It's all in the driver. Full stop.
From Ferrari: "Ferrari engineers have reduced the 360 Modena's weight by 100 kg (220 lbs) compared to the F355 despite more generous dimensions." Doesn't Cd incorporate frontal area? Just asking, I really don't know, but it seems to me Cd should take it into account for a full reflection of drag. And all performance claims aside, I love *both* the 360 and 355. Gary
Yeah, I'm least confident about the weight. One book I have (Standard Catalog of Ferrari by Covello) lists the 355 at 2967-2976 lbs with the 360 at 3064 lbs. So same book 360 is 90 lbs or so heavier. This site has a couple of different results: http://www.fast-autos.net/ferrari/ferrari355.html http://www.fast-autos.net/ferrari/ferrari360.html Showing the 355 at 3150 lbs and the 360 at 3065 lbs, so 85lbs *the other way* (more consistent with your brochure quote, but still not 100 Kgs). Finally, this thread regarding CS vs Modena/Spider weight http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2840&highlight=154+lbs seems to point out that Ferrari marketing numbers are vague and actual numbers hard to pin down. Best guess, it appears that Euro 360's are 3050 lbs, but American 360's are a porky 150lbs heavier. Are Euro 355's (since the subject race was in England I think) 90 lbs lighter or heavier than 360's? 220 lbs seems out there since that would make the 355 weigh in at 3280 lbs. But I'm really not sure since there's all this conflicting data. Regarding the Cd, these seem to be less controversial. The same Cd numbers appear in several places. Probably because everyone takes Ferrari's numbers as gospel (lot fewer 3rd party wind-tunnels around than scales ). The drag calculation takes the Cd (unitless co-efficient) times the frontal area to reach the "effective" frontal area. See: http://www.insideracingtechnology.com/tech102drag.htm In the second equation, you can see that once you have Cd and frontal area, the only variable left is V.
I've been reading this thread with amusement. Trust Chaa to enjoy stirring things up! ;-) It's really simple, a STANDARD 360 is slightly, but noticeably, quicker than a STANDARD 355. That is a simply proven fact. However, a MODIFIED 355 can easily be as quick or quicker than a STANDARD 360. Hardly surprising when you consider how close they are in bhp, weight and drag terms. BTW, I notice both F355s discussed were early 2.7 Motronic examples with the twin air flow meters. I am convinced that they are noticeably quicker than the later 5.2 ones with the single air meter. My F355 Spider was a 5.2 and it was only after I had a full Tubi de-cat, K&Ns and a remap that it felt as fast as my mates 2.7. Also before the mods, 360s would walk away, but after, I could keep up no problem.
This is black bag sh*t that i am doing here dude Come in light the fuse then run back to the safty of the UK forum I also find it very funny hearing the 360 guys rabbiting on about how much faster the 360 is compared to the 355s. But what the smart arses for got to take into account even though it is writen in black and white is that the cars weight has nowt to do with it becourse i am carrying 19stone of my own and i took hudsons mate out with me and hes 23 stone and still we went at around 164/5ish mph Why and how some may be asking.......well its always been there for every one to see, and i have even posted loads of pics of it on my car. LOL if you find the pic and look carefully then in the top left of the rear on the car, you will see a little badge with the words.....Hammon tuning Somthing to do with the ecu dont ya know so of course its faster than a 360. I did not do it, it was the guy who had it befor me, dude spent around 2.5K getting it done according to the invoice. but its been fun so now i am of... its been fun........ Image Unavailable, Please Login
Good going Chaa.. I don't know why people are so shocked cause every time I've come accross a 360 in my 355 they read my license plate. As far as corners go 360 I am sure is better. As if every 360 driver drives like Mr. Schumacher. Funny how highway drivers spank most 360 drivers. I am just saying don't flame cause like most times people will now talk all kinds of sh**t even though they never drove over 100mph. in a public highway. Yeah yeah it's unsafe, spare me the bullsh**t. I hear it all the time. Next time your in some traffic and you see me why don't you let me know of it. Then will see.
You poor bitter 360 man, if my car was there i would have canned the 360s Live with it man , let it go now, my results stand
Na mate i just love to wind up the 360s. My 355 a good car but i also drive the F430 and Bentley GT, now they are greater cars
Bitter? Now there's a strange word to choose, I just posted another thread. I think you're a bit defensive, mate. Gary
Sorry to interfere... I think that Chaa has a fast 355, others could be less fast. Of course he has modified his car also a bit. I know 2 people who have a 360 F1 and they both had a 355 and a 355F1. Both of them say that THEIR 360 feels faster everywhere. They can know, because they had their 355's also 3 and 4 years. I wished I had the money for either one of them. Marketprices here for a 2000 360 ? $ 120.000.... :-(
I totaly agree with your above statement.And In this thread i was only refering to MY 355. Its easy for people to forget (like they do) that i drive a wide cross section of ferraris every day, so i know whats fast and whats not.But i must say that no standard 360 has ever felt that much faster than any standard 355 i have driven any way. Remmber we are not talking about the same 80bhp jump that the 355 had over the 348s, no we are talking about what? 15bhp diferance between the 355s and the 360s. Now the F430 over the 360s, now they are that much faster.
Lets add some realism here, 355vs360. Well they are both essentially the same V8 engine, same 5 valves per cylinder, etc, the 360's is just an evolved version of your car! Now race cats can add up to 30hp, a tubi another 10hp, and so on, your looking at at least 30 or 40 hp MORE than stock. So racing a 360 when you have got so much more power, what did you expect? Who's that surprised if a tuned 355 can beat a standard 360 in a race? Compare apples with apples! As for the weight thing, well extra power effects the power to weight ratio so your not even making sense. If you really are that obsessed with racing your mates 360's/F430's just twin supercharge your 355, 0-6 in less than 4 seconds then, BUT SO WHAT? If powers your thing go for it! I know people who love their 355 and wouldn't want to upgrade to a 360, similarly I know 360 owners who wouldn't even contemplate a 355. Beauty in the eye of the beholder and all that. Just what exactly was your point, that a tuned older car can win a stock newer one? Well duh!
Oh you are contraversiol Trev, good man Buy your own admission on the UK section you dont read all the posts on a thread becourse you either find it boaring or lazy, you just read the end few posts. You may be suprised in me responding to this attact becourse you well know i dont post on here any more since the majority of us left the UK section, and set up on our own. But we still watch So go one dude knock ya self out you big player you Shame you didnt step forward when we were all on the UK section instead of being a lurker ey. But hey you now a big big mouthed fish in a little pond. Fire away digging up old news Good that man See ya. MB: most reading this will maybe not understand what i have wrote, but Trev will Oh and i shall not be responding further to this thread.
Tom you must be trying to be nice to your kid!!! I hammered a kid in new mustang today in my 360f1.......Looked like he was standing still in the rear view mirrior!!!!
I've been a visitor to the UK board and generally felt welcome. But you were the exception. If there was a prototypical example of a few people trying to drown out conversation when things didn't suit them, this is one. I find it a bit sad that some choose to stay away even after things were "settled". Apparently an apology by Rob wasn't enough, even though that was what was demanded. In any event you made a new home, so congratulations. Yet you still come to FChat to "watch"? What an odd thing to do if FChat no longer suits you as you claim.
I believe that's correct. He apparently gets to drive some cars that his principal owns. BTW - what is the definition of "choco dude"?
Just a correction and update. I mistakenly remembered this as taking place on the UK forum due to the content. In any case Chaz & I are cool, I now know it was "banter".
All I stated where facts, in summary "a tuned 355 is not a fair comparison with a stock 360!". Fact, nothing more. As for posting on different sites, I post on many sites, not just Ferrari ones. I have actually owned my 360 less than a month. The aforementioned thread about uk people is nothing to do with me! I just posted on here once about why people who have enjoyed this site should continue to do so and forget about the politics. In anycase I will still continue to post on any forum or thread I find interesting, sorry if I caused you any offense but none was intended. In conclusion I just found this thread a little illogical because it was rather strange that it lambast 360 owners about their cars performance being 'slower' than a tuned 355. Trev
