365 GT 2+2 Restoration Questions

Some of these questions may seem nit-picky, but I’m in the process of a “strip to bare metal” restoration and repaint, and want to do it right.

I would like simply to be able to put the car together like it was, but I’m not sure it was right when I took it apart. Originally it was painted Grigio Ortello (medium gray with a touch of olive green). Between 1969 and 1984, it was repainted red then repainted Grigio Ortello again. Both repaints were done without removing the windshield, backlight or doors, although masking was well done. Here are the first two questions.

1) The metal strips that cover the lower rocker panel weld flanges are painted semi-gloss or satin black and are installed with Phillips flat head machine screws, nuts and washers, also painted black. IS THIS CORRECT FOR A 365 GT 2+2?

2) In the trough just outboard of the hood seal, where the front fender aprons are attached to the fenders, the fasteners on my car are unpainted pop rivets. They appear to have been installed after the fender was painted. I had the engine compartment and underbody stripped and repainted while the engine was being restored so it’s possible that the fender aprons were detached at that time and re-riveted after the fender aprons were painted. ARE THE FASTENERS SUPPOSED TO BE SCREWS, RIVETS, OR SPOT WELDS? IF THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO BE THERE, ARE THEY SUPPOSED TO BE PAINTED OR BARE METAL?

I’m sure that I will have many more questions as I progress. If any of you owner or non-owner experts can advise me, it will be greatly appreciated. I think that this thread might become a good source for 365 GT 2+2 restorers, so please don’t hesitate to help if you have answers.

Also, If you have questions related to the restoration or authenticity of a 365 GT 2+2, don’t hesitate to ask them. I won’t consider it a high-jack.

Thanks in advance.

Tom Kizer

 

Thanks for the confirmation on the rocker panel flange covers. Also thanks for the info on the splash shield attachments. Mine are exactly as you describe. My second question actually related to the top of the fender, the part that is exposed when the hood is raised, next to the rubber hood seal. In the bottom of the groove that runs around the outside of the hood seal, I find the unpainted heads of the pop rivets. Those are the ones that I suspect are not original. Just in case there is still confusion, I'll take photos today while I'm at the shop, finishing the removal of the instrument panel.
Thanks again.

Question 3: Is a 365 GT 2+2 supposed to have hood bumper stops? My hood flushness to the rest of the car is controlled by the hood latches holding the hood in compression against the hood seal. IS THIS CORRECT?

Tom Kizer

 

OK! OK! I know you all (y'all where I came from) like pictures, so here are a few.
1) The car in my driveway in Quebec last summer.
2) The car last week after it was 98% gutted in preparation for a "correctly done" strip, bump and repaint.
3) The rivets in the groove around the outside of the hood seal, just under the edge of the hood. These are the ones I think are not correct.

Let me know if there are any other photos you would like to see while its "innerds" are exposed.

Tom Kizer
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WOW! It looks like I need to learn to post photos. They were all supposed to be the size of the small one.
Tom Kizer

 

dgrperformance said:

The photo showed only one of the rivets. There are eight total. The attached photo, taken a few years ago, clearly shows three on one side. The fourth is almost visible near the safety hook eye. ARE THERE REALLY EIGHT HOOD BUMPERS? WHAT DO HOOD BUMPERS LOOK LIKE?
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The FerrariChat members, working together, would make a good detective agency. I suspect you've found the answers. The hood seal was the type of bulb seal with an inverted U underneath it and a tiny lip hanging off the top of the bulb (a trunk seal, I think) - probably installed when the hood bumpers were lost during a repaint. The resulting holes were probably just "filled" with the pop rivets. I'll remove them and install hood bumpers. DO THEY SCREW ON THROUGH THE CENTER HOLES? I'll also replace the bulb seal with the correct vinyl/rubber U-shaped flange lip covering.

There's a lip seal retainer on the bottom of each door that has never contained anything. Look at the photo. CAN I ASSUME THAT THE 365 GT 2+2 RUBBER SEAL DIAGRAM AT FERRARI PARTS EXCHANGE IS CORRECT? In the diagram, I find no seal on the bottom of the door except the bulb seal that goes around the opening. IS THE ONE ON THE BOTTOM OF THE DOOR SUPPOSED TO BE LIKE THE T-SHAPED SEAL AT THE FRONT OF THE DOOR?

Apparently if one is willing to spend money to restore a vintage Ferrari, it's possible to do it correctly - but only if one knows what "correct" is.

Tom Kizer
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I just started exploring Kerry Chesbro's site and finally found the area where the photos of the rubber are located. I can only dream of what it would be like to have a site like that devoted to 365 GT 2+2s. There's so much knowledge on that site, it's hard to believe. I'll use it as a resource for my 365 GT with attention to verifying that things I use were still true for my car. Thanks Kerry.

By the way, I found the photo of the T-seal used at the bottom of the door. I suspect it's the one that Ferrari Parts Exchange calls # 127 - Outer Window T-Seal and shows the arrow pointing to the top of the window.

Without FerrariChat and all of the knowledge represented by its membership, I would never have started this body restoration. NOTE: The reason I'm doing the body only is that the engine, transmission, differential, suspension, underbody and engine compartment were carefully restored (as correctly as I knew at that time) between 1989 (started teardown) and 1997 (first fire). Because there was some bubbling of the paint at the front of the doors and on the rocker panels, I know that anyone considering buying the car some day would think that the car is all rotted out and that much is probably wrong with the car. I decided to just gut the car myself, have it stripped to the metal, repaired correctly, and repainted. While I'm at it, I'll just replace all or most of the rubber, the insulation, headliner, much of the trim vinyl and do an as-required restoration of the leather interior. Then, with a photo portfolio, no one will question what's under the paint, leather and carpet.

Thanks for all your help so far - and don't stop now!

Tom Kizer

 

My copy of the 365 GT 2+2 Pininfarina parts catalog shows a trunk lid seal P/N 251.34.510.00. I cannot identify which type it is. I can find NO other trunk seal in the Pininfarina parts catalog. My car had 2, one approx. 1"x1/4" rectangular foam seal glued to the trunk lid and another bulb seal slipped over the seam around the trunk opening. The profile detail is not shown in the parts catalog. DOES ANYBODY KNOW FOR SURE? This is not a multiple choice question - NO GUESSING!

I begin to suspect that rubber seals are a little bit like Ferrari yellow inspection paint. They may have used whatever they could find at the auto parts store when they ran out in the factory. Maybe purism is really masochism after all. Why couldn't they have taken some close-up photos in the factory?

 

This afternoon, I saw in a used book shop a book entitled "L'histoire de Ferrari", in French of course. There was a beautiful photo of the 365 GT 2+2 sitting on display at the 1967 Paris Salon. Clearly visible were the rocker panel flange covers - painted black with the frontmost screwhead showing.
I guess that answers my first question, without doubt.
Tom Kizer