488 Rear Wheel Fell Off!!! | FerrariChat

488 Rear Wheel Fell Off!!!

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by Live Wire, Jun 26, 2018.

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  1. Live Wire

    Live Wire Rookie

    Mar 3, 2018
    20
    Full Name:
    MICHAEL P.
    I have a 2018 488 GTB. We had a track day on Friday. We had several lapping sessions and the lugs were tightened at least 3 times. At the end of the day while leaving the track the driver's side rear wheel came off!
    All the lugs came loose, fell out and the hub fell down onto the bottom of the rim, literally within 300 yards of the paddock. Luckily, I was only going about 15 MPH while leaving the property.
    Ferrari is looking into it. But so far no answer as to why. Has anyone else experienced very loose lugs after lapping? The sponsor had a guy with a torque wrench hitting the cars after nearly every session.
    Needless to say i am a bit concerned and it could have been so much worse at 150 MPH instead of 15 MPH.
    I was just wondering if i am alone with this issue?
     
  2. dustman

    dustman F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Jun 12, 2007
    8,935
    Most likely human error, they forgot to fully tighten.
     
  3. Live Wire

    Live Wire Rookie

    Mar 3, 2018
    20
    Full Name:
    MICHAEL P.
    I watched him go around my car and hit every nut on all 4 wheels, before we started and at least 2 more times during the day.
     
    mrmanny599 likes this.
  4. LVP488

    LVP488 F1 Rookie

    Jan 21, 2017
    4,839
    France
    I once had an issue with a 575, one lug dropped and the others came lose; the wheel began to move and I stopped when noticing the noise (strangely from the inside of the car the wheel moving was not really felt apart from the noise, it was on a short and slow track).
    Most probably the lugs were not properly tighten during the previous replacement of the F1 hydraulic pump (for which the rear wheel had to be removed).
    Never had the problem with any car apart from this case.
     
  5. 09Scuderia

    09Scuderia Formula 3

    Nov 20, 2011
    2,421
    USA
    Full Name:
    Max
    torque wrench. Get one, use it. We did a track day recently. Checked the lugs before and after. After ALL the front ones needed retorquing.

    I was told that the Ti lugs do not have this issue.
     
    Chizz likes this.
  6. klinkman

    klinkman Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 29, 2018
    537
    Full Name:
    Eric
    Another answer is the torque wrench wasn't set correctly or is not calibrated correctly. Using a torque wrench to loosen lug nuts can screw them up for example. It's pretty unusual but it does happen.
     
  7. davidoloan

    davidoloan Formula Junior

    May 6, 2009
    584
    Full Name:
    David
    Did he use a torque wrench?
     
  8. 'Trust'

    'Trust' Karting
    Rossa Subscribed

    Jul 31, 2012
    215
    What did he torque the lugs to?

    Stock or aftermarket lugs? It’s almost certainly a torquing issue, however alloy differences could make a difference with expansion and contraction rates with the heat. Doubtful to that level tho.
     
  9. dustman

    dustman F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Jun 12, 2007
    8,935
    And yet there was a mistake. Torque wrench, human error?
     
    Melvok likes this.
  10. Solid State

    Solid State F1 Veteran
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 4, 2014
    9,586
    Full Name:
    Maximus Decimus Meridius
    Torque wrenches only work well when used properly. Torque in stages and go around at least twice (180 degrees alternating) after reaching proper setting. Most wrenches read English and metric scales so that's a common mistake area. Also, torque values are set to specific thread conditions - dry or lubed (and what kind of lube). Makes a huge difference. Another area specific to wheel lug torque is the mating surface between the shoulder of the lug and the wheel lug tapered opening. That area must be dry and clean because that is where the torque is set. Finally, if the aluminum wheel was once over torqued then the lug opening will never meet the shoulder of the lug at the correct point and the proper torque will not be achieved.
     
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  11. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    26,292
    socal
    There are many reasons that can happen. The top of the list is operator error. I have been racing for 20 years. Have been through 6 Ferraris on a Ferrari racecar. Never made that mistake. Post back what Ferrari says about the issue.
     
    Bas likes this.
  12. s313

    s313 Rookie

    Oct 9, 2015
    29
    How many foot-pounds of torque do the stud bolts require? Owner's manual has an indication (100Nm) for the spare wheel, not sure if it would be same for a standard wheel.
     
  13. elt360

    elt360 Karting

    Mar 27, 2013
    132
    uk
    Full Name:
    paul elton
    74 ft/lbs
     
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  14. s313

    s313 Rookie

    Oct 9, 2015
    29
    74 ft/lbs = 100Nm

    So is 74 ft/lbs the indication on a standard (not the spare) wheel?
     
  15. Viperjoe

    Viperjoe F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Yes


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
  16. s313

    s313 Rookie

    Oct 9, 2015
    29
    Thanks!
     
  17. Melvok

    Melvok F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jul 25, 2008
    14,101
    Amersfoort, The Netherlands, Europe.
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    Mel
    Was a proper torque wrench used Michael ?
     
  18. buddyg

    buddyg F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Sep 20, 2004
    5,446
    West Michigan
    Full Name:
    Buddy
    If your doing a track event you should have your own torque wrench. I would torque my wheels before every session, why put your life in someone else’s hands?
     
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  19. andrewecd

    andrewecd Formula Junior

    Dec 17, 2006
    539
    Sydney
    Full Name:
    Andrew
    Have you had your rims painted or powder coated recently?
     
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  20. nmcclure

    nmcclure Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 13, 2014
    436
    TX
    factory wheels? I see sometimes people mix cone and ball seat nuts/lugs and it will cause an issue. Also, if the wheel was put on, and then torqued on the ground and in a bind, and wasnt square to the hub, this will happen.

    That said, and some who has been tracking and racing for years, I've never seen a wheel fall off for any reason other than human error or car to car/wall contact.
     
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  21. Melvok

    Melvok F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jul 25, 2008
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    Amersfoort, The Netherlands, Europe.
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    Well Michael ? How about the input of other driers ?
     
  22. Need4Spd

    Need4Spd F1 Veteran

    Feb 24, 2007
    6,644
    Silicon Valley
    Yep.

    As for OP, I have no more to add to the above. I don’t see how this could happen apart from operator error or a torque wrench that’s lost its calibration.

    Sent from my iPad using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
  23. Live Wire

    Live Wire Rookie

    Mar 3, 2018
    20
    Full Name:
    MICHAEL P.
    Sorry for the delay to the questions.
    The car is 2018 factory rims, Diamond finish style.
    The torque wrench was set to 100Nm.
    It was a Ferrari dealership sponsored event and all the cars there were Ferraris. Including some Challenge cars.
    The guy on the torque wrench is the Service Dept. manager at the dealership with years of experience with these cars.
    20 minute lapping sessions.
    Like i said before, i personally watched him torque my wheels as well as the other cars.
    The word from Maranello was they think it has something to do with the traction control working the back wheels in Race mode. They have recommended to have the dealers put oil/lube on the seat of the lugs prior to track events (I guess to let them slip rather than loosen?) then remove the oil after tracking.I am not making this up.My guess is they will have a new set of lugs coming out soon. I can't be the only person having this issue.
    I will let you know if i hear anymore. In the mean time I have purchased a torque wrench and i will be double checking myself and i would recommend you all do too.
    I don't think the ABS and traction control works too well with no wheels. :)
     
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  24. Live Wire

    Live Wire Rookie

    Mar 3, 2018
    20
    Full Name:
    MICHAEL P.
    Here is the picture. Luckily, i was only going 15MPH on the way out of the circuit. Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  25. JohnTz

    JohnTz Karting

    Jun 21, 2018
    212
    Inverness, IL
    Full Name:
    John Tz
    Curious were the marks on the bumper caused by the bolts shooting off or from something else.

    Wet vs. dry bolts will greatly effect the torque reading.
     

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