Will this make the 458 depreciate more slowly? Not sure what this has to do with this thread. Should be posted in classifieds...no? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sorry. Yes I agree, did not know there was a classified section, but was trying to give heads up to 458 owners.
i honestly think its holding value well because the 488 was a bit of a disappointment for enthusiasts. similar to how the current bmw m3 received poor reviews for being more refined and turbocharged. im waiting to see what the 488 replacement will be. if its some sort of hybrid/turbo setup i think the purists will make the 458 value rise.. especially for the well cared for and well optioned cars (carbon seats being a major one)
I agree with you on the M3 history. The previous NA engine was much more endearing. We are seeing NA engines still going strong with Lambo, Audi (R8), and now Lexus is joining the trend with the LC500. I highly doubt the 488's replacement will return to NA or even a hybrid (taking the glory of the laFerrari). The current turbo set up will still have room for bigger numbers for those who care about them over anything else. It will keep up with the upcoming McLaren 720s. If NA is your thing, the 458 will be a treasure to own for years to come. IMHO, the 458 has just the right mix of simplicity and technology - a very key factor in long term ownership and value. (Even if you don't care about depreciation, long term reliability is a prerequisite to hassle-free enjoyment.)
Other than enthusiasts, most people can't tell close models from the next, e.g. 458 from 488, 360 from 430. In fact, most people, upon seeing a 458 and 360 together, just think one is a different current model, not that they're from different years. Especially if they're both red.
I must say, same situation is in Europe too, which is quite unusual! There are various reasons for that, one of them is that 488 is not "better" in all fields compared to 458, so current 458 owners are not so eager to get new & better in everything 488. Also, collectors are not so much into 488, because they all know lame turbo sound and oversized scoops are not something that will be highly appreciated in future. On other side, when 488 successor comes out, I expect big 488 depreciation so it will be great value for money!
+458. Hold on to your 458, take proper care of it and enjoy it like Enzo intended if he was alive. In fact, it is my humble opinion Enzo would have been especially proud of the 458. A car I think Enzo would have built to his image if he was alive. Time will reward and add grace to the 458. Usually, talk about depreciation or appreciation (as well as collectability) of a Ferrari only come into play well after a particular model has ceased production. The fact that we're talking about this so soon and that car magazines are already talking about it is a sign of how special the 458 is and will be in the future. Kind regards, Nuno.
Prices still holding firm and going nowhere in my neck of the woods, even though the Summer is almost here and there's no shortage of 488s. I see the 458 Spider holding its value better and higher, although a well optioned Italia with few owners and less mileage to have almost the same asking price. Supply is more or less the same, demand is strong and steady. Design and engine are the two major reasons friends tell me it makes the 458's values behave like they do on the market, and precisely the main 2 reasons why the 488 didn't have the same universal acclaim the 458 had upon its launch: people don't see the next model as being better/significantly improved/game-changing/groundbreaking in those two areas, as the 458 was in regard to the 430. I've been with a 488 last week, and indeed I don't like the sound or the side scoop that completely spoils the design continuity. It seems like an engineer told the rest of the team assembling the car that two scoops had to be fitted at any cost, and that's the best they could do. Anyway, it's my firm belief that had the reason why 458 prices are dropping more slowly than any other car is because owners genuinely love them, don't part ways with them at any cost and aren't entirely sure the replacement model is worth it. Kind regards, Nuno.
The 488 is definitely 'better' in most of the quantifiably objective ways. But it's character is so very different, and arguably less desirable amongst petrolheads when it comes to the subjective 'measures' of visceral and emotive feel when laying it's power down. The 458 is beautiful where the 488 is edgy and aggressive. The 458 is spine tingling, when the 488 is brutal. The 458 is a scalpel, where the 488 is a Gerbers survival knife. That the 458 was the first Ferrari to provide the assurance of the standard 7year service-plan gives potential owners an indication of minimum reliability expected - only a good thing that mitigates ownership worry. Whilst Ferrari made the 488 muscular and very up-to-date design wise, Pininfarina did a better job in penning the 458 with beautifully feminine lines. A 458 is always a 'she' when the 488 is debatable. And in history, the most desirable cars are almost always judged firstly on looks - quantifiable performance numbers are irrelevant. Uniqueness of engineering is also of interest. The 488 will be superceded and all but forgotten when the next mid-engined Ferrari is faster and 'better' than the 488 through improved tuning. However, the 4.5 V8 will never be improved on in its NA guise - Last of a line, last of an era, never to be repeated.
Subjectivity is just that and should be treated as such - look at this painting selling for $110M - https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2017/may/19/basquiat-110m-dollar-sale-proof-of-art-growing-attraction-to-super-rich I wouldn't have that in my bathroom but to each his own. So on matters that are quantifiable - The 458 was the first Ferrari that could actually be driven for any distance more than a few miles past your foreign mechanics garage. they finally took a page from Ducati and realized that pure "good looks" aren't a great business model then focused on actually building a product with performance AND reliability in mind while also incorporating a maintenance schedule that's not silly. As said most people can't tell the difference between a 360/430/458 all they care about is what they think it costs and that it is red. The 458 will retain it's value for a long time unless we hit a serious business downturn which is also a real possibility then they will be all but worthless. The 488 will fade into obscurity not because it's not a wonderfully designed car and quite capable but because it adds little additional story, nothing new, nothing exciting. It is a slight evolution to a gorgeous design. It is faster, quicker, handles better, but its only by margins that mortals simply don't care about. The whole turbo thing is only conversational a simple imaginary line in the sand so people can draw sides and bicker. What comes next - in reality what comes next is whatever Ferrari thinks will sell and marketing to bolster than position. You can be sure that whatever it is it will fall onto serious criticism no less than what the Mac 720 has seen. Those who aren't in a position to purchase will do all they can to subjectively skewer it so they look superior, those that can afford and it choose to purchase it will "want to give it a try" and you can be sure it will sell out regardless of looks/performance/durability that has been and will be Ferrari's future
Quite simply the 458, more specifically the Speciale, will go down in history as one of the top 10 cars in Ferrari history. Past, present or future. I suggest purchasing a Speciale and putting it away forever. You are looking at another F40.
The F12 also is holding value pretty well compared to previous V12s. Both 458 and F12 reached the time they should have been hit by depreciation when there was (for whatever reason) a speculative wave pushing up all used / old Ferrari values. Any Ferrari bought 4-5 years ago has been a good investment and this has also favourably impacted the recent cars. Not sure it means anything about the intrinsic historical value of 458 and F12 (which are very good cars without any doubt). They just just do not follow the regular value pattern of used Ferrari because of unusual circumstances. The 355 and 550 Maranello, both real milestones in Ferrari history in my opinion, saw initially their values beaten up as used cars, just because there was not a speculative bubble at the same time.
The other factor at work is that the most recent generations, 458s and F12s, don't have what "normal" people would view as the insane maintenance issues of prior generations. No engine-out routines like 355s, no timing belt changes like 550s or 360s, etc., making prior generation cars relatively easier to buy, but more expensive to maintain.
Here are some auction results on 2013 458 Spyders. Cond rating 1 threw 5 5-17-17 9k miles 205K Cond 4.3 4-20-17 12k, 191K 3.4 1-24-17 4k, 225K N/A 1-12-17 16K 201K 2.8 1-5-17 2k 223K 5.0
Pretty stable, consistent and high. In line with what I've been seeing over here as well. Kind regards, Nuno.
Hi Nuno, I am most likely the only member without a Ferrari. I started few months back looking at 360s then 430 and now 458s. Think I going back to the 430s. But still undecided.
Dealer is usually at least 10-15% and more if Ferrari certified used. I would be very careful with auction since there is a reason why they are cheaper. If it's your first Ferrari get it from the dealer. I found the hard way after purchasing one from a Florida non Ferrari dealership (never will do that again) unless u live in Florida. In Florida it does not have to pass emissions. Bring it to Texas and it failed emissions. Can't drive it until it's fixed. My uneducated buy. That was the 360 which I traded it a year later for a 430 which was a great car. Then made another big mistake to test drive a 458. Now I have a 458. Maybe 488 next, but after test driving the 488 in Vegas I decided to keep my 458 spider. I really do believe 458 is a true V8 iconic Ferrari. Can't get enough of it. I smile when I look at her. And yes always get red. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
This thread is very "of the moment" for me, I've had the privilege of owning an F430 spider for the last 2 years, in that time I've had people believe it's brand new because I routinely use my Ferrari seat cover to protect my much loved cream carbon race seats, I've loved owning and driving it, alway an occasion, even to just look at, yet I remember 10 years ago thinking it wasn't pleasing on the eye, never thought I'd be lucky enough to own a Ferrari at that time either! now I find them stunning to look at, a piece of automotive art no question. However I'm now considering a 458 or 488, last Friday I test drove both for the 1st time at my local Ferrari main dealer and these are my thoughts in brief. 488 looks more masculine, like the 430 is to the 360, hence, the 488 edges it. the 488 drives like a modern car, all very easy, could have been a high end German car, sound better than expected because of what I had read, loved it to be honest but I am concerned about depreciation, which some here think should not be a factor. 458 was more eager, edgy, small inputs on the throttle was all it needed to take off, certainly not dated, again, another piece of Ferrari art. Looking at the UK market I see no signs of softening 458 prices any time soon, however there are people predicting that after the August factory holiday closure when Ferrari go to max production on the 488 line, (no more Cali's to slow things down either) 458 owners will start to receive their new 488's and the 458 prices will drop toward the end of the year due to there availability, personally, that would be great for me, but the 458 is just so universally liked that the demand will always be there even with a few more to choose from, so I don't buy in to that train of thought. Whatever price bracket a 458 is in today's market will hold solid for a very long time, which makes it a far better proposition, especially as my F430 has increased in value and will certainly not drop in the next few years and as such I've grown accustomed to this Ferrari phenomenon of values holding/increasing and is a factor, but don't judge me, I joined Ferrari UK Owners Club as soon as I bought in, share many special memories, entered a Concourse event etc. and don't ever see a time when I don't own a Ferrari. Can't sign off without thanking you all hole heartedly for all your 458 insights and experiences, it's certainly helping my impending decision. Sorry I couldn't deliver an equally eloquent linguistic written account!!
recent manheim results are strong for 2010 models Image Unavailable, Please Login Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Keyword "auction". Not for me. I have others things to worry about like if it's gonna rain when I drive my spider.
I would never buy a Ferrari from an auction ...here in miami they play around with the odometer too much
It's not only in Miami. But odometer is not the only thing I would worry about. It's the "minor" unreported repairs. Unless you are a mechanic and have the time and knowledge to take apert your car when and not if something goes wrong. I am talking from 360 experience. Old saying "if something sounds too good to be true..."
