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488 tensioner failure

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by Atlplastic, Dec 23, 2020.

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  1. Atlplastic

    Atlplastic Rookie

    Dec 23, 2020
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    Robert A Colgrove Jr
    #1 Atlplastic, Dec 23, 2020
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 23, 2020
    Took my 488 in for the routine service. Gear belt was changed. Less than 50 miles later the belt was shredded. Car was towed on flatbed. I was told the tensioner failed and it was not under warranty. Has anyone else dealt with this?
    $4000 bill
     
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  3. TheMayor

    TheMayor Eight Time F1 World Champ
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    There's not enough information here to give an opinion on. I suggest you add more details about the car and its warranty status, what you requested to be done originally and what was carried out, if the work was done by a dealer, what the damage was after the incident, and repost it in the 488 section.
     
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  4. Atlplastic

    Atlplastic Rookie

    Dec 23, 2020
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    Robert A Colgrove Jr
    Will do
    I was notified that the annual service was due. It was performed at the dealer. Also replaced the battery at my expense. The damage can be detailed in the service record which I will provide. Basically the belts and mechanical systems that supply the power steering, water pump and alternator were wiped out. Unable to drive car
     
  5. Atlplastic

    Atlplastic Rookie

    Dec 23, 2020
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    Robert A Colgrove Jr
    The two year extended warranty was purchased in May 2020 when I bought the car at the dealer. It was a Ferrari warranty
     
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  6. TheMayor

    TheMayor Eight Time F1 World Champ
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    Power train warranty? Why the hell would they not honor it?

    Your first post looked suspicious because you said "gear belt" and tensioner. Most would think the valves would be smashed. No way $4 grand would cover that.
     
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  8. greyboxer

    greyboxer F1 World Champ

    Dec 8, 2004
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    Thus has been posted as a poll so you are inviting opinions: go up the foodchain - it just does not feel right both from a servicing point of view and a warranty aspect - at the very least it feels like some goodwill either from the dealer or importer (FNA ?) is appropriate

    BUT there are often threads like this where we are not initially given the full story so that's a caveat here
     
  9. Atlplastic

    Atlplastic Rookie

    Dec 23, 2020
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    Robert A Colgrove Jr
    They are talking about some Goodwill but I’m not sure how much. I will be happy to post an exact copy of the service record during the initial service and then when return for repairs
    I will let the service repair records speak for themselves.
     
  10. MANDALAY

    MANDALAY F1 Veteran
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    ??? You bought the car and extended 2 year warrantee in May 2020 .

    If the yearly service was due now its still covered by the warrantee , so whats the issue ??

    The change the tensioner due to being slack and not in spec. Put a new one it fails , Their issue change all for free.

    Why not ?

    Something isnt right.
     
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  11. wthensler

    wthensler Formula 3
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    Dealer should cover costs.

    I’d almost put that into the infant mortality bucket. No way a belt tensioner should fail on a car that new. Also a bit suspicious it coincided with the belt change.

    When my old BMW was coming up on 300,000 miles, I realized I’d never changed pulleys and tensioner, so I want ahead and did them.

    The old ones were fine......
     
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  13. Atlplastic

    Atlplastic Rookie

    Dec 23, 2020
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    Robert A Colgrove Jr
    Exactly those are my thoughts
    They have agreed to some goodwill compensation but have not told me how much yet. Nothing was offered until I voiced my concerns
     
  14. MANDALAY

    MANDALAY F1 Veteran
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    Where are you from?

    Your comments of goodwill have nothing to do with regards to do this based on what you have said.

    They installed a new tensioner , it failed , they repair and pay for EVERYTHING . Seriously that's it.

    The only time i have seen this failure so early was when the bolt holding the tensioner wasn't torqued down properly and loosened + disaster
     
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  15. mdrums

    mdrums Formula 3

    Jun 11, 2006
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    Atlplastic none of this makes any sense that this repair is not under warranty.

    You have Ferrari warranty plus the Ferrari dealer did the belt install? This seems to be 100% warranty with out an issue....something seems to be missing here

    are you in the USA? What dealer did the work?
    Is your car modified that Ferrari voided warranty?

    I’m totally lost....
     
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  16. ipsedixit

    ipsedixit Formula Junior

    How is any Pista still not under the original OEM factory warranty?

    Why is the extended warranty even an issue?

    So many oddities about this.
     
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  17. Atlplastic

    Atlplastic Rookie

    Dec 23, 2020
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    Robert A Colgrove Jr
    Gentlemen I will upload a copy of the two service records shortly so you will have further insight into the situation. I am in Atlanta Georgia.I agree with everything that has been said. I have argued the same with the dealer.
     
  18. Atlplastic

    Atlplastic Rookie

    Dec 23, 2020
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    Robert A Colgrove Jr
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  19. MANDALAY

    MANDALAY F1 Veteran
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    OK just gone over your paperwork.

    Question did you buy the car from that dealer ?

    If so why /who advised you to buy the power warrantee ? Or was it offered to you ?

    It smells to me. Because being a 2017 its advisable to buy the FULL OEM warrantee. Were you advised about that and declined ? Or was it never brought to your attention ?

    Frankly if it is the dealers car they knew there was an issue as they would have inspected the car. And frankly it failed still under the original 3 year warrantee.

    IMO you have been taken for a ride. I wouldn't pay for that , never . Frankly they observed errors in the battery i would NOT have paid for that either.

    This dealer IMO are full of it and taking you for a ride . I wouldn't pay anything and get a solicitor.
     
  20. gsholz

    gsholz Karting
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    My guess is the new belt was not seated properly and then shredded within a few miles. Of course, they would not admit to that. Did they show you the failed tensioner?

    I had something similar happen at a Jeep dealer. Brought the Jeep in for warranty replacement of a noisy water pump. My accessory belt shredded after 20 miles and car overheated. Dealer picked up the car and claimed the power steering pump had locked up. Just an excuse for sloppy work. It still had the old power steering pump when I picked it up again.
     
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  21. Chadly

    Chadly Formula Junior

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    Buying extended warranties are worthless... They always have a reason for not covering stuff. My CPO car is/was in worse shape than my 7 owner car, yet that's all they brought up on how special it was being CPO. My fault for trusting a large dealer across the country and buying site unseen. It's all a racket if you ask me. You are getting screwed.
     
  22. Chasing Ferrari

    Dec 18, 2016
    49
    if this is not covered, i dont know whats the warranty for.....
     
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  23. Atlplastic

    Atlplastic Rookie

    Dec 23, 2020
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    Robert A Colgrove Jr
    Car was purchased in Fort Lauderdale and as I recall that was the warranty offered. The power warranty. I don’t remember discussion of other warranties
    I appreciate everyone’s comments. I will update on the final outcome. Hope everyone has a great holiday season
     
  24. Atlplastic

    Atlplastic Rookie

    Dec 23, 2020
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    Robert A Colgrove Jr
    I do remember them saying that there was a special on the warranty and it was half price.
     
  25. TheMayor

    TheMayor Eight Time F1 World Champ
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    "Goodwill" is "well, you seem like a nice guy. This is just some bad luck. You deserve a break-- so lets do you a favor".

    But this seems so odd to me.

    You either have a Power warranty or your don't. If this isn't covered under the warranty that I'd like to know what is because -- it seems rather worthless.
     
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  26. SAFE4NOW

    SAFE4NOW F1 Rookie
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    I have had cars come in with a failed engine drive belt tensioner, usually the tensioner and drive belt are relplaced, and you are back on the road.

    Reading the invoices you attached, it appears that the failure caused additional damage, hence the large repair estimate / invoice.

    Its not a common occurrence that I am aware of, but yes, I have seen it happen on 458's , a couple F12's , a FF, and now yours.

    FNA has offered a 2 years of New Power Warranty for the price of one special in 2020, this sounds like what you got.
    Not a bad deal considering the over all coverage + free maintenance the car has!

    New Power Warranty clearly lists what items are covered under Engine. Why the hell would they cover it, its not a covered item. ( sarcasm ) Engine has a timing chain, I think that is clearly another repair all together )

    Engine:
    Crankcase and all internal components thereof
    Cylinder heads and valvetrain
    Oil radiators
    Head gaskets
    Oil sump and pump
    Variable valve timing adjusters
    Solenoid valve
    Ionizing ECU
    ( oil seals and oil leaks are NOT covered )

    Unless you are seeing something differently than I am, only the drive belt was replaced during the service visit.

    If they DID replace it, then it would be covered under a parts warranty as would the subsequent damage caused by the failed part.

    OP purchased the car from Dealership A in May that came with 2 years of New Power Warranty


    Isn't that why almost all vehicles come with factory warranty, so that if a part fails in a short time, its covered? Mechanical parts fail, it happens all the time, on all vehicles, some more than others, not just Ferrari....

    Now, regarding the timing of the failure, could it possibly be that the old belt had loosened up over time and that when said new belt was installed, the tensioner could have just failed?

    The flip side of your argument could be that the servicing dealership quote a new tensioner every time they replace the drivebelt, to protect themselves from the " you just worked on it , so it has to be your fault " crowd. I think there would be more push back from the " selling something that's not needed " camp.

    Since they do not fail that often, seems they took the correct approach.

    Could they also have done something incorrectly when installing the belt, yes I can agree it could have have happened.

    Regarding your 300,000 miles on original tensioner and pullies, congrats, you must be in the minority, when I worked with BMW, we were replacing those pot metal bracketed, plastic roller tensioners daily, you must have gotten one of the good ones!

    I don't see where they replace the tensioner, only the drive belt....

    But your points are absolutely valid, I've seen bolts back out at BMW, Mercedes, and Audi as well... all repairs were covered, no questions asked. But I don't see that mentioned in the paperwork anywhere either. So these are just assumptions..

    Where does it say its a Pista, it appears to be a 488 Spider .. But your right, even a early delivery 2019 Pista would be covered under factory warranty still.

    Extended warranty isn't an issue, it does even come into play here, the failed tensioner is not a covered item.


    I think I am thinking the same way you are

    1. OP purchased from Dealership A and serviced it at Dealership B
    2. I would have purchased the 2 year warranty extension over 2 years of New Power Warranty as well, BUT, in this case, the factory warranty expired on 11/28/2019, well outside the window to purchase warranty extension, so New Power would have been the only option on this VIN
    3. If they knew there was an issue when they performed the CPO inspection, its more likely they would have replaced the failed part at that time. But that inspection was performed back in May 2020 , 7 months prior at an unknow mileage ( unknown at this time ) Again, well outside the 3 year factory warranty that expired over a year ago.
    4. Ferrari almost never covers battery replacement either, unless their mileage and maintainer requirements have been met, and even then its a fight that more often than not is covered by the Dealership who would have claimed under goodwill.
    ( Side note: The batteries in La Ferrari and Pista, etc have "recorders" that track maintainer useage so no fudging there anymore )

    Except for the part where the Dealership is full of it and advise on getting an attorney... I just don't see it the same way..


    Op should request the failed part, simple enough to spin in hand or not, or visually see if something else happened, came apart etc.


    Have you seen how many listed items are covered under the New Power Warranty? If you have, I think you'd know what the warranty is for , beyond piece of mind that is.


    New Power warranty would have been the only option available at the time, since the 3 year warranty had expired almost a year prior. You got a good deal, 2 years of New Power Warranty for the price of 1..


    FWIW, you might ask the service center if there is a chance that the belt itself failed, causing the other damage, which could then be claimed under the parts warranty aspect, helping tremendously on the final bill.

    Asking for help cant hurt, asking for Goodwill might be difficult, since you didnt buy from them, and you may not have had time to develop a relationship with them yet, so that they could tell Ferrari that you are a brand advocate and in turn Dealership advocate already... oh and if you are a Ferrari Club of America member, that can help you too, beyond the 10% off parts and labor !

    Good Luck with this process, I am sorry that it happened, hopefully you get nice weather to get out and really drive once you get it back!

    Steve
     
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  27. SAFE4NOW

    SAFE4NOW F1 Rookie
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    #25 SAFE4NOW, Dec 28, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2020

    When I am involved with Goodwill, these are some of the first questions I am asked:

    1. Did you purchase the car from the Dealership you are asking for Goodwill from?
    2. Are you a Brand advocate?
    3. Are you a Dealership advocate?
    4. Are you a Ferrari Club of America member?
    5. Do you service your car at the Ferrari Dealership?
    6. Do you attend Ferrari related events?

    And additionally, if is a listed item under New Power, I'm sure it would be covered no questions asked.

    I'll ask you what I asked the other member above, do you know what the covered items are under the New Power Warranty program? If not, how can you pass judgement as it being worthless?

    S
     

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