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348 owners--shifting question

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by 348SStb, May 22, 2004.

  1. 348SStb

    348SStb F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    I always try to shift my car slowly and with precision. I understand that this transmission takes a little extra effort because of the stiffness of the shifter and the delicacy of the car.

    However, I guess I get a little cute sometimes and try to speed shift when I don't even realize it. Every now and then, maybe once a week (I drive the car very often), I'll miss a shift going into second gear. The car makes that awful, awful grinding noise. I'm sure you all know the sound I'm talking about. It's real loud and just... awful. It breaks my heart every time I hear it. I actually get pretty pissed when I screw up and cause it to happen!

    Here's my question: how many of these misshifts can the car tolerate before I have to rebuild the transmission??

    I know the answer--try to be careful! Careful as I am, I'm only human...
     
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  3. Chiaro_Slag

    Chiaro_Slag F1 Veteran

    Oct 31, 2003
    7,731
    CA
    Full Name:
    Jerry
    Does it only happen in 2nd gear & within the first 5-10 minutes of driving?
     
  4. 348SStb

    348SStb F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    It can happen at any time.

    I don't believe that nonsense about NOT being able to shift into second gear when the car is cold. I do it all the time and every time. I do it VERY slowly and at about 2000 RPMs. It goes into gear just fine, but you cant be cute when the car's cold!

    So this misshifting I'm talking about doesn't happen when the car is cold because I am extra, extra careful and going about 10-15 miles per hour when I'm warming the car up.
     
  5. sparta49

    sparta49 F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Mar 3, 2001
    7,794
    LA
    Full Name:
    Frank
    David, I never could shift my 308 into second when it was cold but I have not experienced the same problem with my 348 it shifts into all gears w/o any problems
     
  6. 348SStb

    348SStb F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    I understand this but my question was:

    How many misshifts can the car tolerate before a transmission rebuild is necessary?
     
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  8. sduke

    sduke Formula Junior

    Mar 10, 2003
    825
    The Hub City, Texas
    Full Name:
    Steven D
    There is no set quantity of missed shifts before you do major damage to the trans. I have rebuilt countless transmissions that were totalled on the first missed shift and some transmissions that have been abused for several race seasons with no visible damage. RPM and load factors have a tremendous bearing on your fate. You can get a ball-park idea from changing your trans fluid and examining the fluid for bronze material and the drain plug for metal shards. If there is much of either, you have begun your decline into "trans rebuild hell".

    Have you considered the Slick Shift gate from Hill Engineering.

    http://www.customferrariparts.com/homemainferrari.htm

    Everyone that has used them swears by them.
     
  9. RAYMAN

    RAYMAN Formula Junior
    BANNED

    Mar 10, 2004
    315
    Oklahoma
    Full Name:
    Raymond Santilli
  10. Miltonian

    Miltonian F1 Veteran

    Dec 11, 2002
    5,959
    Milton, Wash.
    Full Name:
    Jeff B.
    I have NEVER "grinded" a shift on my 348. It is sometimes reluctant to go into gear, but it can be manipulated. Personally, I think that your problem may be that you are shifting too slowly and too carefully.

    On the other hand, in answer to your question about mis-shifts, I have owned a 1992 Volkswagen Corrado VR6 from new. For some reason, the transmission in this car requires that you have the clutch pedal pushed FULLY to the floor before it will shift cleanly. I have driven 100's, or even 1000's, of other cars, and none have been as touchy as that Corrado. I have missed hundreds of shifts, I hate to admit, and have ground the gears terribly. But you know what, it still shifts fine if you press in the pedal all the way, it has no abnormal noises at all, it does not jump out of gear, the original clutch still has plenty of "grab". It still shifts exactly the same way it did when it was new. But it's annoying, with my short legs, to require that much travel on the clutch and to have to concentrate on doing it right. It isn't a problem (for me) on the 348.
     
  11. davey_jones

    davey_jones Formula Junior

    Sep 28, 2002
    781
    wherever it's sunny
    Full Name:
    Dave
    Thats happened to me a couple times. Usually at a stop light and
    don't get the clutch fully engaged (to the floor). Was when I first got
    the car and wasn't completely familiar with it. I've never grinded the gears
    from any gear other than first. Scoot your seat up a little or something :)

    7 gear grinds = time to rebuild

    just kidding
     
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  13. ShanB

    ShanB Formula Junior

    Jul 9, 2003
    547
    Tejas/Europe/Desert
    Full Name:
    shanb
    I realize this does not answer your original question, but if you are having to concentrate that much to shift (notchy) then maybe your shift cables need adjustment. After adjustment my car now shifts like butter.
     
  14. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    19,030
    socal
    Don't panic. The first thing you should do is just drive the car. It isn't going to break and it is not delicate. These cars are race pedigree and while many treat them like garage queens and immediately bring the wax out for the smallest bird poop there is no need to baby it. Second try some Mobil1 gearbox oil. if that does not work try some royal purple if that does not work try the redline mtl mixed with the other redline oil you will have to call them I forget what it is. If you have good shift to all gear but 2 cable adjustment is not the problem. It is more likely a synchro issue. 3) learn to heel toe shift it's fun/fast and saves synchros. I track my car so it is not babied and it shift just fine.
     
  15. 348SStb

    348SStb F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Thanks everyone!
     
  16. jkuk

    jkuk Formula Junior

    Nov 3, 2003
    259
    Wirral, UK
    Full Name:
    John K

    I know exactly what you mean. 2nd gear only. It can also do it on my car when warm if I change too quickly. However, things are getting better now we know each other more.

    This doesn't answer your question, but I have found that the tougher and more deliberate I am with the car, the better she goes.

    John
     
  17. sf348s

    sf348s Karting

    Oct 8, 2003
    168
    Lazio, Italy & UK
    Full Name:
    Steve Holden
    Well Ray,
    i just took your advice and ordered the 'slick shift' from hills 30 seconds ago!!
    It's my birthday tomorrow (34) so i just bought a little present for myself! whats a good size spacer to go for on a '93 348ts? while i'm shopping i might get something else to improve things but i don't want to upset the handling though, any suggestions?
     
  18. ShanB

    ShanB Formula Junior

    Jul 9, 2003
    547
    Tejas/Europe/Desert
    Full Name:
    shanb
    Hill Engineering wheel spacers are great and the price is reasonable. No affiliation, just a satisfied (and repeat) customer. I went with 15mm front and 25mm rear on my 90 348ts.
     
  19. sf348s

    sf348s Karting

    Oct 8, 2003
    168
    Lazio, Italy & UK
    Full Name:
    Steve Holden
    Do you have any 'tram lining' or steering/handling probs mate?
     
  20. ShanB

    ShanB Formula Junior

    Jul 9, 2003
    547
    Tejas/Europe/Desert
    Full Name:
    shanb
    No, have not had any problems to date. In fact, the handling appears improved with the spacers in place.
     
  21. sf348s

    sf348s Karting

    Oct 8, 2003
    168
    Lazio, Italy & UK
    Full Name:
    Steve Holden
    Also, did you get the ones that retain the original wheel bolts or the longer bolts required as i tried looking at your profile pic but couldn't tell !!
     
  22. RAYMAN

    RAYMAN Formula Junior
    BANNED

    Mar 10, 2004
    315
    Oklahoma
    Full Name:
    Raymond Santilli
    Oh I did not use spacers on my car. I believe the Series Speciale is already spaced out farther, did you have a look at those pedals? Very cool, that I did do.
     
  23. sf348s

    sf348s Karting

    Oct 8, 2003
    168
    Lazio, Italy & UK
    Full Name:
    Steve Holden
    I haven't been on the forum for ages , i've been busy at work and with my Porsche... O dear , i can see you guy's getting me into expensive trouble ..again!
     
  24. ShanB

    ShanB Formula Junior

    Jul 9, 2003
    547
    Tejas/Europe/Desert
    Full Name:
    shanb
    They came with the correct length bolts for the rear. The fronts used the original bolts.
     
  25. chrismorse

    chrismorse Formula 3

    Feb 16, 2004
    2,149
    way north california
    Full Name:
    chris morse
    I have heard many admonitions to not use 2nd gear untill the car is warmed up or to be very gentle with it. I have heard that for some reason, 2nd gear synchro is not that great.
    I just double clutch into second when cold and heel and toe when driving hard, like Fatbillybob - no problems with grinding. IMHO, it is something worthy of a lot of practice.

    happy motoring,
    chris
     
  26. jkuk

    jkuk Formula Junior

    Nov 3, 2003
    259
    Wirral, UK
    Full Name:
    John K


    Isn't this the other way round. ?

    70mm bolts for the type 1 wheel spacers (15mm fronts) . The rears use the originals and new, smalller bolts (type 2 fixing) come with them.

    I have just ordered the 15mm/25mm combination so hope I got it right

    John
     
  27. ShanB

    ShanB Formula Junior

    Jul 9, 2003
    547
    Tejas/Europe/Desert
    Full Name:
    shanb

    Yes, you're correct. I said that backwards. Long day at the office. Sorry.
     

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