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60 amp ceramic fuses

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by Bertocchi, Aug 25, 2021.

  1. Bertocchi

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    I am working on a 365 GTC which has had many modifications done to the wiring harness, fuse panel, and relays. I believe many were performed due to the inability to find the correct 60 amp ceramic fuses.
    As always are goal is to keep things original. I have been unable to find a source for the fuses in the states but imagine they are available in Europe?
    Can anyone provide potential suppliers?
     
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  3. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

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    could you post a photo from this fuse please
     
  4. Jumprun

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    Hmm, interesting. Are you sure about the need for a 60 amp fuse? That seems really high, What electrical circuit(s) would that be protecting? The alternator may not even be rated to put out that many amps.
    I have a late 330 GTC, quite similar to the 365 GTC, and I re-did my complete charging system and fuse panel, and the highest rated fuse specified is, I believe, 30 or 40 amps. The fuse ratings can be found on the fuse cover itself and in the owners manual..
     
  5. John Vardanian

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    #4 John Vardanian, Aug 25, 2021
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2021
    Hello Dave, I got mine from NAPA Auto Parts. They are a chain retailer here in CA. Sixty amps sounds awfully high, but then I am not familiar with your car. Good luck.

    john


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  6. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

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    60 Amp in such size I never have seen, max. 40 Amp
     
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  8. Bertocchi

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  9. turbo-joe

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    have not known that those fuses going up to 60 amp. so learning news things in my age :)
     
  10. JCR

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  11. enio45

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    damn, that is some high amps for circuits in a car

    fan blades and windows.....what fan motors were used for this car?
     
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  13. pshoejberg

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    60 amps fuse for sub components in a car from that age doesn't make much sense. The wires to the fuse will possibly melt before the fuse unless they are sized 6 AWG. Are you sure the sign on the fuse box is original?

    Best, Peter
     
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  14. TTR

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    The label appears like a reproduction.
    What fuse amperage does an original fuse cover label, owners manual and/or service manual indicate for these applications ?
    Most cooling fan or power window circuits on this era Ferraris I've seen have usually featured 25-30 Amp fuses.
     
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  15. Bertocchi

    Bertocchi Formula 3
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    It's unlikely that anyone went through the trouble of redoing the fuse panel labels. As you know there were very few 365 GTCs produced so technical literature is scarce at best so my legal team would struggle to prove that notion is incorrect. Additionally why would GT Car parts inventory such an item if it were not used regularly?
    You all probably come from an age of 18-20 gauge automotive wiring and very low amperage circuitry. Anyway the problem has been solved and there is no need to debate this further. Thanks for your input
     
  16. Lowell

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    UK and USA fuse ratings are different. Look it up on the Web. 60 A UK is about 30 A USA.

    The 1960 Jaguars have only two fuses for the entire car, each equivalent to about 30 A USA.
     
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  17. TTR

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    With all due respect Mr. Castelhano, but you initially stated the car in question having “had many modifications done to the wiring harness, fuse panel, and relays” and then acknowledged the scarcity of technical literature, I can’t help but wondering how did you come to conclusion 60 Amp fuses indeed are OEM requirements for these applications ?
    Just curious.

    P.S. While my automotive electrical/wiring experience is likely far from yours, it stems mostly from hands-on (restoration) work on vehicles manufactured between 1930 and 197?, but I’ve also dabbled in and even designed/made harnesses (from scratch) for earlier and later systems, including various vintage wooden boats manufactured between 1917 and 1954.
    Yet, I’m always interested to learn more.
     
  18. Bertocchi

    Bertocchi Formula 3
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    Judging from the wire gauges used in all three circuits, which are measured in millimetres and not US wire gauge, it did not seem unreasonable to have a surge current of a substantial value when each device is initially turned on. It would not be an operating current. The number of wire strands is more important than the actual "gauge".
    Don't confuse house requirements with automotive or marine. As an experienced technician I am sure you know that electrons only flow in the outer circumference of a conductor so more strands is a better choice.
    Cut open the grounding cable of a good welding machine and you will see hundreds of very thin strands.
     
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  19. JCR

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    Fuse (automotive) - Wikipedia There is a chart at the link.
    "Lucas fuses have three ratings; the continuous current they are designed to carry, the instantaneous current at which they will fuse, and the continuous current at which they will also fuse."
     
  20. TTR

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    Thank you Sir, for expanding and while I’m somewhat familiar with most of the basic principles of electrical wiring, I was just curious to learn how, other than the fuse cover label indicating so, did you concluded or confirmed 60 Amp fuses were originally applicable or necessary in this particular case.

    On the other hand, my somewhat limited (personal) experience with “exotic”(?) Italian automobiles, which admittedly doesn’t include any with 365 GTCs, per se, has lead me not to be surprised about anything defying common sense or conventional wisdom found in them, hence my curiosity and will keep in mind if I ever encounter this issue on one (365 GTC) in the future.
     
  21. Lowell

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    I'm sorry, but it is not true that "electrons only flow in the outer circumference ..." This only holds for the conduction of moderately high frequency transport. For our household 60 cycles, almost all of the energy is carried uniformly inside the wire; for DC all of the energy is carried uniformly within the wire. However, if you go to rather high frequencies such as those in FM radio (or TV), for a straight copper wire of a radius of 1 mm in a vacuum, almost all of the energy is not carried within the wire at all but rather in an electromagnetic wave outside the wire that extends in a radius of meters.

    I would guess that the welder cable has a huge number of thin strands so that it bends easily.
     
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  22. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

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    ??? 60 Amp are 60 Amp.
    even lucas has 3 different ratings remember it is an italian car, no british car.

    sorry, can not find anything. link please

    great, but you see that those ceramic fuses are only available with 5, 8, 16, 25 and 40 Amp, nothing with 60, so as I have written already in post no. 7

    this only lucas has those 3 different ratings, but only for the glass fuses

    but lucas? the inventor of the short circuit and the lord of darkness
     
  23. readplays

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    I would think that it's more a function of heat during use: stranded conductors will be superior to solid conductors with respect to heat dissipation.
     
  24. John Vardanian

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    #21 John Vardanian, Aug 29, 2021
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2021
    For what it's worth, more strands are preferred not so much for better conductivity, but for agility. Thicker cables that need to be moved about often (like high-current test equipment leads, welder ground leads, etc.) have finer strands for that reason. It is not used universally because it is more costly than the cable with fewer strands.

    john
     
  25. JCR

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    No. See the wiki article I posted. "The physical length of the Lucas ceramic type of fuse is either 1 inch or 1.25 inch, with conical ends. Lucas glass tube fuses have straight ends."

    Apparently Lucas made fuses that looked like the Bosch "torpedo" fuses. But were not the same. Additionally Lucas also made glass tube fuses similar to American AG type fuses but they were not interchangeable. These Lucas were referred to as "slow blow" fuses and you did not want to put North American AG type fuses in your British car. The Lucas ratings were different than the NA AG types.
     
  26. daytonaman

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    pohto of fuse legend from my car 12971
    You can clearly see 50 and 60 amp
    The 60 A is top right. Rad Fan.
    Not saying it is correct but this is the original sticker.

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  27. Lowell

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    The heat dissipated by a wire of length L with total resistance R carrying a current I is R I^2. The voltage drop from one end of the wire to the other is Delta V = R I. So if the wire generates a lot of heat it will often have a big voltage drop which you do not want, and in general if the wire generates a lot of heat it has a lot of energy loss. So in this case you need a thicker wire. Stranded wires are handy because they are easy to bend.
     
  28. Lowell

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    Thanks. That is what I said.

    By the way, electrons carry heat as well as electricity. So copper is both a good conductor of heat and electricity.
     

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