458 Electrical System Failure | Page 2 | FerrariChat

458 Electrical System Failure

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by graphicdisorder, Nov 17, 2016.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. 458trofeo

    458trofeo F1 Rookie

    Feb 4, 2013
    4,426
    City of Angels
    Full Name:
    101 aki
    Cool; my guess is that there is a glitch in the headlight direction mechanism.

    Btw is it the power steering which is also affected or is it the electric steering wheel adjustment system
    which enables one to adjust the steering wheel column's position with the toggle switch located on the
    left of the steering column?

    Lastly, if you have the electric seats do all the seat movement mechanisms operate correctly?

    Reason for me asking is that these functions seem to be correlated so it will be easier to diagnose
    a problem if one of the above is also affected.

    best
     
  2. graphicdisorder

    graphicdisorder Formula Junior

    Jan 11, 2015
    410
    Johnson City, TN
    Power steering as in the actual steering of the wheels not the motion of the steering wheel itself.

    I will check the seats, I never move them so that one I am not sure.

    Radio works, all other functions I have tried work. The car isn't even saying the power steering isn't working which I would have figured that would be a error itself.
     
  3. mike32

    mike32 F1 Veteran

    May 13, 2016
    5,951
    Isle of man- uk
    If you were going to change the battery you would disconnect it anyway, so try this on present one and see what happens- nothing to lose.
    The plug in trickle charger is ok but its not a bad idea to shut it off for a few days during the winter if the car is laid up- then connect a 4 amp charger and give it a decent top up. It helps to extend the battery life. When the car is in use the alternator charges the battery at a lot higher rate than 4 amps
     
    Melvok likes this.
  4. graphicdisorder

    graphicdisorder Formula Junior

    Jan 11, 2015
    410
    Johnson City, TN
    Replaced the battery yesterday, didn't fix the issues. Which sucks.
     
  5. 458trofeo

    458trofeo F1 Rookie

    Feb 4, 2013
    4,426
    City of Angels
    Full Name:
    101 aki
    Clearly not a battery problem, I am sure the dealer will sort it out,
    should be an easy issue to diagnose and fix.

    Graphic, I would also check the electric seat operation, the rear view mirror operation
    (including the electric folding option if you have it) and also if the electric steering wheel
    column adjustment mechanism is working.

    best
     
  6. spiders

    spiders Formula Junior

    Jun 8, 2012
    474
    There is a reboot procedure required to be done with battery replacement. It's detailed in your manual under "reconnecting the battery" (page 199). If the people who installed your new battery did not follow this procedure then the car will likely continue to show faults.
     
  7. Melvok

    Melvok F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jul 25, 2008
    14,261
    Amersfoort, The Netherlands, Europe.
    Full Name:
    Mel
    #32 Melvok, Nov 20, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2016
    Very true, good to mention that here spiders !!

    My WSM says:
    Each time the battery is connected to the electrical system of the vehicle, WAIT 1 MINUTE before inserting the key in the ignition switch and do not switch on any current consumers during this period. After inserting the ignition key, turn to "II" and WAIT AT LEAST 1 MINUTE before starting the engine.
    This procedure ensures that the ECUs in the vehicle are powered up and synchronised correctly, that all motorised valve aperture and closure travel parameters are self-acquired correctly and that AC ECU self-acquisition is performed correctly.
    These self-acquisition procedures are initiated each time the battery is connected to the vehicle.

    And:
    Restoring the self-adaptive parameters: Each time the battery is disconnected from the electrical system of the vehicle, all the self-acquisition
    parameters are cancelled from the ignition/injection ECU. These parameters must be restored before the vehicle is used again, proceeding as follows.
    The self-acquisition function of the Motronic ECUs will only be performed correctly at intake air temperatures above 5 °C.
    Ensure that the ambient air temperature is not below this value. Leave the engine stationary for approximately 10 minutes in the following conditions:
    engine at idle speed; water temperature stabilised; current consumers switched off (lights, windscreen wipers etc.); air conditioner off.
    These preparations allow the ECU to optimise the self-adaptive parameters quickly by preventing irregular engine operation.

    And also:
    Carry out the following operations before starting the engine: close the doors, the engine compartment lid and the luggage compartment lid, unlock and lock the doors with the remote control, set the date and time on the instrument panel, close the doors, raise the door windows to the upper limit and check that the
    windows drop to the target position when the doors are opened.
    If this procedure is not followed correctly, the buttons in the passenger compartment for opening the luggage compartment lid, locking/unlocking the doors and releasing the fuel filler flap will be disabled.
     
    DefunctNeurons likes this.
  8. graphicdisorder

    graphicdisorder Formula Junior

    Jan 11, 2015
    410
    Johnson City, TN
    I installed my own battery, the fault comes up immediately when the key is turned on. Prior to start. The car is due for oil change anyway so at this point ill get that handled and the dealer can look at this issue. I suspect something is up beyond voltage, remember the power steering is acting odd and the motorized headlights are not working either.
     
  9. graphicdisorder

    graphicdisorder Formula Junior

    Jan 11, 2015
    410
    Johnson City, TN
    Dealer picked up this am, so we will see.
     
  10. Corradosv

    Corradosv Karting

    Oct 17, 2016
    194
    Monaco MC
    Dear 458trofeo,

    does the Li-i battery work on the OEM car charging system or did you change anything else than just the battery? I assume at least you need a specific battery trickle?
    I have no issues so far but, as I use the car not so often, I may be interested in some more robust solution, like you say...
     
  11. Melvok

    Melvok F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jul 25, 2008
    14,261
    Amersfoort, The Netherlands, Europe.
    Full Name:
    Mel
    "Normal AGM" battery like the Factory installs serves you well !
     
    SoftwareDrone and Rexcat458 like this.
  12. Entropy

    Entropy Formula 3
    Owner

    Jul 10, 2008
    2,149
    Please keep us posted.

    As folks stated, having a low voltage (i.e. bad battery) situation can and will cause all sorts of alarm codes and issues. Fixing that (i.e. new battery) addresses the core issue if that's the problem, but you will likely need to clear the codes using a DEIS and do the ECU re-learning process, if only to make sure things boot up and synch properly. It's annoying, but a 2011 458 probably has a battery from 2010....so it's 6 years old. Even when on a tender, if the car is driven infrequently, it probably won't take a full charge anyway, and likely has a bad cell (just speculation on my part, but common)

    Remember too that some of the ECU's actually "learn" over time, ranging from the throttle potentiometers to the engine maps.

    I'm going to wager when they read the codes they will find another fault somewhere, as the steering (which you say is "off") is a physical/mechanical/hydraulic system. Just a guess, but it could be a power steering pump or pressure sensor, a booster/booster sensor, or a steering angle sensor (which, BTW, would influence the AFS position). Also, remember that AFS function is also "learned" and dependent on vehicle speed, steering angle and rate of steering angle.

    One aggravation in these cars is there could be 100 specific different errors that display as "electrical system failure", so you really need to see down into specific sensors.
     
  13. 458trofeo

    458trofeo F1 Rookie

    Feb 4, 2013
    4,426
    City of Angels
    Full Name:
    101 aki
    Hi Corrado, in order to use a Li-i battery you will have to use a specific Li-i charger as well
    as an adaptor for the charger to plug in the car, see my thread or MuratC's thread on the Li-i
    battery for more info or send me a pm

    very best
     
  14. Corradosv

    Corradosv Karting

    Oct 17, 2016
    194
    Monaco MC
    OK, so nothing on the car, just a specific charger + plug.
    Thanks a lot for your quick reply, that helps.
     
  15. Melvok

    Melvok F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jul 25, 2008
    14,261
    Amersfoort, The Netherlands, Europe.
    Full Name:
    Mel
    #40 Melvok, Nov 26, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    MADNESS !

    Yesterday .... no 458 starting possible ... 2 chargers installed an this morning: no start, eng failure, powersteering failure ....

    Got myself a 74 amps battery which cost me Euro 98 incl VAT.

    Installed it, waited 5 mins .... the screens suddenly popped up and ..... all problems vanished !

    2 x half an hour work .... and lots of fun doing it all yourself !

    Foto session will come in my thread YOLO soon. You may see lots of usefull tips there :D
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  16. 458trofeo

    458trofeo F1 Rookie

    Feb 4, 2013
    4,426
    City of Angels
    Full Name:
    101 aki
    Proud of you Mel!!!! :) xoxoxo
     
  17. graphicdisorder

    graphicdisorder Formula Junior

    Jan 11, 2015
    410
    Johnson City, TN
    Dealer reported to me a bit ago they figured it out. It's a short in the head light assembly.
     
  18. Melvok

    Melvok F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jul 25, 2008
    14,261
    Amersfoort, The Netherlands, Europe.
    Full Name:
    Mel
    Good news I hope, was it fixed now ?

    Can you tell us a bit more when you have all info on this please ?
     
  19. graphicdisorder

    graphicdisorder Formula Junior

    Jan 11, 2015
    410
    Johnson City, TN
    Headlight had to be ordered, it was $5300 roughly just for that. Plus diagnostic time. So time ship there and back and such I am around 8k on this one since I also had them do the yearly service while at it.
     
  20. 458trofeo

    458trofeo F1 Rookie

    Feb 4, 2013
    4,426
    City of Angels
    Full Name:
    101 aki
    Happy problem was diagnosed; gotta pay to play!
    xoxo
     
  21. spiders

    spiders Formula Junior

    Jun 8, 2012
    474
    These things can happen. It's good to have the problem identified and corrected. Have fun and enjoy the car!
     
  22. graphicdisorder

    graphicdisorder Formula Junior

    Jan 11, 2015
    410
    Johnson City, TN
    For sure, just glad it wasn't something more major.
     
  23. Melvok

    Melvok F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jul 25, 2008
    14,261
    Amersfoort, The Netherlands, Europe.
    Full Name:
    Mel
    Ask for the headlight part ....

    Maybe good to try and find out WHAT inside of this unit was faulty ? AFS system ?

    More often it is something very small ... it's only a light unit ....
     
  24. graphicdisorder

    graphicdisorder Formula Junior

    Jan 11, 2015
    410
    Johnson City, TN
    Oh for sure, I will be requesting the part. I will either sell it or attempt to fix it and sell it.
     
  25. AlfistaPortoghese

    AlfistaPortoghese Moderator
    Lifetime Rossa

    Mar 18, 2014
    3,778
    Europe, but not by much.
    Full Name:
    Nuno
    OUCH! Never thought a fault in the headlight assembly could:

    1) Be THAT expensive.
    2) Throw those error codes.

    As stated previously by other members, it's better to know and it's great that it is something relatively simple. Better to spend that ammount in the car that you love, than in hospital.

    Kind regards,

    Nuno.
     

Share This Page