50k kilometers / 311250 miles service | FerrariChat

50k kilometers / 311250 miles service

Discussion in '456/550/575' started by ClaudioMa, May 28, 2024.

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  1. ClaudioMa

    ClaudioMa Rookie

    May 28, 2024
    16
    Full Name:
    Claudio Martella
    Hi

    I'm in the market for a 1997 550 Maranello.
    It would be my first Ferrari, so please bare with me if I have stupid questions.

    The car has 46k kilometers and just went through a maintenance service this year which changed: timing belts, V-belts, filters have been replaced and all fluids changed. Preventive items were also replaced such as engine and gearbox mounts, power steering hoses, rear brake pads, petrol hoses, fuel pump covers and the heater unit. Overall the service was around 10k euros.

    On one hand the extent of this makes me comfortable that the car is ready for a new owners with a good condition. On the other hand I have two main questions:

    1) Is a service of this extent a red flag?
    2) I see in the book that the 50k kilometers service is still due, but with the car having 46k kilometers and this extensive service just done, what should I expect from the 50k kilometers service?

    Thanks in advance
     
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  2. Bluebottle

    Bluebottle F1 Veteran
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    Oct 15, 2012
    7,782
    Newbury, Berkshire, England
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    John
    On the one hand, this sounds like a very thorough service, which should mean that the next owner is unlikely to have any nasty surprises. On the other hand, it sounds like the sort of service one would undertake on a "keeper", so why is it being sold? Most people planning to sell their car would not undertake a significant amount of allegedly unneccessary "preventive" expenditure just prior to doing so.

    My advice would be to proceed with caution: if possible, speak to the garage that undertook the last service to see if they know of anything that is being hidden, then take a look at previous recent service records to see if this level of preventive maintenance is typical, whether it has been regularly serviced (every year, regardless of mileage, with cambelt changes every third year) by reputable specialists, and if these bear out a fastidious owner and no undeclared issues, then carry on, but get a good PPI before you close the deal.

    Good luck - they are wonderful cars and will reward a careful search for a good one with many miles of very happy motoring.:):):)
     
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  3. ClaudioMa

    ClaudioMa Rookie

    May 28, 2024
    16
    Full Name:
    Claudio Martella

    I am going to ask the dealer. It may be that they serviced the car (also treated the leather and polished the finish professionally) to make it easier to sell, perhaps at higher price. I'll investigate. I am definitely happier to buy a car in this state than another one on which I need to do these things myself.

    The images show that the car has been serviced regularly by a Ferrari licensed garage, perhaps not every year, but at least every other.

    Do you happen to know what's expected at the 50k km mark? I see in the pictures that there's a page with 10k, 30k and 50k service, so they look like milestones beyond the yearly service -- this one has done the 10k and 30k, not the 50k yet.
     
  4. wbklink

    wbklink F1 Rookie
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    Sep 2, 2009
    3,338
    Los Angeles
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    Bill Karp
    My questions would be...How long has it been owned by this owner ?

    I agree see if there are previous service records it would be nice to see that it was always maintained properly in it's 25+ years.

    I hope it works out you will love the 550 they are great cars :)
     
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  5. ClaudioMa

    ClaudioMa Rookie

    May 28, 2024
    16
    Full Name:
    Claudio Martella
    I will, thanks! Do you happen to know what's the 50k kilometers service (like the one at 10k and 30k)?
     
  6. Jaredsalinsky

    Jaredsalinsky Formula Junior
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    Feb 8, 2023
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    10k euros ($10,856) seems about right if not a little low.. meaning inexpensive servicer, or maybe seller knows somebody etc.
    My opinion is more along the lines of - in preparation for the sale the seller is fixing everything wrong with the car, anticipating a PPI. It would look far worse for something large to get found out on a PPI - it would potentially turn a prospective buyer off.
    I like the fact that a lot of the stuff on that list is also preventative. Tells me that seller is conscientious about wanting to present the car in its best light.
    In the end there will be things missed, but as long as the big ones were addressed you should be getting a decent car.
    I agree with the above about records and length of current ownership; the more the better, and the longer the better, respectively.
    Then there's price... as long as you feel it's a reasonable fair price don't worry too much about the hard final number (I mean stay within your budget! but don't freak out about 2 or 3 thousand...) They are not making any more masterpieces like this, and they never will again. You know what they say... a good deal is when both parties leave thinking they could've done a little better....
    good luck and cheers!
     
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  7. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    38,307
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    To answer your question, most of the items in the 50K maintenance schedule were accomplished in the very comprehensive service she just received. If you buy a 550 owners manual from the internet, you will be able to see any additional services needed on the maintenance schedule on pages 190-193. The 97 550 OM was Ferrari 1256/97. Some of those include changing the spark plugs and charcoal filter and a bunch of inspections that were likely done at the last service. As mentioned, that was a very good price for all the items that were serviced and replaced. Would have cost much more here in the States.
     
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  8. ClaudioMa

    ClaudioMa Rookie

    May 28, 2024
    16
    Full Name:
    Claudio Martella
    Thanks for the answers! The service was performed by the most respected (licensed) Ferrari service in The Netherlands, so I do not think it's as low price due to some lower standard. I agree that this probably due to make the car more resellable. Would folks advise me on this particular car (and price)? The pictures contain (part of ?) the documentation about past servicing, and the posting provides more details: https://www.carrosso.nl/en/aanbod/ferrari/550/maranello-34943260/
     
  9. Jaredsalinsky

    Jaredsalinsky Formula Junior
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    Feb 8, 2023
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    Get it! Now!
     
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  10. ClaudioMa

    ClaudioMa Rookie

    May 28, 2024
    16
    Full Name:
    Claudio Martella
    Did you have a look? You're serious?
     
  11. ClaudioMa

    ClaudioMa Rookie

    May 28, 2024
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    Full Name:
    Claudio Martella
    It seems that the current owner bought it last year... red flag?
     
  12. Jaredsalinsky

    Jaredsalinsky Formula Junior
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    This car very apparently gorgeous and should be considered highly….
    The leather is pristine as are the seats, and the obvious recent work done.

    Ok seriously here are my criticisms, and they are few.
    1- The gaps where the bumper meets the body leading side of the front wheel wells look slightly large on both sides, as if it was reinstalled slightly wonky after whatever work done. Could be me. Just observation
    2- in one of the pics of the right side of the car the color of the paint of the front 1/4 panel looks different than the door. Only in that pic. Could be lighting. Again just observing. Ask to see paint meter readings.
    3- current owner only one year. Iffy, but I’ve owned cars for only 1 year. Check total number of owners.
     
  13. Aerosurfer

    Aerosurfer Formula 3
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    Nov 21, 2020
    1,388
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    Nick

    Looks like a great car. If you are a serious buyer, don't try and talk yourself out of it. This model, this platform and this are era of Ferrari is as good as you hope it is.

    Any reason the current owner may have short term ownership... if he acquired the car for a deal needing service, it may have been planned for a flip would be my guess. Or it could have remained in the family but changing title ownership (estate handling). If that's a thing over in Europe.

    It's still a 24 year old car, don't expect perfection, especially if you plan to use it. But most things mechanical and cosmetic are fixable
     
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  14. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    38,307
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    Very rare color for Maranellos and very attractive. Our comments on the amount of work for the money did not mean it was not well done, just that service is way more expensive here in the States.
     
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  15. Timmo

    Timmo Formula Junior

    Aug 26, 2017
    426
    Continental Europe
    I agree that it seems to be a flip, but that does not mean the car is necessarily bad. The front and rear bumpers were repainted in the wrong shade of blue with the bottom parts in gloss black rather than matt black, and poorly refitted.
     
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  16. Bluebottle

    Bluebottle F1 Veteran
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    Oct 15, 2012
    7,782
    Newbury, Berkshire, England
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    John
    That looks beautiful!! Great colour combination, which shows the timeless lines of the 550 to great effect. Comments above noted, and there are huge gaps in the history shown in the service book, but it is the recent service history that really matters - while the service book apparentlybshows no evidence of any servicing since 2014 (unless there is another page which they have not shown, or I have missed), hopefully the invoices on file (which I cannot read from the photo on the website) tell a different and more reassuring story. Even if they don't give as full a picture as one might like, I suggest you do not easily give up on such a stunning car, but get a really good PPI done and then decide, because that colour combo does not appear every day and, with the work done recently, it may just be as good as it looks, so it would be a shame to pass up on the opportunity without a fight. Good luck!

    I have never understood why it costs so much to service a Maranello in the USA. When I owned my 550, which I had serviced by an official Ferrari agent (Carrs of Exeter), I always seemd to be paying about half what you folks in the USA were being charged for the same work.
     
  17. ClaudioMa

    ClaudioMa Rookie

    May 28, 2024
    16
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    Claudio Martella
    I went to see it today. There's a gap between 2014 and 2024, then had this big service in 2024. The car had no kilometers put on it in those ten years according to the 2014 service and the kilometers it shows today. Allegedly it was owned by a collector who did not use it. Good call on the repaint job, it was repainted in the past: the front bonnet, the bumper, the two front 'wings', and the right door. Apparently the bonnet and bumper was for cosmetics (small stones kind of stuff), the right handside unknown, it has some signs on the rims, so I imagine it could be a bad parking experience. He says the car had zero accidents. Would a PPI shed light on this one? I feel the PPI would not give me particular information, as it was recently serviced and the stuff that would be checked by the PPI seem to be addressed there. I can call the team who serviced it, since they worked on it 2 months ago, and ask if they have feedback.

    Would 10 years of inactivity followed by that service be a no-go? Would the repaint job be a major problem? is 150k euros a good price for it? inside it's in excellent shape, and it drove very well, better than previous ones I tried in this price range (in particular when changing gears).
     
  18. Jaredsalinsky

    Jaredsalinsky Formula Junior
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    I think it would still be prudent to get a PPI for these reasons:
    1- it adds/maintains value for you should you at some point decide to sell the car. future buyers will look positively on the fact a PPI was done previously
    2- a 'good' PPI will involve getting the car on a lift and exploring the underside of the car which can and will undoubtedly shed some light on any questions remaining like: frame damage from a potential wreck that was not disclosed, rust issues anywhere, inspection of rubber parts, bushings etc, and finally inspection of components for leaks, drips, discoloration etc.
    3- lastly you may want the compression checked. Despite recent service, and taking into account a 1 year 'flip' it might make your brain, and the pile of records, feel more complete knowing there is good and equal compression across all 12 cyls. Alas you might've notice any engine issues while driving, unless you didn't really 'step on it'.

    I'd say plan on making an offer around 120-125K Euros... (10 years not driving, and painted body panels)
    You'll know a lot based on their response...
     
  19. 71veedub

    71veedub Formula Junior

    May 31, 2006
    271
    Boston/North Shore
    Full Name:
    Greg
    Looks beautiful, similar spec to the blu TdF one currently on BaT, but in a much more rare blue.

    Can anyone that has seen TdF (522), blu swaters (513), and blu lemans (aka blu scuro micalizzato, 516) side by side compare them in terms of how dark they are? I had a sample of 516 made when choosing the color to paint my 512TR, and in strong light it was very similar darkness to my TdF 550, while in lower light it looked darker. I have never seen swaters in person.
     
  20. 71veedub

    71veedub Formula Junior

    May 31, 2006
    271
    Boston/North Shore
    Full Name:
    Greg
    Re: blu TdF vs swaters, I had always assumed TdF was a very similar color that replaced swaters when they switched from Glasurit to PPG paint ~1998. Looking at several 355's on BaT, that seems to be the case, with one 1997 recently listed as Blu Tour de France paint, despite a photo clearly showing Glasurit blu swaters met. FER 513/C.
     
  21. ClaudioMa

    ClaudioMa Rookie

    May 28, 2024
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    Claudio Martella
    That makes sense, it's possible these three things were checked during the car service 2 months ago. They would be ok for the mechanic to go to the dealer to do the PPI (they have a bridge) but i don't know if a compression test can be done there.

    I brought the car price from 155k to 150k (he said 150k is his absolute minimum, but you know sellers...), 120-125k is unlikely to be considered. I assume you mean a refusal would be a good sign as it means they trust their car?
     
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  22. Jaredsalinsky

    Jaredsalinsky Formula Junior
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    yes correct - an absolute refusal would be a good sign. hesitation or any consideration would be... somewhat... concerning...
    that is unless the PPI revealed hidden deamons...
     
  23. Bluebottle

    Bluebottle F1 Veteran
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    Oct 15, 2012
    7,782
    Newbury, Berkshire, England
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    John
    That would at least provide an explanation for why the preventive items were undertaken.

    IMO maybe, but not necessarily. It will depend very much on the conditions in which it has been stored for the last 10 years. It sounds as though many of the items that could have deteriorated through lack of use have been replaced, but there may be others (a conversation with the garage that undetook the service could be very revealing). For that reason, you need an expert inspection by someone who knows all the areas that are vulnerable to lack of use. And you should budget for a few unforeseen items that will only become obvious after you have put a few miles on it, because as sure as eggs is eggs, there will be some.
     
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  24. ClaudioMa

    ClaudioMa Rookie

    May 28, 2024
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    Claudio Martella
    But the things they have changed are belts and mounting stuff. this assumes that nothing internal is affected by 10 years inactivity, like fluid related stuff. i'm thinking cilinders, transmission, gearbox etc... PPI won't check these things, except during the test drive i think
     
  25. Jaredsalinsky

    Jaredsalinsky Formula Junior
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    compression test with inspection of spark plugs will be helpful. fuel filters, and maybe a radiator flush (although if car is not running hot maybe no need)
    otherwise gaskets and seals
    At the end of the day if it drives well through all the gears and passes a PPI it's probably a decent vehicle in which to invest. And as long as it not molested should maintain its value rather well
     
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