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365GTC/4 or 365 GT 2+2

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by Davidindallas, Jan 12, 2004.

  1. Davidindallas

    Davidindallas Formula Junior

    Nov 5, 2003
    343
    As part of my ongoing waffling over front engine V-12s, I wonder what people see as the pros and cons of these two cars. I have heard the C4s are hard and expensive to service. Th epower is supposedly the same on the cars and the C4 has a sportier cut to its jib with the tiny rear seat that folds down into a storage space. I know of a couple of good looking 2+2s for sale through vendors and 3 are up for sale (all red) at that Barrett Jackson. Autosport Design has a nice C4 but is asking way too much for it.
     
  2. bazooka joe

    bazooka joe Rookie

    Dec 29, 2003
    29
    2+2 is the way to go. Great ride, comfortable, fast, awesome lines. Look at the Superfast 500, check out the pricing ... end of discussion
     
  3. F SPIDER

    F SPIDER F1 Rookie
    Owner

    Jan 30, 2002
    2,873
    NYC, A'dam, W'stock
    Full Name:
    rijk rietveld
    365GTC4

    Very underrated car. Great sound and much faster than the 365gt2+2

    Rijk
     
  4. Bryan

    Bryan Formula 3

    Comments on C4

    As the factory intended, this is a wonderful touring car, but not a sports car. I have never had mine on the track, but Jeff Littrell (FCA-Cal chapter) has. He says it holds its own, but clearly was never intended for the track.

    It's been awhile since I have taken a long trip in mine, but when I did, it's very comfortable, albeit louder than a Lexus <g>. HUGE trunk...2 sets of golf clubs and weekend suitcase are no problem. The back seats fold down and there is room there for even more. That's about all the rear seat is good for, though. There is only about 2 inches clearance between back of the front seat and the back seat, when I drive.

    I'm 6'3", with 34" legs. Still, there is 3-4 inches of head room for me. My legs are a bit bent, but I've been in worse cars.

    Parts and service are atrocious. There were only 500 C4s built. That said, a C4 in good condition is very robust.

    Still they hold their value well. On average, C4s have gone up a few percent, since I bought mine.

    Once set the points, carbs, timing seem pretty solid. The C4 has a semi-electronic ignition system in which Dinoplex ignition modules are used to boost the spark. This unloads the points and saves them. The carbs (6 Weber DCOE side drafts) are easy to work on, but tough to synch.

    I thought the distributors would be tough to get to, as they are underneath the back edge of the engine compartment. But, in fact, there are easy.

    The sound is great, from idle to redline. I have a exhaust from Stebro, but it's not much different in sound than stock, which I still have. Stock headers...the Stebro is the exhaust only.

    When I was originally looking, I drove a 365 GT 2+2 and a 365 GTC/4 one after the other. Obviously, I liked the C4 better, but it was a very tough call. They are not that far apart in performance. The C4 is a bit lighter to handle.

    I think the C4 that I drove is at Barrett-Jackson. Photos from 1997 or so at
    http://home.earthlink.net/~mac2525/images/RedC4Image1.jpg
    http://home.earthlink.net/~mac2525/images/RedC4Image2.jpg
    http://home.earthlink.net/~mac2525/images/RedC4Image3.jpg
    http://home.earthlink.net/~mac2525/images/RedC4Image4.jpg

    The 2+2 I drove is:
    http://home.earthlink.net/~fchat/images/365GT2+2.jpg
    http://home.earthlink.net/~fchat/images/365GT2+2c.jpg
    http://home.earthlink.net/~fchat/images/365GT2+2b.jpg
     
  5. donv

    donv F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Jan 5, 2002
    19,101
    Portland, Oregon
    Full Name:
    Don
    I own a 365 2+2, and I was seriously looking for a C/4 to add to the collection last spring. Instead, I ended up purchasing a 456, which is another story.

    The C/4 is a cool car. I still intend to own one someday, maybe when I get a bigger garage.

    The C/4 - 365GT comparison is an interesting one. The C/4 is only a couple of years newer, and yet it feels like it's from a different era. This can be good or bad-- depends on which era you like. I happen to like both!

    If the vintage, 60s era, wood steering wheel and borranis feel is what you are after, the 365GT 2+2 will provide all of that, great high speed touring, and make great noises.

    If 70s modern appeals to you, that's the C/4, which will also be a great tourer with great sounds.

    Not an easy choice!
     
  6. Davidindallas

    Davidindallas Formula Junior

    Nov 5, 2003
    343
    What little data I have found regarding performance suggests the cars are virtually identical. One book claims the 365 is a tick or two quicker up to sixty. Both are listed in US trim with 320 hp. I think the C4 was the first ferrari to have to deal with restrictions on emissions in US offering. I have driven a C4 and thought it sounded great and wasn't tough to drive but it had a lot of flat spots. The car seemed altogether tired. I suppose a car in better tune may be a different experience. It was neat but not noticeably fast, if that makes sense. I've never driven or ridden in a 365 2+2. The lines are nice and classic to me, but the C4 has a more sproting look (and the rear fold down seat is neat). I suppose both of them are a safe investment at this point, but the service on the earlier car seems simpler.
     
  7. Bryanp

    Bryanp F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 13, 2002
    3,703
    Santa Fe, NM
    tough call, David
    I think all of the points raised pro and con for each car are valid. I think it depends ultimately on which one appeals more to your gut. On the empirical side of the equation, even if the HPs are the same, I have to believe that the power-to-weight ratio of the C4 is significantly better than the 2+2. I love my 2+2, but it is a big damn car. While its size is deceiving (it definitely picks up and moves for such a big beast), I can't imagine that you could throw it around to the extent that you could with a C4 - I've never driven a C4. While the C4 can't be described as a pure sports car, it is more so than the 2+2. In the latest Forza there is a good article about a guy who tracks his C4 (not race-prepped, though) at Lime Rock and gives a nice, balanced opinion of C4 ownership.

    The looks of the cars are obviously quite different and representative of entirely different Pininfarina design philosophies - there are die-hard fans of both; I happen to like the looks of the great touring Pininfarina designs of the 1960s culminating the 2+2 and not so much of the 70s.

    One of the real joys of owning the 2+2 has turned out to be my ability to carry 4 adults in comfort - not something I thought a whole lot about when I was shopping. I call the interior of my 2+2 the 'living room.' It really depends on how you're going to use the car.

    As far as 'ease of working on the car' goes. . . While the 2+2 is prabably marginally easier to work on, I find generally that people who enjoy working on vintage Ferraris are not really put off by the the relative difficulty of the job; they may even relish it more the more complex the task. I definitely respect a guy who does his own valve adjustment on a C4!
     
  8. Bryan

    Bryan Formula 3

    FYI. I have tracked the Ferrari Market Letter Asking Price Index on a number of cars for the last 10 years, including the 2+2 and the C4.



    Over the last 5 years...

    The C4 has been in a trading range (50-60k US$)

    The 2+2 has increased from a low of $38k in Jan 2001 to a high of $54k in Dec 2003.

    Recognize the Asking Price for what it is, nothing more.

    Past performance is no indication of future appreciation...etc.
     

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