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550 Maranello Dyno Results

Discussion in '456/550/575' started by paul.zr1, Nov 14, 2005.

  1. paul.zr1

    paul.zr1 Rookie

    Nov 4, 2005
    17
    Austin, Texas
    Full Name:
    Paul Dehnert
    I have the tubi "race" mufflers on my '01 550. They're basically a staight thru pipe with perferations around the inner pipe. Not to loud, but still have the stock cats, etc. on the car.

    Interestingly, when I put the tubi on I did a before and after dyno test (chassis dyno) and the car dynoed ten less hp with the tubi. 410 rwhp stock, and 400 with the tubi. Maybe I should re dyno it now and see if the ECU has adjusted the air fuel ratio.

    Also, should BMC filter add some hp back? How much?

    What else should I do to the exhaust system? ECM reprogram? I'd like to see about 450 rwhp without a major investment.

    Has anyone done these "step by step" mods with dyno runs alone the way?

    Thanks,
    Paul
     
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  3. gougoul

    gougoul Formula 3

    Nov 25, 2004
    1,298
    Geneva, Switzerland
    Stephens did all this.

    Guess the Tubi won't bring any added HP, just you don't have the bypass valve anymore.
    He put a different X-pipe instead, that apparently brought a huge HP hike, with the BMC filters.
     
  4. TexFerrari

    TexFerrari Formula 3

    Sep 11, 2004
    1,176
    Texas of course!
    This is an issue with many late model performance cars now. Adding exhaust alone makes little to no extra power and in several cases looses power. With the power loss, I’ve seen mostly on the greater factory HP per Liter engines. Part of the HP war these days with cars, exhaust is one of the first places they look for restrictions. Many factory setups no longer use crushed bends in the piping or very restrictive mufflers and are specifically engineered for the application, making it very hard to improve on.

    These days, for most cars except very large displacement or forced induction, I consider a cat-back exhaust system a visual and audio modification more then anything else. Drop those cats and you will surely get the HP back, but likely more noise and smell. With full exhaust and intake modifications, cars usually benefit the most with a retune.

    I’m sure it sounds great now though?
     
  5. paul.zr1

    paul.zr1 Rookie

    Nov 4, 2005
    17
    Austin, Texas
    Full Name:
    Paul Dehnert
    Yes, it does sound great with straight thru Tubi's. I love that V12 sound!

    Can anyone tell me who sells the Converter bypass test pipes? Or, the siamesed center pipe (x pipe) like Stephens uses?

    Thanks,
    Paul
     
  6. bobafett

    bobafett F1 Veteran

    Sep 28, 2002
    9,193
    filters, center pipe and mufflers you will get about 45-50bhp.

    --Dan
     
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  8. TrojanHorse

    TrojanHorse Formula Junior

    Mar 1, 2005
    973
    South Texas
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    Paul
    I've recently installed filters and an X pipe on my 550 and it "feels" noticably stronger. But since I've not dyno'd the package I can't actually say it IS stronger.

    The sound also seems a bit more lively--however, unless I drove by at the same time as a car with stock set up, I don't think you'd actually know the difference.
     
  9. paul.zr1

    paul.zr1 Rookie

    Nov 4, 2005
    17
    Austin, Texas
    Full Name:
    Paul Dehnert
    Where are you guys getting the x-pipe?
    Paul
     
  10. stephens

    stephens F1 Rookie
    Lifetime Rossa

    Feb 13, 2004
    4,483
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    Stephen S
    I would suggest that you should see a slight gain in power outputs between the two. The Tubi box muffler (which is on my car) would likely lose 10hp over the standard muffler, but not the perforated pipes IMO.
     
  11. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    22,062
    The Brickyard
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    The Bad Guy
    Haaaaaaa. Imagine that. Spend $3500 to LOOSE power. Tubi = wasted money, in my book.
     
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  13. stephens

    stephens F1 Rookie
    Lifetime Rossa

    Feb 13, 2004
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    Car came with Tubi's. Do some searches here and have a look at the Tubi "design". Akin to the old "Turbo" mufflers of the 80's reflecting the soundwave to change the amplitude of the noise. **** design. I tried another brand that was a "straight through" performance muffler, in conjunction with losing the centre muffler, the car was just LOUD and annoying. Standard muffler is too heavy.
     
  14. Doug H

    Doug H Karting

    Apr 17, 2005
    235
    Why all the focus on hp? I have had experiences with Tubi decreasing hp. Less restrictive exhaust may lose a few hp on stock tuning, but can potentially increase torque. I prefer more and earlier torque for normal driving applications.

    In building track cars, I have used multiple combinations of exhaust, 100 cell or sport cats, cat bypasses, chips, intakes, valve cuts, titanium this and that in upper end, fuel management systems and so on. I have found that certain combinations may knock a few ponies at higher RPMs, but spike torque earlier and increase total area under torque curve.

    The lower back pressure may decrease hp and increase torque from stock numbers. You can potentially overcome the loss in power with tuning or an expensive fuel magement system. I had a Lenz system on an older Ruf which allowed more tuning points to overcome back pressure issues related to stock or limited tuning parameters.
     
  15. speedball

    speedball Formula Junior

    Mar 29, 2004
    268
    Pasadena Area
    Full Name:
    Scot Anderson
    I experienced a slight loss of low end power when I changed to Tubi's from OEM. It was noticeable .... but not significant. Your dyno results prove this.
     
  16. speedball

    speedball Formula Junior

    Mar 29, 2004
    268
    Pasadena Area
    Full Name:
    Scot Anderson
    I got mine here .... http://www.stebro.net/

    It was about $ 600 for my 550 .... really improved the exhaust tone over the whole rpm range.
     
  17. bobafett

    bobafett F1 Veteran

    Sep 28, 2002
    9,193
    I have a stebro and would not recommend it.

    --Dan
     
  18. Bart

    Bart Formula 3

    Nov 1, 2003
    1,488
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    Bart
    #15 Bart, Nov 18, 2005
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  19. paul.zr1

    paul.zr1 Rookie

    Nov 4, 2005
    17
    Austin, Texas
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    Paul Dehnert
    Bart,

    Those are impressive dyno numbers. What are the mods to your 550? Was that a Dyno Jet dyno?

    Also, does anyone know how the kick in the plenum switch before 6500 rpm? I believe it's vacume controlled??

    Paul
     
  20. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    11,840
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    #17 mk e, Nov 18, 2005
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    If you're going to spend money, it's hard to beat forced induction. My supercharged 308 dyno curve is almost exactly the same as Barts 550, mine looks a little flatter, but down about 10-15 ft-lbs torque. Just a thought.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  21. Fly'n DutchMan

    Fly'n DutchMan Karting

    Oct 4, 2005
    248
    Agoura Hills CA
    Full Name:
    Sander Brouwers
    I don't understand all the hype about Tubi either, it reminds me of a glorified cherry bomb muffler you'd find on some guys IROC-Z in mid 80's. (Sing the lyrics to Phil Collin's "In the Air Tonight" to complete the visual)

    But what are the other options. There's the Capristo which looks marginally better and then these Kreis-Seig exhaust that look like great pieces but they are equally pricey.

    I don't know about the 550 specifically, but if the new F430's are anything like other current cars out there, there is almost zero HP gain in swapping exhaust alone. You'll need a couple of other mods and then reflash the ECU to take advantage of the uprated airflow.
     
  22. stephens

    stephens F1 Rookie
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    Feb 13, 2004
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    Bart
    Earlier this year I had my car dynoed on one of two dyno's I use regularly. Due to a problem with calibration of the dyno, it believed that I was only reaching 170kmh in 4th gear, when it actually does 192. Correspondingly my HP numbers dropped proportionately to the reduction in speed recorded.
    This is, I assume, because HP is a function of torque, based on RPM. The redline on the 550 is under 7500rpm, but there is a cut to one engine bank at around 7250rpm. Your dealer should be able to confirm this, as does the factory workshop manual. The 7700rpm limit in the manual, is a typical Ferrari untruth, much like their max speed numbers.
    This has been a very long winded explanation as to why I think your 550 numbers read much higher than expected.
     
  23. Newman

    Newman F1 World Champ
    Professional Ferrari Technician Consultant Owner

    Dec 26, 2001
    13,672
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    Newman
    Bottom line is $3500 and less HP. That sucks and I bet if people knew this before laying out the cash they might think twice. Technically the increase in airflow creating a lean condition effecting output should be compensated for by the ecu through the O2 sensors. Reflashing the ecu will then be a gain by itself and not so much a requirment to take advantage of the tubi. Therefore reflash the ecu, skip the tubi and buy an ansa instead that offers a better sound than stock or install test pipes and keep the stock system.
     
  24. stephens

    stephens F1 Rookie
    Lifetime Rossa

    Feb 13, 2004
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    Stephen S
    ???
    The fact is most people buy Tubi for the sound, not for extra power.
     
  25. Newman

    Newman F1 World Champ
    Professional Ferrari Technician Consultant Owner

    Dec 26, 2001
    13,672
    Canada
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    Newman
    Agreed but not for less power with better sound. Imagine someone like myself plopping down $3500 for a tubi on my 308 and its slower, I would want to shove that muffler up someones crack. I always thought they were a waste of money unless you have too much and dont know where to spend it and now I know.
     

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