conversion though as a circulating fuel system has to be installed, and crank sensors, and setting up the ignition and fuel curves etc on a laptop takes a while to get right, but once done it stays working.

 

Scott,

Just a minor point, but...I think your comparison is not entirely valid; you should not compare a 328 GTS to a 308 GTB.
The only viable comparison would be a 328 GTB to a 308 GTB, or a 328 GTS to a 308 GTS.

I am ashamed to repeat myself, but I own two 328, a GTB and a GTS; the two cars are both 1989, with a production date only five weeks apart: they are as identical as possible, but believe me, they give a VERY different driving feel: even to a driver of very modest abilities, as I am, the "B" is sharpier, lighter, stiffer, more responsive and much more precise to drive fast, especially in succession of tight curves.
Any "S" gives you the feeling of being more a "GT" than a true sports car, compared to a "B".

Whenever the time is right, and I have a specific road in mind, to have a real drive, I always, always end up with the keys of the "B" in hand. The "B" still has the DNA of a true sports car. All my speeding tickets are stamped "328 GTB"...

 

from persoal experiences i can provide;

sound: carbs slightly better but more depending on your exhaust
interior: i will take an old one with the chrome levers over the 328 any day
performance; take a 328
overall quality: well the're are all italian from well before turn of the millenium but take a 328 or Qv for reduction of trouble. From model 1984 zinc plated body

looks: do what i did and keep them all

 

I stumbled across my car but it to me is the essence of a Ferrari. It's kind of raw and doesn't have many frill comfort features. The carb. version has all of the feel of what Ferrari once wanted. As you go into the FI motors and then the quatro you start getting into the modern customers. The 328 continued on that theme with an aim of a different set of buyers. 348 on up to today caters to tradition but improves on creature features. I don't look at my car as a family car but only my car. I enjoy the smell of a slightly rich fuel mixture , the smell of loose oil and the noise of the carbs and exhaust. So if you like the raw car go for the early 308's but if you want some smoother curves and a little more window dressing then move up to the new versions. I also look at the cost of maintenance. As you get newer then you get more costly. I think the cost curve moves up significantly as you move into the 348 and up. Just my thoughts.

 

$5000 for a tuneup ? That mechanic could not know what he was doing, apart from writing invoices!
Neither carburettors nor contactbreaker ignition is rocketscience and tuneup is easily performed by owner with use of simple/cheap tools. You just have to know how -that's a skill that can be accuired Lots of people in this forum have tons of knowledge !!!

The engines is already well designed/engineered, a simple tuneup of carbs and ignition once a year is sufficient unless you do silly miles a year.

When properly tuned -the sound and performance is just addictive !!!

Harald
-77 400
-77 308GTB

 

In fairness to the mechanic (who suffered some medical issues related to a motorcycle crash during the period) it really was a brief directive on my part:

"It's has a misfire.."

As he works for a shop doing total restorations, he then proceeded to 'get it right".

Rebuild all four carbs.
Remove and rebuild both distributors (This is at least $600 x 2, so over 20% of the cost)

Then as the time had grown long, the fuel tanks had to be flushed, he replaced rubber lines as needed.

Add a new set of plug wires...($$$)

Once running the ANSA exhaust was shot, so a phone call and my providing that part (not in the $5K total, about $1,800 more)...so he installed that.

I had to send a detailer over, as the car had begun to grow mildew all over the interior, as it sat outside rusting ($70).

In the end, I was so upset with the damage to the car during this time I just paid the money and threw the paperwork into the pocket..there's a sizable dent in the door trailing edge, looks like a jack handle fell into it.

They told me to "take it easy on the brakes, until the rust cleans off the rotors.."

He's back in the hospital, he was injured totalling his boss's F40.