458 brake failure | FerrariChat

458 brake failure

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by ATran, Jul 23, 2017.

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  1. ATran

    ATran Rookie

    Jul 23, 2017
    2
    Hi All!
    Have anyone have information on the 458 brake failure? I have this happen to me twice. I was driving on a mountain road, about 1 hr into spirited driving the brake just failed. I stepped on the brake and nothing happen. I had to use engine braking and stepped really hard in the brake to slow it down. I lost all the confidence in the car after that. Any one know what the issue is and how to fix it? I drove slowly for 10 minutes then the brake came back normal. Thanks!
     
  2. Hoagers

    Hoagers Karting

    Dec 4, 2016
    166
    Maybe if you were to provide some background and details you could expect some advice or support?
     
  3. MalibuGuy

    MalibuGuy F1 Veteran

    Sep 18, 2007
    5,280
    I think that your problem needs to be sorted out with a mechanical inspection.

    I wouldn't just assume that this is normal.

    Get things sorted out.something is wrong.
     
  4. hmfic1

    hmfic1 Karting

    Aug 15, 2011
    165
    Scottsdale
    Full Name:
    Jerry
    lets see, first post, not subscribed, and brakes are failing, have driven my 458 pretty hard at times, and never had any kind of brake problem. seems we have a few people coming on here with all kinds of strange problems then never appearing again. Have never had anyone talk about brake failure, specially just running hard on public roads.
    like to see his car????
     
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  5. SAFE4NOW

    SAFE4NOW F1 Veteran
    Sponsor Owner

    Aug 25, 2004
    5,378
    Dallas Texas
    Full Name:
    If you know you know
    Shoot me the last 6 of your VIN in a private message, let me see what I can bring up for you.

    Though, to answer your question, you should take it to a qualified Ferrari technician for inspection immediately. This does not occur often enough for the internet to diagnose for you < wink >

    Please be careful!

    S
     
  6. 458trofeo

    458trofeo F1 Rookie

    Feb 4, 2013
    4,426
    City of Angels
    Full Name:
    101 aki
    Prius ;)
     
  7. ATran

    ATran Rookie

    Jul 23, 2017
    2
    Thanks for all the advice. I'm scheduling service and inspection with Ferrari dealership. Will what they can find. I found a few links on similar issues when I google it but don't know how real they are. I have a black 2011 with 8k miles on it. Thanks!
     
  8. daflk

    daflk Formula Junior

    Jan 27, 2013
    257
    Hong Kong
    Do a forum check. I ran into same problem. Resolved after full bleed and fluid top up and fixing a caliper issue. Entropy is the brake expert.

    Sent from my SM-G9350 using Tapatalk
     
  9. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2008
    98,537
    Vegas baby
    To me this sounds like the brake booster or master cylinder problem.

    This is a fixable problem. IMO, if this happened to me twice I'd be towing it ASAP to the repair shop.
     
  10. Cigarzman

    Cigarzman F1 Veteran
    Owner Rossa Subscribed


    I think I would have it towed after the first episode. Call me crazy.
     
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  11. andrewecd

    andrewecd Formula Junior

    Dec 17, 2006
    539
    Sydney
    Full Name:
    Andrew
    My friend had same thing going into an intersection in black 458. Narrowly avoided a massive accident by swerving all over the intersection. Brake pedal was rock hard then later brakes worked fine again? Ferrari said nothing wrong with the brakes. He did not accept their verdict. His life (and others) were nearly ended that day so he refused to drive it ever again. Sold car back to F and bought a McLaren.
    There are several reports of 458's with brake problems, including now that 488 in Portugal.
    Never heard of any such problems with 360 or 430, only 458??
    Am in the market for a 458 but this issue is of real concern to me.
    If you have any more news on the outcome of your brake problem please let us know.
     
  12. Tides

    Tides Karting

    Sep 5, 2015
    53


    It was likely to be brake fluid boiling after spirited acceleration and braking - brake fluid is hygroscopic and will absorb water over time which reduces boiling point - letting the brakes cool down allows the compressible vapor to condense again and return to a non compressible fluid - thats why changing the brake fluid is a prerequisite at the 1 or2 year service period or before any track use.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  13. Need4Spd

    Need4Spd F1 Veteran

    Feb 24, 2007
    6,644
    Silicon Valley


    Interesting theory. CCBs don't fade hardly at all, so I can see a scenario where the brakes get hot enough to boil fluid that's been sitting too long or had absorbed water, yet the driver can't feel it coming because there is no fade leading up to it.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
  14. Ash Patel

    Ash Patel Formula Junior

    Dec 12, 2015
    536
    Stockholm, Sweden
    to me it sounds like the brake fluid needs to be replaced....
     
  15. of2worlds

    of2worlds F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 6, 2004
    16,445
    ON
    Full Name:
    CH
    Wasn't there an Italia intermittent brake failure problem noted a few years ago. It was only during certain slow speed turns as I recall. Seemed to be a big deal at the time and then it has been forgotten with no comments about the issue since then?
     
  16. Melvok

    Melvok F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jul 25, 2008
    14,101
    Amersfoort, The Netherlands, Europe.
    Full Name:
    Mel
    #16 Melvok, Jul 27, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017

    I had a break failure on Hockenheim Circuit in 2016 after 10 laps hard driving.

    After 100 mtrs, brakes were full back again every new round. At every same hairpin, the brakes went down again for 8 more rounds.

    After ending the trackday, no more problems occurred, also not on the way back to my country and until now no problem...

    So no boiling fluids at all, that was ruled out.

    At the track I stayed in race modus... Mechanics noted that this had happenend in 458 Chalenges also, had to put manettino in ESC OFF ...

    So it may also be an ECU problem ...
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  17. koop

    koop Formula Junior

    Apr 30, 2011
    811
    Did the pedal sink to the floor or did it feel like pressing into a brick?
     
  18. Melvok

    Melvok F1 World Champ
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    Jul 25, 2008
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    #18 Melvok, Jul 27, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Right to the floor ... :D

    Between #4 and #6 I was doing over 220 kms/hr speed ...

    After 10th lap, every time at #6 the hairpin 2-3 x braking and then ... to the floor ...

    But after turning and following towards #7 -100 mtrs- it was O.K. again ...

    So ... absolutely not boiling brakefluid ...
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  19. 100badboy100

    100badboy100 Formula Junior
    Owner

    Sep 15, 2016
    825
    Devon- U.K.
    Full Name:
    Michael
    That doesn't inspire much confidence in buying a 458 if you can't stop the thing! Enough of these issues may have an impact on prices.....

    I seem to recall another thread on here recently where someone was looking for Information on 458 break failure. Maybe worth a search for that.

    Regards

    Michael

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  20. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2011
    7,658
    Bournemouth, UK
    Something similar happened to a 458 at one of our track days; the pedal would get particularly long at the end of the long straight and then would come back again during the lap. The club's resident Ferrari specialist who was on the spot said that it was overheating brake fluids after examining the car. You need racing fluids for such use, but they are bad for every day use and corrupt the circuit.
     
  21. exoticcardreamer

    exoticcardreamer Formula 3

    Dec 9, 2014
    1,051
    usa
    Full Name:
    doesitmatter
    This happened recently. his brakes failed. He had them inspected the day before. it is currently under investigation.

    https://www.instagram.com/p/BWDW4XaBbv4/?taken-by=mazer327
     
  22. 100badboy100

    100badboy100 Formula Junior
    Owner

    Sep 15, 2016
    825
    Devon- U.K.
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    Michael
    Is this specific to the 458 and it's break set up or more about how it's being driven? Don't tend to hear of the issues with other models?

    Regards

    Michael

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  23. Melvok

    Melvok F1 World Champ
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    Jul 25, 2008
    14,101
    Amersfoort, The Netherlands, Europe.
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    Mel
    It definitively was NOT overheating fluids in my case ... it then would not recover within 100 mtrs said our mechanics.
     
  24. benny11_85308

    benny11_85308 Karting

    Dec 12, 2016
    139
    I just bought a 458 and when I looked at the maintenance records it had a nite on previous owner stated the brakes went to the floor. When I called the Ferrari dealer that did the service he mentioned to me that the brakes fluid needs to be changed and brakes bleed every 2 years as the fluid gets bad ( not the technical term). Maybe you just need a brake service

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  25. maxvonauto

    maxvonauto Karting
    Silver Subscribed

    May 23, 2015
    159
    Corona
    Full Name:
    Mark
    #25 maxvonauto, Jul 28, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    The brake booster is way up front and the vacuum line needs to run all the way from the engine. The vacuum is tapped from the right side manifold plenum where it proceeds thru a one way check valve and several snap connects before ending at the brake booster. This vacuum circuit needs to be checked for leaks and check valve failure. However, there's another vacuum circuit which works in parallel to generate and maintain vacuum to the booster when engine vacuum isn't enough. It uses the venturi principle to "hop up" the vacuum signal using a "jet pump" device. As the picture shows, the device has three connections; to booster, to clean outside air, to intake manifold. These little jet pumps devices also have check valves and other pieces that can fail. This circuit needs to be checked as well.

    Note: the jet pump (bad name) is mounted in front of the left side intake manifold plenum. Ferrari doesn't sell the valve separately but it's a common part and can be found pretty easy and cheap.
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