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330 GTC MARKET VALUE

Discussion in 'Vintage Ferrari Market' started by geno berns, Feb 8, 2013.

  1. geno berns

    geno berns F1 Rookie
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    What's going on with this model in terms of demand and how it's played a roll in the recent increase in the car's valuation. Has this car eclipsed the Daytona in terms of value and desirability? With 50% of Daytona's production numbers and it's more "vintage" feel, is it warranted? Where is this model headed? The next Lusso? Any input will be appreciated.

    Thank you,

    Geno
     
  2. JazzyO

    JazzyO F1 World Champ

    Jan 14, 2007
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    What is going on, I have no idea. That's the easy part of the question.

    Is it warranted to be more valuable? Well, I do think that the 330GTC deserves to sit much closer to the 275 than it has done in the past. I think it is a beautiful, classic Pininfarina design. It has a great version of the Colombo engine with more torque than the 275, the 275 chassis and fantastic handling. If you like to drive, this is probably the best '60ies Ferrari to do a road trip in as it sporty but also GT. Trying to be unbiased but informed as an owner, I would say that a 330GTC deserves to sit at around 2/3 of the value of a 275GTB 2 cam. Of course - the market has never seen it that way, just like the Lusso has not been close to the value of a SWB.

    Should it be worth more than a Daytona? Well that depends on how you look at it. I've never seen a 330GTC on a modern magazine cover, trying to increase sales. I do see the Daytona pop up on a cover at least once a year. The Daytona is much more iconic and well known. For me, the Daytona should be worth a similar amount. More built, but higher demand because of its status.

    If the recent auction results are the foreboding of the new market position, then I think the 330GTC should not go any higher unless everything above it goes higher too. Personally, I don't think those last 2 results (if we count the 365GTC) are really the new status quo. But I do think we're not going back to 2010 prices soon.

    For me, the 330GTC's position was the cheapest ticket into '60ies 2-seater Ferrari world, and I think that's what it should remain. As good as they are, they were never raced and they don't have the strong connection to SWB and GTO that the Lusso has.


    Onno
     
  3. BIRA

    BIRA Formula Junior

    Jun 15, 2007
    889
    I don't think there is any logic, just the flavor of the month and few available. The one sold in Paris had a nice color outside, another Celeste Matalizzato, also flavor of the month, but interior was pretty ugly with wrong leather. But it confirmed the half million dollar status for those dying to get one...
    Btw the other flavor of the month, the Dino , was all over the place. One sold high and the 246GTS a very original 2 owners car reached with pain 220K euro at hammer. All premium goes to silver cars with flares and chairs...
    Again this is a very narrow market, few buyers in spite of all the buzz, and even fewer sellers, and by nature an unstable situation with potentially high volatility.
    May be this is part of the fun!
     
  4. geno berns

    geno berns F1 Rookie
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    Very well put...

     
  5. KenGoldman

    KenGoldman Formula Junior
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    I agree with Onno on this one. Even though we are both 330 GTC owners,
    there seems to be a trend in collecting the Classic Ferraris of the 1960's.

    A Daytona is on the end of the Classic period---but they are
    very hard cars to drive--unless you can go 80 MPH or more. It is very
    difficult to drive a Daytona around local streets--but the 330 GTC
    is very easy to drive.

    I think Phil Hill's comments on the 330 GTC are quite valid today

    Ken Goldman
     
  6. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Texas!
    Haven't GTC prices historically tracked about half Daytona prices? I remember, for example, that ten years ago, a good GTC sold for about $60k and Daytonas went all day long for $120k. When I sold mine in 2008 for $190k, I believe Daytonas were over $400k. Notice that I'm talking about an average car.

    Does this relationship still hold today?

    Dale
     
  7. geno berns

    geno berns F1 Rookie
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    #7 geno berns, Feb 9, 2013
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2013
    Agreed, the very best restored F&C Dinos have been consistent in bringing a high dollar amount with the less desirable GT/GTS none F&C good to average cars being all over the place. $160K-$200K Dinos are still around. I think any vintage Ferrari that comes to market with a $300K-$500K lavished upon it in form of a great restoration will bring an eye popping result. Nothing new there.

    I believe we must be careful about the "flavor of the month" theory. The 330 GTC and the Dino are very special cars and with the current demand it makes full sense that they are doing as well. Including the Daytona, they three are still cheep compared to the coach build Ferraris. So people are jumping on them as they are still affordable to the hundreds of thousands of millionaires around the globe that can spend $500K, but may not want to or be able to afford a $1MM+ Ferrari. Not saying that that's the market pool for these cars. It's a small amount of buyers within that pool that have the means to spend. It's just a good range for the current market place and that's what in my estimation is the driving force behind the recent market results.

    Geno


     
  8. geno berns

    geno berns F1 Rookie
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    #8 geno berns, Feb 9, 2013
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2013
    Two to five years ago the 330 GTC were stagnant at $180-$220K with the Daytonas being all over the place at $200K to $450K for the same period of time. The big gap obviously was based on the range of quality of any one Daytona. The 330 GTC in that time frame (2-5 years ago) were like the Boxers are today. Not much range with with the best ones not bringing much more than the average cars. It seems as soon as a certain model gets the recognition it deserves the appreciation factor together with the wide range in pricing is what's at play.

     
  9. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Texas!
    So, are GTCs currently, say, 2/3s of a same condition Daytona? Or are they both about the same?

    Dale

    PS I have never been able to determine any kind of correlation between the pricing of 330 GTCs and 275s, other than 275s are three to four times more expensive. Have you?
     
  10. Daytonafan

    Daytonafan F1 Rookie

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    Funnily enough this magazine that it trying to launch has a 330GTC on its dummy edition cover! Help Kickstart GranTurismo Magazine | Articles
     
  11. geno berns

    geno berns F1 Rookie
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    If I had to guess, it seems that the two cars are worth about the same IMO. The current GTC owners are unrealistic to what their cars are worth. That can all change with the next few sales where the GTC proves to be worth much more than the Daytona. Just yesterday I learned that the GTC I was offered at $400K 12 months ago is now $625K! This is a very nice car that's available by-owner, so no dealer is involved. However due to the recent GTC sales, the owner is being hounded by several auction houses that are promising him the world. How do you compete with that? I offered $475K, but that's not going to get the deal done...WTF!! Just Crazy IMO...It's like chasing a stock that's out of range and you know you're taking some heavy risk buying it.

    Geno

     
  12. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Texas!
    So GTCs are worth the same as Daytonas? Wow!

    Dale
     
  13. greg512tr

    greg512tr Formula Junior
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    GTC's worth significantly more at the Gooding auction in Scottsdale. I don't think there are any daytona sales for $737K

    lot 23

    1966 Ferrari 330 GTC

    $737,000
     
  14. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Texas!
    Wow! That's all I can say. Is this due to the Euros wanting to diversity into hard assets, or has the GTC finally arrived?

    Dale
     
  15. SCantera

    SCantera Formula 3
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    #15 SCantera, Feb 9, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    As hard as it is to put aside auction prices or other value oriented discussions IMHO the GTC ranks at or at least near the top of the best vintage cars to drive. Sure Daytonas and BBs are faster. But there is nothing like the combination of balance, handling, power and comfort that a GTC delivers to the driving experience. That is where the value lies. And now the market place is starting to recognize this. The Dino wins on being the prettiest horse in the show. The GTC wins because it's the horse the owners want to ride.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  16. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
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    While I'm glad for the owners whose cars are appreciating its a bit sad to see what may be the best driving vintage Ferrari join the asset class. I hope at least some of the new owners don't turn them into garage queens.
     
  17. cheesey

    cheesey Formula 3

    Jun 23, 2011
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    it's basic supply and demand... about 600 330 GTC were produced vs nearly 1400 Daytona coupe... then how many of each actually survive today... and they are not going to be making any more of them... throw in current economic conditions...cull the weaker examples, leaving only a few worthy cars... anyone with the proper resources and desire, will need to bid aggressively to get what they want... it's not about the raw number in the currency of your choice or relative value, but rather what it will take for a current owner to part with his car... scarce collectibles have no predetermined price point at which they would or should sell at ... it's the not easily obtainable factor, driven by lust and unlimited resources that makes $737,000 insignificant to the purchaser, it's only the talking heads with limited resources and dreams that leaves them agape at prices of current trades
     
  18. tx246

    tx246 F1 Veteran
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    I don't mean to disrespect the GTC, but it looks wierd to me. I would rather have a Series 2 330 GT 2+2. These cars are not very common. I don't hate the Daytona, but I would take a GTC in a flash over a Daytona. I would also take a 330 GT 2+2 in a flash over a Daytona. I know these comments are only reflective if valuations are removed. I don't care about performance, just the visual look of what would be fun and cool looking to drive.

    Having said that, I have always said (EVEN back in years gone by), I would take a Dino over a Daytona any day of the week. I love the lines. I love the look. The "Enzo" era, for me, ended with the headlights going away. I know I am one of the few, but I love the headlights.

    It is crazy how small the Dino is next to the GTC. Especially the roof line......
     
  19. Motob

    Motob Formula 3
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    From what we have seen lately, a 330 GTC that is comparable in condition to a Daytona will cost 1.5 times more. There are not that many 330 GTC's that are restored to 95-100 point condition, while there are quite a few Daytona's that were not driven with low miles and then were restored to a high level. While I didn't see the 330 GTC that sold at Scottsdale, I don't think that it was a newly restored 100 point car.

    There are two cars that we service, one a low milage completely restored 100 point 330GTC and the other an absolutely perfect unrestored low-milage 365GTC. If they were to sell I would predict that the 330 GTC would bring close to a million dollars and the 365GTC would be over a million.

    We have a customer that sold his 330GTC that was a platinum winning car a couple of years ago for $300k or so, thinking that he would like to have a 246 Dino, and that if he wanted another 330GTC that he could always just sell the Dino and buy another 330GTC. He bought a Dino, but now he misses the 330GTC. But to his dismay, the value of the Dino has only gone up slightly, but a car comparable to the 330GTC he had before is now $600K-700k and he has priced himself out of the market.
     
  20. 65 f.i.

    65 f.i. Karting

    Feb 10, 2008
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    I started out looking at a 330 gtc. Then thought about a 599 gto ( cheaper and limited production). Now I am wondering if it may more sense to buy a 355 coupe. It seems the joy of a Ferrari is driving it not letting it sit for fear of depreciation.
     
  21. cheesey

    cheesey Formula 3

    Jun 23, 2011
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    330 GTC was a good ride in it's day, but is primitive in comparison to what is available today... the car is closing in on being 50 years old... ( not saying it is not a fun ride )
    why not settle for a 599GTB, not quite a GTO, but at reasonable price point, still a very nice ride with 12 cyl that you can enjoy daily if you like and not be dealing with issues that can crop up with an older car
     
  22. SCantera

    SCantera Formula 3
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    I understand the subjective thinking about looks. I think the Daytona looks more exciting than a GTC. But to say you don't care about performance? Hope Enzo isn't listening. My choice is the delivery of the experience on the road. The looks are secondary. I prefer low key cars that rank at the top of the driving characteristics. That is my reason to have these cars. Get it out their and use it. It does not have anything to do with value or looks. The GTC will be with me until I can't push the clutch pedal. Passione.
     
  23. damian in nj

    damian in nj Formula Junior

    Aug 24, 2009
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    No affiliation, but there is an incoming Verde Chiaro/Black 330GTC at Autosport in NY.

    Autosport Designs
     
  24. Motob

    Motob Formula 3
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    I was also interested in a 355 coupe, but they have a bunch of issues (Bad valve guides, cracked headers, crap F1 system). So trying to find a nice 6 Speed Berlinetta at a reasonable price is extremely difficult. They are as expensive as a 360 and offer less performance.

    The 360's also have some issues, so it seems that the best Ferrari performance per dollar value is a 550/575. They are pretty bullet-proof, don't require the engine to be removed for a belt service, and offer a very exciting driving experience. They also seem to have leveled off in price, so they will not depreciate as radically as a newer car.
     
  25. Edward 96GTS

    Edward 96GTS F1 Rookie
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    seems that the 550 vs 575 comes down to stick shift vs paddle shifting.
    ed
     

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