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575 on the move

Discussion in '456/550/575' started by Clyde Romero, Oct 4, 2019.

  1. flat_plane_eddie

    flat_plane_eddie F1 Rookie
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    Isn't it recommended to hand tighten then another quarter turn with a wrench?
     
  2. Clyde Romero

    Clyde Romero Karting

    Sep 6, 2019
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    Taz
    No disrespect here
    I would like your views on this oil filter installation procedure
    I’ve hand installed oil filters on my 512 TR that has over 100k miles on it and is in a worst position ( it’s vertical rather than horizontal) under the engine without any protection whatsoever and never experienced any issues of it coming off or leaking
    I just put over 13k on my 575 with 2 oil changes done with my hand, no torque wrench, and once again have had no issues whatsoever
    I realize that there are those out there that want to follow the book precisely, but as a former A&P mechanic there are field expedient techniques which work just fine
    They are done everyday on the line
    And in the event you can’t remove the oil filter you get a screw driver punch a hole in the oil filter, and twist it off, seen this done numerous times on numerous vehicles Ferrari’s and the like
    In fact as a former 308 owner(put 140 k miles on it ) this is how you drain the oil filter before taking it off
    I really want to hear why you feel you need a torque wrench to install and oil filter
     
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  3. steved033

    steved033 Formula 3
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    I agree. I spin the filter on till it touches then 1/2 to 3/4 turn more by hand. It makes it just tight enough that you can just barely undo it by hand. My 10th oil change in the Fiesta says this works fine (every 5k). torque wrench on an oil filter...LOL
     
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  4. Clyde Romero

    Clyde Romero Karting

    Sep 6, 2019
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    Exactly
    This technique works in every application on every oil filter I’ve ever installed, us car or foreign
    And I could not agree more with your post
    Buying a torque wrench and an expensive tool to install an oil filter is over kill
    I can assure you that not every authorized Ferrari dealer in the country has technicians who torque the oil filter
    Anyway to each there own
    I am speaking from experience with regards to Ferrari ownership and heavy maintenance to include 512 TR major services and services on other models as well, the 348 in my opinion is the most difficult
    Which in my opinion doesn’t get any more intense than that!
     
  5. steved033

    steved033 Formula 3
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    348 is easier if the airbox is off (which it should be because you're changing the gearbox oil too). Reminds me that i'm due. Major was already a year ago.
     
  6. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Ferrari recommended hand tightening up through the late 90s (550 for V12s) and had multiple failures with that technique. So for the 575M and subsequent Ferraris, they developed a torque value that would guarantee optimum tightening to both prevent leaks and failures and ensure the filter could be removed eventually.

    So I do not care what individual owners do with their own Ferraris, but I do have objections to recommending to other owners, some of whom are not very experienced, a procedure that directly contradicts what Ferrari and the pros recommend. If you have any questions, ask Brian Crall. He has pretty strong opinions on the subject.
     
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  7. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Unspeakably bad advice.
     
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  8. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Can you cite a Ferrari source for that?

    You cannot.
     
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  9. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Significant lack of knowledge of the subject right there.
     
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  10. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Sorry Clyde. Its still dumb.

    Ferrari sold a lot of V12 crankshafts because people did it your way.
     
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  11. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Because we saw so many destroyed 456/550 and 575 engines due to people who just didn't listen and did it your way.

    Would you like someone fixing your F4 with the same attitude towards service procedures developed through many years of seeing failures?
     
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  12. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    #112 Rifledriver, Jan 15, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2020
    And if none of that isn't enough, what about the people hurt in the crashes caused by the 3 gallons of motor oil you'll leave on the pavement?

    These processes were not dreamed up by someone behind a desk writing a manual. They were arrived at by solving real world problems caused by people "Doing it the same way they have always done it".
     
  13. flat_plane_eddie

    flat_plane_eddie F1 Rookie
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    I most certainly cannot and never claimed to, either. So what's the recommended method and/or torque for the oil filter?
     
  14. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Written right on the filter.
     
  15. flat_plane_eddie

    flat_plane_eddie F1 Rookie
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    Haha ok then I'll have to wait to get one. Need to save up a bit more and decide between 575 and 599. I didn't do the oil change on my 355 so I never looked at the oil filter.
     
  16. Clyde Romero

    Clyde Romero Karting

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  17. Clyde Romero

    Clyde Romero Karting

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    Well we’ve beat that horse enough haven’t we?
     
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  18. steved033

    steved033 Formula 3
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    Okay. My whole adult life owning no less than 4 cars at a time and doing 100% of my own maintenance including engine builds and major rust repair reconstructive surgery. There are only a few things I haven't done to cars. I've never once had a failure.

    Please enlighten me as to what makes a 575 oil filter special, and why the torque spec should be revered. I am willing to learn. Is there a harmonic that makes them loosen or is it just carelessness that people weren't tightening enough because "hand tight" is subjective.

    sjd
     
  19. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Oil filter seal is a bad design. The car can easily see in excess of 150 lbs of pressure and without a great deal of preload it will blow the seal out. It was determined by a lot of real live engineers, not home mechanics that the needed preload to prevent blow outs was just a little under the physical strength limits of the structure of the can hence their need to determine a torque figure that would prevent problems. If your extensive automotive experience tells you this is a bunch of BS then by all means continue doing it wrong.
     
  20. steved033

    steved033 Formula 3
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    Thank you. That's very interesting.

    sjd
     
  21. WATSON

    WATSON F1 World Champ
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  22. steved033

    steved033 Formula 3
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    cool. kept for future reference.

    sjd
     
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  23. WATSON

    WATSON F1 World Champ
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    Just note...that is in NM....not foot pounds.
     
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  24. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    And for those not using a torque wrench and just giving it a little extra OMPH to be on the safe side I have taken off far too many in pieces and removed the base plates with a hammer and chisel praying I will not hurt the front cover of the motor. The front cover I will not be taking responsibility for because someone didn't follow directions. Like I said, narrow window between being tight enough and exceeding the structural limits of the filter.
     
  25. Clyde Romero

    Clyde Romero Karting

    Sep 6, 2019
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    16 foot lbs

    good night guys
    It’s been a blast


    Don’t attempt this at home
    Only trained professionals!!!!
     
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