612 nightmare

That's a good point - one I've heard before. But I'm riding on Michelins, and whenever I hit a rut in the road, it sounds as if somebody took a bat to the front of the car - it's a "bam!" noise, and not one that makes any sense given the relatively tall sidewalls and the small rut that you'd never notice in another car. It makes me think the bushings are not intact....

 

Famblocks, balljoints or ARB drop-links. Potentially dampers too, but you would surely see if they were leaking.

 

I have the Pirellis (third set on the rears and second on the fronts), and they've been fine.

 

No probs. One thing to note is that your official Ferrari dealer probably wont fit these aftermarket ball joints for you. Even though they are superior to the OEM ball joints, licenced dealers are kept in check and instructed to only fit original equipment parts. Its an easy/regular job for any Ferrari/Lambo specialist to do though. Heck- I did two in my home garage this evening with no trouble.

 

Are there any worries with the "baking" process and glue failure? The videos sure seem to make it seem the press fit is not what holds them in....

 

I'm not convinced the glue is "everything". Firstly, some of my ones came out real easy, whereas some needed a lot of assistance. You also have some pretty stout circlips holding them in. Lastly, and this is the key point, the lower ball joint clearly does the bulk of the heavy lifting (as its physically a good bit bigger), and it has a step in it. This means it only goes in from the bottom, and cannot physically go all the way through the wishbone, whereas the top one can go in either way, and is centered only by the boots/circlips. Its basically the fail-safe.

The process of applying the glue and baking it has a lot of variables that will inevitably effect the bond strength, and in a workshop environment you will end up with a lot of scatter in terms of the performance achieved. I think Ferrari knew this, and that the glue itself couldn't be relied upon not to lead to a fatal incident, hence the additional design features that render the glue non-critical.

 

@cid042 : If your are looking for a good Ferrari specialist, there is "Fiorano Racing" but he is not in Lyon area: he is based in Montigny le Bretonneux, near Paris.
Lots of parisian F-cars go there. As an independant, he uses lots of third-party suppliers, like Hill Engineering.

I am not 100% satisfied too with the steering on my OTO, but first of all I have to switch to MPS4S (I don't like the feeling with my Pirellis).
I know that mine has its rear tie-rods already changed by the previous owner (at approx 25000Km).

 

Have faith and find a good local frame, alignment shop. When I purchased our 2009, 612 OTO with 7800 miles, the steering wheel was not aligned properly. Not to be bothered, I promptly headed to the track for a test and noticed a slight 'odd' feeling during corner 'turn in' and during transitions from the 'apex to exit'. It felt like the back end was ready to cut loose at any moment but never did. The next visit was to a local shop which does totally chassis alignments, meaning both front and rear suspensions. Part of the process was placement of weighted bags in each front seat to complete the alignment with the proper passenger loading. The car was out of alignment on all four corners. The car I drove in handled OK with confidence killing peculiarities, the car I got back was and is simply stunning. The 612 OTO handles fantastic and is as stable and confidence inspiring at 160MPH as it is at 40 MPH, it is simply a blast to drive!!!

We have a 2015 Golf R (did this same type of alignment to it and all the other vehicles) and the two cars 'feel' almost identical on the track. While the size, weight and wheel base differences are massive, the cars 'feel' the same at 'turn in' and 'apex to exit'. It does not matter if the turns are tight or open, the 612 OTO goes right where you point it and there is no better 'feeling' than all that torque roaring out of a V12 Ferrari when exiting from the apex.

Whom ever said you should not expect much from your 612 OTO clearly is under educated and needs to be taken on a proper ride. Good luck!!!

 

Hello, I just bought a 612 Scaglietti and hope not to encounter the same problems !

 

Sorry your OTO is not handling properly. Mine is a joy and sticks in turns, has very good turn in, and is very forgiving over bumpy roads.

It’s the perfect 1,000km weekend getaway car and I don’t feel tired after using it.

I would definitely get it checked by an alignment professional who knows how to align a 612, especially with the shims.

It’s a great car, and surprisingly nimble for its size.

We regularly run our coast road without much fuss, and it’s always blissful [emoji3590]

OTO is black, and the Rubino has HGT2 so handling wise they are the same.

Good luck [emoji256]

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...are you saying they are letting out the toe a little or actually going to set it truly toe'd out? I can't imagine a toe'd out setting will work well. I mean, it's doable/I've done it on other cars (not for long or by real intent) but depending on condition of suspension parts and roads it doesn't always go well...

 

F3.05 Set-up check and adjustment

Checks and preparation of vehicle

Check the following before inspecting the set-up:

Wheel fastening.

Tyre pressure.

Clearance between pinion and rack in steering system;

Play between the ball pins and the steering tie-rods;

Efficiency of the gas shock absorbers;

Play between the stub axle pillar and the ball joints;

Position the vehicle on a plane surface in “run condition” with the tank full of fuel and the handbrake pulled.

If the tank is not full, place 0.735 Kg on the transmission tunnel for every litre of missing fuel.

Toe-in is measured on a diameter of 495 mm (19").

The following set-up data is relative to the car WITHOUT SAND BAGS.

Standard set-up data given below are also valid for the version with HGTS.

Front set-up data

Settled vehicle height 145.6±5 mm

Wheel camber

(camber)

- 0.8°±0.17°

Angle of incidence 6.73°±0.72°

Rear set up data

Settled vehicle height 152.5±5 mm

Wheel camber

(camber)

- 1.75°±0.17°

Angle of incidence 5.76°±0.5°

Toe-in

Front -0.5±0.5 mm -0.5 ÷ 0.0 mm

Rear 3.6±0.5 mm 1.55 ÷ 2.05 mm


From Page 786 work shop manual

 

No front toe in is great for turn-in, but rough on straight ahead tracking.

 

Different to a 612, but I found huge variation on the 575s I drove prior to buying mine. There was not really correlation between mileage/service history and quality of handling, and it didn't fit with the FHP/not and also revisions during the production run, either. You are right to want to address all the suspension components systematically. There seems to be a kind of multi factorial jeopardy where numerous bits wearing can lead to major issues. Your car should handle beautifully.

Without knowing your main dealer, how familiar are they with a model that was produced around 13 years ago on average? Most main dealers will be thinking an FF is irrelevant, let alone the setup on a 612. You need a specialist with dedication, knowledge, experience and expertise. You could try The Ferrari Centre just across the border in Kent, the owner and his wife (former racing drivers) knows these cars intimately. One day's drive, take Eurostar back from Ashford, take advantage of the strong Euro. They are real experts in modern Ferraris and own a F12 and 575.

 

My HGT2 OTO handles really well on twisty roads. I live in Switzerland, so a lot the roads here are switchbacks and very tight turns. My car can tear through them all day long and at speeds way beyond what is legal. The steering and brake pedal are a little soft compared to other Ferraris, but they do exactly what I want from them to do and are certainly not what I would call dangerous or vague. I hope you get it sorted.

 

Channel tunnel trip to AV Engineering or DK Engineering in the UK. Or perhaps a visit to Ian Tyrrell. Sounds like you need someone to look at the car who knows what they are doing.

I am not sure what the Ferrari specialist scene is like in France but it does sound like the main dealer is not interested.

Or maybe (at best) the main dealer is just hiding their lack of knowledge (which I suspect is often the case with the older models).

 

Also (and I really hope this isn’t the case) I wonder has it been in a crash. Wheel damage / mudguard damage / TPMS broken all on the front left means it might have had a knock on that side.