355 CATs - can someone explain the set up to me? | FerrariChat

355 CATs - can someone explain the set up to me?

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by M@r]{, Apr 13, 2022.

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  1. M@r]{

    M@r]{ Rookie

    Aug 16, 2019
    20
    Full Name:
    Mark Nash
    Hey all. I'm hoping to pull the trigger on a M27 F355 GTS very shortly. I'm planning on buying a Capristo stage 2 and remote valve control pretty much straight away. Whilst the car is apart I'm considering a decat / test pipes. I understand there may be 2 sets of cats? One set can be changed to test pipes without it impacting any emission tests? (cush as the MOT in the UK) These secondary cats only come into play when the valves open?

    Is my understanding correct?
     
  2. INRange

    INRange F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 27, 2014
    12,151
    Virginia/Florida/Caymans
    Full Name:
    JD
    Nope. To get your MOT this is the hurdle to get over plus the actual emissions test. As noted your primary catalytic convertors must be in place AND they have to pass the emissions test. A check engine light on flunks the Emissions test.

    Do you know if the car will pass the Exhaust and the Emissions test now? Most of these cars catalytics are well passed their point of effectiveness. New replacements from Ferrari are about $5,000 USD.......each.

    2.5 Exhaust system
    The exhaust system will be inspected to check that:

    • it’s secure and complete
    • a catalyst isn’t missing where one was fitted as standard
    • it’s without serious leaks and not too noisy
     
  3. PaulK

    PaulK F1 Rookie
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    Apr 24, 2004
    4,769
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    Paul
    The F355 has two different types catalysts. The first ones are the primary cats. Those are the ones you remove to install test pipes. It is my understanding they are a ceramic based catalyst which can break up in the exhaust. That is why I removed mine.
    When the bypass valve opens in the higher RPM range, the exhaust is routed through the louder, second stage. That Y pipe contains a catalyst which is, I think, made out of stainless steel. Not many people replace those as they don't go bad.

    As INRange has said, removing the primary cats WILL cause you to fail emissions. The great news is that if you get the 2.7 there is no post cat O2 sensor to give you a check engine light. You can just install the test pipes and away you go. So if you decide to do this (and you should because the 2.7 is THE BEST one to get) make sure you pass emissions first before deleting the cats!
    I have been told the car makes a little more power with the cats on. But I prefer the sound with the cats out. An added benefit as I am pretty sure it makes the car shoot flames. :)

    I hope you get the car. Enjoy!
     
  4. M@r]{

    M@r]{ Rookie

    Aug 16, 2019
    20
    Full Name:
    Mark Nash
    Thanks for the info so far. So when the valves open, are gasses being routed through both primary and secondary cats, or just the secondary? I assume just the secondary as you’d think they’d want to make it more free flowing at that point, not less. And in that case, I would have thought it’s the secondary that you want to remove as a) it won’t affect any testing/mot and b), that’s where you want to see any power increases? Also, if you remove just primary cats you’re only increasing noise at low revs? Which is making me think that perhaps gases are passed through primary and secondary cats at high rpm?

    Larini do secondary decat: https://www.larinisystems.com/collection/ferrari/f355-challenge

    For me, I’d want to make it louder at idle etc, but not silly, but I want the scream at full throttle. Cap2 with remote valves seem to be the answer as I could then open the, at idle for when I do want it silly loud. Maybe I leave cats alone?
     
  5. Ferrari Tech

    Ferrari Tech Formula 3

    Mar 5, 2010
    1,205
    Georgia
    Full Name:
    Wade Williams
    The exhaust will always flow through the main cats. The exhaust valve opens and allows exhaust to flow additionally through the secondary cat pipe.
    2.7 (1995 only) does not have post cat O2 sensors and can have a cat delete without a CEL. I have never tested for horsepower but it sounds like 50 extra so I say its worth it. (I know it is not any more HP)
    The O2 extenders with cat material in them rarely prevent a CEL in my experience and I have used them on a number of cars.
    It is my opinion that if you need to pass emission testing, keep the cats and add headers and the muffler of your choice. I do think the aftermarket headers make them sound better.
    Again, this is just my thoughts. Your thoughts may be different, some assembly required, results may vary, batteries not included, not actual size.
     
  6. M@r]{

    M@r]{ Rookie

    Aug 16, 2019
    20
    Full Name:
    Mark Nash
    Thanks for the explanation, really useful. So is there much to gain (noise) from decating the secondary CATs? From your description it would only affect it when the valves are open? If the difference is great maybe not worth the cost to purchase and the effort to swap?
     
  7. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
    Consultant

    Nov 29, 2001
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    San Carlos, CA
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    Mitchell Le
    With the cat delete pipes, you are essentially always in by-pass mode (there is nothing in the cat) so the sound is pretty loud. There is not going to be much exhaust flowing through the Y pipe since there is no air resistance in the main cats (there is nothing there).
     
  8. f355spider

    f355spider F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    May 29, 2001
    18,029
    USA
    OP you are saying valves. The OEM system has one valve, and the preferred Capristo 355 exhaust also has one valve...using either the OEM valve or their replacement version. I would not recommend using their muffler with two valves. It does not have the same crisp F1 sound that their single valve systems have. Even with oem exhaust manifolds and catalysts, the Capristo will still sound glorious, loud and amazing. It did on my 355. Removing catalysts simply increases the volume even more. Go with catalysts initially...you can always remove them later if desired.
     
  9. Targatime

    Targatime Formula 3

    Feb 22, 2014
    1,437
    Los Angeles
    Lots of info on all this in the archives, only point I'll add is that at least in my experience there was very little noise difference between cats and bypass pipes. I changed nothing other than the cats, and on my stock muffler car, I'd say it has a 10% louder exhaust note now, if that. Barely noticeable.
     
  10. M@r]{

    M@r]{ Rookie

    Aug 16, 2019
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    Mark Nash
    Thanks for the info. Are you referring to the primary cats or the secondary in the ypipe?
     
  11. Targatime

    Targatime Formula 3

    Feb 22, 2014
    1,437
    Los Angeles
    Sorry, these were the primary cats. Not the Y-pipe.
     
  12. PaulK

    PaulK F1 Rookie
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    Apr 24, 2004
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    Mark, most people don't change the y-pipe. They don't go bad.

    This guy clearly changed out his cats for test pipes. Maybe this will help you:

     
    f355spider likes this.
  13. f355spider

    f355spider F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    May 29, 2001
    18,029
    USA
    May have to do with the stock exhaust. I had stock catalysts with a Capristo exhaust...very loud. My friend had cat delete pipes with his Capristo and it was literally ear splitting when he would pass me. I actually thought it was too much of a good thing.
     
    Targatime likes this.

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