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360 cranks but won't start

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by pitmanphoto, Oct 18, 2020.

  1. pitmanphoto

    pitmanphoto Rookie

    Aug 9, 2015
    23
    Any help would be great. I here different opinions on the immobilizer some say it won't crank and some say it will crank. 2004 has been parked for at least a month on a battery maintainer. Engine cranks fine and there is fuel in both rales but won't start. also will it start with one of the doors open? Does the immobilizer shut spark? Thank you!!!
     
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  3. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Rookie
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    Feb 20, 2015
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    2004 360 F1?

    If you're getting conflicting answers about the immobiliser and cranking, then there may be immobiliser variations (as there are on the F355 for cranking). The Workshop Manual does specifically say that the immobiliser inhibits "ignition/injection" but I couldn't find anything in there regarding the inhibiting of cranking by the immobiliser. However, I would expect an F1 system cranking inhibit, as you wouldn't want the motor to turn over without the F1 system being in neutral during start. The F355 does this.

    The driver's door switch does have an input to the immobiliser and the F1 system, but there was only a reference in the WSM to the F1 gearbox going into neutral with the driver's door open under certain circumstances.

    Assuming your flashing F1 warning light extinguishes after 10 seconds, I think I would focus on the Motronic ECUs not getting the required signals for fuel/ignition (crank sensors, immobiliser system, etc).

    Experts?
     
  4. Ferrari Tech

    Ferrari Tech Formula Junior

    Mar 5, 2010
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    Wade Williams
    A 360 will put itself into neutral and turn over but not start if the key fob button has NOT been pushed. 355 needs to be put in neutral before trying to start it.
    360 may shut the spark and injector firing. Having fuel doesn't mean it is firing the injector.
    You may need to seek a professional with the proper diagnostic tools to "look" at things.
     
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  5. Doctor Mark

    Doctor Mark Formula Junior

    Dec 15, 2005
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    Mark Gronsbell
    Just the obvious but have you cycled the lock and unlock buttons on the key fob just before attempting to start. The immobilizer will allow the engine to crank but will not start without pushing the unlock button right before the starting attempt.
     
  6. pitmanphoto

    pitmanphoto Rookie

    Aug 9, 2015
    23
    yes i tried both ways but no difference
     
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  8. pitmanphoto

    pitmanphoto Rookie

    Aug 9, 2015
    23
    Thank you every one for the responses! When i get back to town I will get back on it and update everyone! Thanks again
     
  9. pitmanphoto

    pitmanphoto Rookie

    Aug 9, 2015
    23
    just a quick update there is 50 lbs in both fuel rails i pulled 1 coil and put my spark tester on coil and have no spark and it is an f1 thanks for any help!!
     
  10. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Rookie
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    Interesting. According to the Workshop Manual, if you have fuel pressure, this means that the engine ECUs are receiving crank sensor data. A greater than 40 rpm signal from the crank sensors is required for pump operation according to the manual. Looking at the wiring diagrams, the crank sensors share the same power as the injectors and coils (i.e. via the same ECU-controlled power relays). However, it seems that the ECUs are still not providing the earth signals directly to the ignition coils or fuel injectors to activate them.

    There still seems to be a common fault which is affecting both engine ECUs. The immobiliser may still be the problem ... or some common power problem which I haven't been able to find yet. Time to call in the experts?
     
  11. pitmanphoto

    pitmanphoto Rookie

    Aug 9, 2015
    23
    Thank you everyone for the help!! I will update as soon as I have this resolved
     
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  13. pitmanphoto

    pitmanphoto Rookie

    Aug 9, 2015
    23
    a few more questions if anyone might know, looks like the 360 has 2 engine control modules and it seems like I'm not communicating with the right side. The left side shows immobilizer active, does it need to see the right side before it will show inactive? Also my scanner shows to gearbox versions and i can only communicate with version 1 can it be my scanner? i am using a autel but looks like the scanner has the software thanks anyone
     
  14. wrxmike

    wrxmike F1 Veteran
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    Mar 20, 2004
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    You have a PM
     
  15. ttforcefed

    ttforcefed F1 World Champ
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    Aug 22, 2002
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    U dont have the trunk or hood open right?

    Also step on the brake pedal with all your weight- the brake pedal sensors go.
     
  16. RedNeck

    RedNeck F1 Veteran
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    Jul 8, 2016
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    What reader are you using? With the Foxwell, and I'm guessing some other models, the immobilizer needs to be disabled before it can connect to the right side ECU.
     
  17. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Rookie
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    Doesn't the F1 system use the same switch as the brake lights? (#11) The switch should be activated long before the pedal reaches the floor.

    Won't these inhibit cranking?
     
  18. ttforcefed

    ttforcefed F1 World Champ
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    not sure but i had this happen in my 360 and my 430. literally needed to stand on the brake pedal with all my weight
     
  19. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Rookie
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    Strange, probably a better technique would be to release the brake pedal quickly to shake the switch, then apply the brake again... or hit the switch with a hammer to make the spring loaded plunger come out :D

    I've been unable to find a link to the F1 system in the wiring diagrams. There are a few errors in the in the Ferrari diagrams. The only possible link I can see at the moment is via the engine management system .... switch >>> lots of plugs and splices>>> engine ECU >>> CAN bus >>> F1 TCU. Sounds unlikely though.
     

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