355 work well but not powerfull | FerrariChat

355 work well but not powerfull

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by fana355france, Jul 19, 2007.

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  1. fana355france

    fana355france Formula Junior
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    Aug 10, 2005
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    nicolas
    Hello as you can read in this forum i had electic troubles and finaly changed plug wires and everything is ok (thank you this forum !!!!).To find I unpluged lot of connectors and sensors...and now even if the car sound very good condition I feel like a lost of power.The car easily run more than 240/250hmh but it seam very linear not violent do you understand this strange feeling.
    Now I dont know if I have introduce fault codes into ecu and maybe the car run in a minimum mode ?
    possible ?
    I reset ecu cutting the attery one night and restart the car for auto learn but not better...maybe it is me ?
    Your opinion interess me !
    bye Nico
     
  2. bcwawright

    bcwawright F1 Veteran

    Jul 8, 2006
    5,234
    Georgia
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    Bruce
    Is your by-pass valve operatng correctly?
     
  3. gothspeed

    gothspeed F1 World Champ

    May 26, 2006
    10,244
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    goth
    +1 bypass will lose discernable power....
     
  4. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
    Vegas+Alabama
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    Mr. Sideways
    Are any sensors still unplugged?


    Your water temp sensors will influence performance at all levels.

    Your O2 sensors will influence performance in mid-range rpms when the motor is warm.
     
  5. fana355france

    fana355france Formula Junior
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    Aug 10, 2005
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    nicolas
    Hello
    I think everything is well plugged, the o2 sensor, I dont know if they are ok but the power loss is at all revs.
    If the temp sensor is bad plugged, I would have no informations on dashboard ? or it is only usefull for the motronic ?
    I will hear the car to check the bypass, can I keep it open to test the differnece ? I have a tubi+2 cat pipes.
    thanks
    nico
     
  6. bcwawright

    bcwawright F1 Veteran

    Jul 8, 2006
    5,234
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    Bruce
    +1 May want to first clean and lube all sensor connections......also make sure that they are all in good condition physically......under hood temps can make connectors and wiring brittle.

    Have you done a recent compression/leak down test?
     
  7. 335s

    335s Formula Junior

    Jan 17, 2007
    870
    SF Bay Area
    Full Name:
    T. Monma
    I agree with last post...intake valve guides are a NOTORIOUS F355 weak point...up to late 1998(?)
    It is not if,
    but when....

    ONLY an accurate leakdown will tell the story there.

    If you've got good cylinder chamber sealing, then the electrics can accurrately be whittled away...

    If guides are required, you will likely need all valves if over 20,000 miles. certainly intakes-in my experience.(taper in stems)
    Use only the silly expensive Ferrari "composite" replacement guides-look like, act like, taste like, smells like cast iron-but start out as some sort of powder and turns into the guides under huge temp and pressures of the manufacturing process...They told me it's some sort of composite(?)...it's not really important-it's just that they seem to last way longer than the "machine shop replacements."
    Which, by the way, I've seen wear out in another 10-20,000 miles, on more than 3 different occassions.
    Not a knock on the machine shops, just the materials used....this is a $20,000.00 job after all, who wants to do it again so soon just because the other guides were a couple of thousand cheaper!
    Please, let us know of the outcome...
     
  8. 355

    355 F1 Rookie
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    Jan 4, 2005
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    Frank
    I doubt that this is his problem as it would not have come on all at once right after changing the wires. He more than likely has an electrical problem somewhere in a connection or wire. $20,000 to re an re the heads? Sounds like a lot to me.
     
  9. TopElement

    TopElement Formula 3

    May 14, 2005
    1,540
    OC & Vegas
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    A Montoya
    Have you had it done? I've got a bill for $27K sitting around.
    But the OP's problem must be something else if it happened suddenly. An bad electrical connectiong or faulty sensor could cause the engine to run with less power.
     
  10. cf355

    cf355 F1 Rookie

    Feb 28, 2005
    4,208
    Full Name:
    chris
    I donot need the valve guides replaced but I was quoted by my mechanic (ex ferrari dealer mechanic) $5500.00 for the complete valve guide job....., not 20g or 27 g.
    You need to find a new mechanic.

    Also not all 1995-1998 355's need valve guide replacement......in fact I know of at least 16 355's with some having in excess of 100,000 klm that are still on the stock valve guides and exhaust manifolds.

    What usually cause a failure of either of the above items is another problem.....usually a failure of the exhaust bypass valve. It fails in the closed or partially closed position and at high revs causes an excessive heat backlash to the guides and exhaust manifolds.

    It seems that a lot of people on the internet are 'creating' the valve guide failure myth. I'M NOT SAYING there are no failures but they are few and far between.

    I went to my local ferrari dealer and asked them how many valve guide failures they had and they numbered less than 10 and ALL of them occured in the first couple of years ( from new).
    If it has'nt happened in the last 12 years......don't worry about it.

    But it is a good idea to replace your bypass valve with a challenge pipe so that you don't become a victim of these failures. And to boot the car sounds a little more aggresive.....very much like a tubi.

    The bypass valve serves only two functions.....to allow the car to pass noise regulations AND to help the car in an emission test. The emission test is at lower rpm's where the bypass valve is closed and the exhaust is routed through the more stringent main cats.

    The internet chat lines are a great resource but the myths that it can create are unreal. A lot of chatters are NON OWNERS (and never will be Ferrari owners), who suddenly became experts when typing on their laptops.

    I also donot believe that this ferrari chatter has a valve guide issue.....it sounds like a bypass valve problem......wire it open temporarily and see if it addressed your power loss problems. Also failed cats can cause a power loss.....remove the cats and make sure the catalyst is still intact and not blocking the exhaust flow.

    I had to vent.....let the flames begin.

    p.s. I do own a 1995 355 and have NO issues except for regular maintenance .....on a 12 year old car.
     
  11. lusso64

    lusso64 Formula 3

    Apr 12, 2004
    1,535
    Simi Valley
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    David
    But don't leave it this way. Otherwise valve guides are the least of your worries.
     
  12. cf355

    cf355 F1 Rookie

    Feb 28, 2005
    4,208
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    chris
    Exactly what problems are created by wiring open the bypass valve?

    Again I have had NO bypass valve in my car since it was new and there are absolutely no negative side affects.
    AND THE BYPASS CHALLENGE PIPE WAS INSTALLED BY MY LOCAL FERRARI DEALER. They have installed the bypass pipes on 355's from 1995-1999 years.
    Also there are many 355 owners on this site who have stated they have wired open their bypass valves because they could not be bothered installing the challenge bypass pipe.

    On a 1995 355 there will be no service engine light but on a 1996 and later car the service engine light will come on due to OBD2. Some owners just ignore the light (it does not affect the car at all) and others who are irritated by the light put some tape over it. I DONOT RECOMMEND TAPING OVER THE LIGHT because if a relivent service code lit up ...you would not know it.

    Again I reiterate.....you must review all internet comments with a grain of salt.

    I recommend all owners to take any information you obtain on the internet and speak with a real Ferrari dealer mechanic before you act on any of the recommendations.
     
  13. fana355france

    fana355france Formula Junior
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    Aug 10, 2005
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    I tested the valve, if I open it it make realy much better sound ! I looked at it in static acclerating and the valve doesnt move.
    Do you know where goes the "RUBBER HOSE TO PIPE TO ENGINE" ?
    The valve dont seam to be locked...
    thanks nico
     
  14. fana355france

    fana355france Formula Junior
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    Aug 10, 2005
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    I tested the 2 SOLENOID VALVE near the air pump, if I put +12v on one of it the valve works.So the valve is not out of order, it is electrical problem but the solenoid are ok too...
    But I dont found a fuse about this 2 solenoid.???
     
  15. fana355france

    fana355france Formula Junior
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    Will try to explain better my tests.
    lookt at the valve engine runing at 1000.. 2000...7000 rpm, the valve dont move and no vacum arrive to it.

    1 found vacum ok coming from engine (head)
    2 put vacum from the head to the valve....valve open slowly and more and more with the rpm.
    3 removed the 2 solenoid, put vacum on the intake hole of it, put +12v on the connectors, the solenoid say clac clac and open.
    So what I think.
    Valve ok, vacum ok, solenoid ok.
    The solenoid are not opened because they dont receive the information (electric) to do it ! But I controled all fuses, all are ok ! so what decide the vacum to open or no ?? a relay ?
    bye
    nico
     
  16. spaghetti_jet

    spaghetti_jet Formula Junior

    Jan 5, 2005
    943
    Europa
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    Bob
    you should check the vacuum reservoir cannister in the right hand rear corner behind the rear bumper. It's mounted on the same bracket as the air pump. I'd bet it's got a hole in it. Let us know what you discover...

    Ciao, Bob.
     
  17. fana355france

    fana355france Formula Junior
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    Aug 10, 2005
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    I have no vacum at all arriving at the valve ok , a hole in this reservoir would do it ? or the valve would not open totaly because of vacum loss ?
    I will look at it and tell you.
    thanks
    nico
     
  18. fana355france

    fana355france Formula Junior
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    Aug 10, 2005
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    If I remove the tank to make a test, I should have a movement of the valve no ?
    This is an intersting problem !
     
  19. fana355france

    fana355france Formula Junior
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    Aug 10, 2005
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    I removed the tank, there is some rust but no hole, I repaint it.
    When I removed it I heard a pchit, there was vacum inside.
    I dont understand !
     
  20. eric355

    eric355 Formula 3
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    Nov 30, 2005
    1,230
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    Eric DECOUX
    Hi Nico
    have you check you have not a wiring inversion between the the two electro-valves which are there:
    - one for the command of a vacuum driven valve for air injection in the exhaust at cold start-up
    - one for the command of the vacuum driven exhaust valve
    Both are commanded by the engine ECU and have the same connector. Both are connected to the vacuum tank. Just a thought ....
     
  21. fana355france

    fana355france Formula Junior
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    Aug 10, 2005
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    I dont know, I never unpluged both in same time...the air pump work well I can ear it at cold start...
    Do you know if this 2 valves have a relay to control it ?
    thanks
     
  22. 355

    355 F1 Rookie
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    Jan 4, 2005
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    I have had the challenge bypass pipe on for years on my 95 355B. I think everyone should be installing this part. Its only a $150 dollar item and can be changed easily.
     
  23. fana355france

    fana355france Formula Junior
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    #23 fana355france, Aug 5, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I already make a lot of noise I would not like to make a bigger sound like a challenge ! thanks !!
    I have check the wiring of the two electro-valves , one have a blue connector and one have a black one.
    Please 355 owner can you look under your car to tell me witch one should be connected on the blue and on the black ?
    Maybe I never had a valve working and it was inverted...?
    mine is like on draw joined.I can make a photo if better!
    many thanks.
    nico
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  24. fana355france

    fana355france Formula Junior
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    #24 fana355france, Aug 5, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  25. fana355france

    fana355france Formula Junior
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    #25 fana355france, Aug 5, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    If I do this, the valve work.
    So it is not a tank or valve failure.
    Not the solenoid too ,on the 2 solenoid, put +12v on the connectors, the solenoid say clac clac and open.

    So it is a missing information to say to the solenoid to open ?
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