330 GT 2+2 exhaust - ANSA or Time Valve

I have a time valve system that has kept me in good stead for about 10 years so far. I have heard of Ansa's rusting out in a fraction of that time. They sound similar but not the same by the way. Stebro sounds a bit more like the Ansa but their turnaround time can drag on.

 

In early 2003, I replaced the completely shot exhaust system on my '64 330 with Timevalve because it was all-stainless, at $1K more than an Ansa system. The sound was quite disappointing; in retrospect I'd have gone with the Ansa.

 

i used a timevalve once-on a daytona...it passed visual somewhat closely once jet blacked, however, the sound is not accurate-if this is im portant to you, forget the rust cost and pony up the 5 year rot rates for ansa

 

I put a completey new ANSA on my 330 drilled weep holes never did "warm up starts" which will kill any steel and in spite of that the tips were rotted in 7 years Never again

 

I went stebro ten years ago; other than having to move a couple of the hanger locations, it sounded great and is still on the car. Was also significantly less expensive than the timevalve, as I recall.

 

I would choose the ANSA exhaust all time over some reproduction stainless ...
for me it's the only way to go!

@yale: our Daytona has still the original ANSA exhaust system - the first one - only the rear silencer had to be replaced. Who told you that Ansa's rusting out so badly?

 

Just a note, if I recall correctly, ANSA was not OE for the 4 headlight cars. Is this true?

Regards,

Art S.

PS. flat-12, I told Yale about my ANSA system rotting out so badly.

 

330 4HL's car was built with an Abarth exhaust system. They, to my knowledge, are no longer available, and did have a completely different (much better) sound than the Ansa. Also the comments about the stainless systems sounding different are also true. Usually the stainless systems do not duplicate the signature Ferrari sound made by the mild steel systems.

 

I wonder if the older Ansas were built better than they are currently. My car had a pretty old Ansa system on it when it was rebuilt in 2006 and that exhaust is still in great shape today. If anything I wouldn't mind if it was a bit louder, but it sounds great and the exhaust is still in great shape. The sound is such an integral part of a Ferrari that it doesn't seem like an area to compromise.

 

There is another thread in the vintage section about header paint and it seems like the Jet-Hot ceric coatings are miracle products (incredibly durable and reduce heat transmission). I wonder whether coating a new Ansa with Jet-hot before installing it would make it more durable. Also wonder whether Jet-Hot would affect the sound.

 

Art -Timevalve and Ansa were the two options within reason when I bought my 330 near ten years ago. Aparently prices have taken quite a jump since then; the Timevalve was about $3K including installation, $2K for the Ansa.

 

Art said his Ansa started rusting out in 2 years! And of course just like everything else, an old Ansa system lasted a lot longer then the newly made ones. Let me posit a couple of things about sound. A couple of old V 12 owners compared our exhaust system sounds, my Timevalve, a Stebro and an Ansa. The Timevalve at idle sounded right whereas the Stebro sounded a bit 'motorboaty' however that turned out to be what the Ansa sounded like also.

The thing about the way these systems sound is many times we are comparing the sound of our old Ansa system that came with our cars. In the case of my car, this was basically empty cans strung between pipes as all the packing had rusted and burnt away. It did sound great at speed but it was affecting my hearing. The Timevalve system is a copy of the Ansa but the stainless steel alters the resonance and it doesn't sound the same.

I just had my engine rebuilt and the headers Jet Hotted, and now my engine sounds very different again. Is it the new valves, valve guides and seats? Is it the Jethot coating? I don't know but everything has an effect.

As for Stebro, at least when friends ordered systems from them, they didn't keep any of their delivery promises but they did eventually deliver the system ordered and they were satisfied.

As for other suppliers, Tubi makes a system for the 330GT but they only guarantee it for one year. When I had an issue with the Timevalve a few years after I bought it they fixed it with no qualms. There is also a stainless manufacturer in the UK but I have heard some not so positive things about them.

One other thing about these systems, the resonators under the passenger compartment have heat shields welded to them, may of these systems do not have this. It is something you and your passengers feet will notice.

 

Our "new" Daytona rear silencers are about 5 or 6 or perhaps even 7 years old (sorry I don't know the accurate date), but honestly the silencers still look very nice, couldn't find any rust. It's hard for me to believe that the quality of ANSA exhaust's is so bad.

 

The quality of Ansa components is not bad.

 

Art -- Did you contact Ansa and what did they have to say?

My old 330GT exhaust has held up well, but I remember back in high school (around 1980) when we used Ansa's on Datsun 240Z's and 510's and the durability back then was not great. I suspect they used lower quality for those add-on Datsun exhausts versus what they used for Ferrari OEM. At the prices Ansa charges for the Ferrari system, it should last a long time and it seems like they should have offered a replacement when it failed so soon.

 

ANSA is not...and never has been, stainless.

The ONE thing I have seen about the 'aluminized steel" that they use, is that IF you super heat the unit, with a carb dumping or an ignition problem, you are baking the hell out of the unit.

Once the anti corrioion plating is smoked off, yea....I can see it corroding more rapidly than normal.

Not really a fault of ANSA, (the specifications of the material are clearly stated, in the marketing) but it IS something to be aware of.
Don't cook them!

If you see the muffler can itself going white in the middle, (in the 308GTB crossflow configuration) stop and see what you have going on ...

 

The ANSA exhausts for the 330's are not stainless, so in the relevance of this thread that is not a generalisation but an accurate statement. But my 1974 BB also has an ANSA from 1975 or thereabouts with SS parts (though not fully SS).

They do rust in my experience and even though my car was very, very carefully maintained for 20 years, I had to replace mufflers and exhaust tips recently. I have also seen very bad ANSA exhausts on other 330's. My specialist sources SS mufflers for my GTC - I could have sworn they were Tubi Style but I can find out. I had the mufflers correctly painted so they look identical to the originals. The tips are still ANSA.

I think the way you drive, and particularly park (with moisture left in the tips or not), the car will make a difference, as well as the country that you live in.


Onno

 

Art, Yale, PeterP, Michael

You have all heard my 330, which had a "new" Ansa as of 6 years ago. If the present Ansa production has a different sound than the older Ansa production, it is not obvious to me, although I have never had a careful A vs B comparison. My "new" Ansa probably represents the "older" production - I bought it in '82 and stored it until the engine job. So far no rust-out. And I have driven it a fair amount!

As a note, the Ansa came with threaded spacers welded to the muffler shell for the heat shields to bolt to.

Cheers
Warren

 

after studying and deliberation on exhausts for my 365 GTC/4 I went with the ansa.

I read several comments about construction quality and materials and I can first hand attest to the new "vintage" exhausts they are making are comprised of a combination of stainless and aluminized steel. The website states the systems are aluminized steel without mention of stainless components, but it is infact the case.

The cans themselves are aluminized steel whereas the pipes and tips are stainless.

This threw me for a loop after after studying and deciding on a mild steel system to find the system ansa sent was mostly stainless.

The system sounds fantastic and as close to original sound as I can imagine. It does NOT have the typical tin can stainless raspy sound.

My fear was that I was putting on a system that was sub-par or not the sound I was looking for... this was not the case. It is a well made and well fitting system that required only a little fitting to mount up properly. Sound is incredible.

 

I also put an ANSA system on my Euro-spec 365 GTC/4 last month. The aftermarket stainless steel system that was on the car when I bought it four years ago was in great shape and fit well, but it didn't sound like ANSA (it was a much lower tone--no "shriek"), it didn't look like ANSA (mufflers were unpainted stainless and were about an inch thicker in height) and it was technically incorrect (by-pass tubes were not incorporated, so the by-pass outlets were blocked off at the headers).

It was a bit painful to pay good money to replace a fully functioning system, but it was worth it to regain the originality and the improved sound, and enhance the car's value.

By the way, the ANSA fit was pretty bad. I had to enlarge the holes that mated up with the headers as well as cut and grind the by-pass tubes. Plus, the hangers are off by an inch and a half fore-aft and there's potential interference with the rear suspension. GT Car Parts said that's typical ANSA.

But oh...that sound!!!

 

Bobileff Motorcar Company has been rebuilding Ansa systems out of mild steel with today's internal rust inhibitor coatings for years. You get the original look and sound. Many of the systems that we have done have been installed on cars entered into Pebble and Cavallino, and the Ferrari Nationals. The exhaust is never questioned. Please go to Bobileff Motorcar Company * Ferrari Service & Restoration * Lamborghini Service & Restoration * Maserati Service & Restoration
Gary Bobileff