612 2X better than 456

Here's my problem: My car lift is being installed this week, so I have space for another Ferrari. It must be a 456M GTA or a 612 F1 ( the wife can't drive a stick). I prefer the looks of the 456 but I'm sure I'd love the extra HP and F1 in a 612. A nice 2002-2003 456 would be around $70k while a nice 2005-2006 612 would be around $140k. So is the 612 worth twice the price of a 456? I'm sure the answer would be different had i posted this in the 599/612 area. Also, I have a 3 yr old and an 8 yr old.
Your thoughts, please.

 

Jerry- Apples and oranges. The 612 has an extended wheelbase compared to the 456M and has way more rear seat room. Plus the 612 has an updated version of the 575M engine with hydraulic valve lifters, so no valve adjustments and recommended cam belt changes at 5 year intervals vs 3 year intervals for the 456M (not believed by all). The interior of the 456M is classic and the 612 is very modern and up to date and has a far superior burglar alarm and remote entry system.

The 456, especially with 18" or 19" wheels, is more attractive than the 612 to many Ferraristi. The shorter wheelbase makes the 456 more sporty, but the Mannesmann-Sachs on the 612 are far more reliable than the troublesome Bilsteins and self-leveling system on the 456M. Most 612s also come with more modern stereo equipment, although the 456M system can be upgraded.

So, do you want a prettier to some, possibly sportier, but slower, car that will probably require a bit more maintenance, or a newer car with more modern fittings? Realize also that the 456M came with a real automatic transmission and the 612's F1 system is definitely not an automatic transmission, even though it has an automatic mode. Your wife will require some training on how to use the F1 system or it will frustrate her at first. Eventually, she will probably love it, even in manual shifting modes, once she sees how much fun it can be.

Taz
Terry phillips

 

Damm you have to much time on your hands...........
612 is a better car but 456 is a great car.... simple as that....
everything else is just a personal choice.....

 

Gentlemen, thank you for your responses. My children are 3 and 8 yrs old, so I feel the 456 would have plenty of room for them. I don't plan on having adults sit in the back. I'm aware of the true auto trans vs the F1, and I feel the wife would be better suited to the auto, she's drives very cautious and somewhat slow at times. For me Id loved to have the F1, and the modern interior of the 612. Clearly the 456 wins in exterior styling. Just don't know if I want to spend twice the money for the 612.

 

Buy a 456 now and after a few years/depreciation, buy a 612...

 

I think I would just buy a stick-shift 456 for myself and give the wife a nice throwaway car with an automatic from the money left on the table

And yes, 456s probably had most of their depreciation, early GTs can be picked up for $40k... while the 612s are still tumbling.

 

Another car to consider is the 2008 Maserati GranTurismo.
It is a beautiful 2+2 coupe.
They've come down in price to the $70k - $80k level.
Has a modern Ferrari V8 based on the 430 and the F1 transmission.

So, kind of like the 612 but at half the price.

Another way to look at it is how much likely depreciation in 5 years time.
612 = probably another $60k - $70k drop in price.
456 = probably another $10k - $20k.
Maser GT = probably another $25k - $35k drop.

And, you always have the option of teaching your wife to drive a stick.
.

 

As a point of clarification, the Gran Tourismo has a Maserati V8 that shares some basic bottom end design work with the F430 and Alfa 8C. Although, the actual engines are nothing alike.

Also, the 2008 models do not have an F1 tranmission but do have a ZF automatic transmission.

Great cars in general but they are in a totally different class compared to the Ferrari 612.

 

Good to know. Thx.

 

Only about 330 (or so) Maserati GranTurismo's have the F1 transmission (the F1 is essentially the same as used in the 599 of that year). The rest have auto tranny's. That said, the GTS (and the GT) with auto is a legitimate alternative to the 456 and 612 options.

I had a '95 manual 456 that I sold a few months ago and just picked up a 2009 Maserati GTS with F1. Drove it from Chicago back to San Diego this past week. The GTS is light years ahead of the 456 I had in every respect except Hp and torque. In real world driving, it won't matter because you can't use the extra Hp (the GTS has plenty of torque, but the 456's extra torque is noticeable). I've heard nothing but good things about the GT and GTS with auto tranny's. While I cannot compare either to the 612 since I have never driven a 612, I would recommend you add the GT and GTS with auto (or the GTS F1) to your list of potential options. I would not consider it to be in a different class than a 612 as stated, and to the contrary, I would say it is a direct competitor/alternative.

Alberto

 

All standard Gran Turismos have the ZF Auto box. As you noted, some GTS models were available with MC Shift (F1). However, GTS cars were not made in 2008 and are not currently being traded at $70K-$80K. We were discussing the standard 2008 models.

Agreed. The ZF unit is very good.

Perhaps. I think of the Gran Turismo and the 612 in different classes primarily due to performance. The 612 has a 500 less lbs and 135 more hp when compared to the standard GT.

Don't get me wrong. I LOVE Maseratis. They make amazing grand touring cars. I just viewed the 612 as in a different league. Maybe I should block out the huge cost of entry difference on the new side from the comparison

 

According to Edmunds.com. the 2011 Maser GT's power and torque are substantially LESS than the 2009 (torque dropping to 339 ft-lbs from 361; hp from 416 to 406); a 456M would have 10% more hp and 20% more torque, while weighing 250+ lbs less--a pretty big difference. FWIW, Edmunds puts the 612 0T0 at only 100 lbs lighter than the Maser.

 

Look at the 2009 Mas GTS - it has F1 and as good of exhaust sound as any of my Ferraris - just push a button on the dash and it opens the exhaust - my wife loves hers
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i'd bet u could pick up a nice 456 way under those numbers..................

 

Alberto
The 456 GT that I bought from you has proven to be a wonderful car. At that price, it was 1/3 the cost of a used 612. The 456 is also at the bottom of the deprecation curve. A 09 Maserati should be more advanced then a car 14 years older. A Maserati will lose value however at a staggering rate, not unlike a 612, but it will still never be a Ferrari. Cavallino is finding the values of 456 GTs to be holding at 40K to 55K, only to stay put, or go up. My people who work on both types of cars have little to say that is good about the build quality of the Maserati. Hope the rebuild on the Lamborghini went well.

Michael H

 

John,

Is that a garage or a show room for your rides? Very nice. I'm going to look for a 456 and a 612; when the right car presents itself first, I will make it happen.

 

Jerry- Doug's (Champagne612, currently working off a 30 day ban) car is a very nice 2006 HGTC and was in FerrariAds the last time I looked. It has ball polished 599 wheels and is a very nice 612.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

Hey Mike, how are you? I'm very glad to hear you are enjoying the car.

I intend to keep the Maserati for a very long time, so I'm not worried about depreciation too much. In 10 years, I probably won't be any worse off (probably better off) than if I had purchased 2 - BMW's 5 years apart and in the mean time I have a better car (me thinks).

Between the 612 and the 456, I agree with you. I'd take the 456 because the price/performance ratio is so much better than the 612.

However, between a 456 and a Maserati GT or GTS, it's not so clear for me and it probably would depend on the specific 456. I do think it to be a legitimate alternative to the OP's originally stated options, specially since it falls somewhere in the middle of the other two price wise.

Although I liked the 456, I love my Maserati GTS-F1.

 

Hmm...I would buy a nice 456 and enjoy the ownership with probably the least depreciaition of the lot we all suggested above. But it's gonna need some love and care to keep it in a tip-top condition. It's over a decade old, don't forget.

Maser is a great alternative...but like 612, I would wait a bit loger for the price to come tumbling down before I buy one.

Here in Thailand, the 456 is going for the same rate as beat up 355 at the very best. The Maser, slightly used, is priced at around the 575 level. There are about 3-5 612 here in Thailand, so you won't find one on market easily....but 12 cylinder GT from Ferrari seems to be difficult to find love.

 

I've seen his ad, but the color is not a first choice. Thanks for the info.

ps, garage lift was installed yesterday. I've got about 55 inches of vertical clearance for another Ferrari.

 

keep in mind that the 456, even the m, is fraught with potentially bothersome issues. the windows, the rear shocks, the headlights, the gas tank etc. all of these will eventually go bad - ask me how i know...
i bought what i considered to be the best car available in switzerland. it had 1500 km on it when i bought it, and had just come from a huge spruce up( previous owner died and left it in a bubble for 5 years). so when i received it, it was perfect....and all of those things have happened to me.

so, yes it is a bargain vs the 612; yes it is in some ways better looking, and yes it is likely a bit more sporting given the smaller size. BUT it has issues that a super low manufactured number will always have. i have not yet changed it out vs something else, although i ask myself, and this forum this same question every year. just make sure you have the stomach for dealing with these little hassles and niggles.

and yes, there is enough room for your kids. mine are 12-14-16 and they all fit. even my wife or mother can ride back there to go to a resto etc.

 

Wow, Ross, I really think you've had a run of bad luck, or at least, worse luck than most. Maybe leaving it in a bubble, i.e.,unused, was part of the problem.

All of the issues you raise have not yet happened to me and my car is ten years old with over 73,000KM. I bought it 3 years and 22,000KM ago, fixed a radiator leak and a wiring problem (harness got fried running next to the engine) and got the full 30K service and it's just been maintenance since. My siren did go dead and I haven't yet replaced it, but that's just a $350 item. (a dealer-replaced HVAC panel was due to a mis-diagnosis that I had to pay for--grrr--but that shouldn't count). My expenses for the car for the past 12 months and that includes around 8000KM of driving, other than gas and oil, were around $2K--and I just bought 4 new Nitto NT555s.

 

I have done almost 20,000 kms in mine in the past 2 years.

Problems:

Replaced rear shock absorbers, oh, and the outside temperature reader.

Had more niggle problems with my 458 in 5000 kms

While beauty remains in the eye of the beholder and no matter how good a 612 is, there is no question which one wins the beauty contest!

 

well the shock absorbers were replaced prior purchase and now the new ones leak again. the windows work and always have, but the driver's side rubber piece decided to grip too hard once and the window sliced into it - i have not replaced it since i taped it up and its good enuf. their is steady oil leak that developed and which will cost me a few k and parts to fix next spring. the headlight surround on the driver side somehow broke, but that was replaced when i broke the headlight running into the back of range rover in stop/go traffic. the gas tank issue is a weird one but it is not bothersome enuf to bother with.
perhaps you are right about the sitting around time being a culprit in all this. but since i bought it i have put on 15k km on it myself.

net net, i do love the car, but it has more problems than any of my other ferraris. thats just the honest truth.

 

thasnks for your input. I love both the 456 and 612; I'm going to buy the best I can afford. Hopefully a nice clean 612.