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612 Ownership?

Discussion in '612/599' started by colandreo, Oct 25, 2013.

  1. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Lifetime Rossa

    Jul 19, 2008
    31,518
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    Bob- I would not replace the cam seals unless they were leaking, even though it can be done without pulling the cams on an F133F/H engine.
     
  2. matt dodwin

    matt dodwin Rookie

    May 14, 2018
    44
    Full Name:
    matt godwin
    my car still have the orginal rods/ ball joint and they are still good.. when they suppose to be replaced ?

    [/QUOTE] In a pre-OTO you're sweating pulling out in traffic esp uphill, significant delay getting 1st to engage. But the twin plate is all but instantaneous.[/QUOTE]

    bob , can u explain what do u mean? I never experienced these issues , the 1st gear engage realy quick in sport mode and shift realy fast ( not as fast as DCT in my california but ok ). also never had problems driving in steep hills.
     
  3. matt dodwin

    matt dodwin Rookie

    May 14, 2018
    44
    Full Name:
    matt godwin
    experienced shop in san diego qouted me 1500$ belt only said the same thing ..he said its easy job in these cars
     
  4. Piper

    Piper Two Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Jun 6, 2010
    22,717
    Northern Virginia
    Full Name:
    Bob
    Fair enough. In truth, we didn't replace mine in the major on my 612 some years back because they weren't leaking. But it's on the list, seals come in the kit and there's very real possibility they will be leaking.
     
  5. ttforcefed

    ttforcefed F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Aug 22, 2002
    12,744
    Yeh leaking on my 09. Second major happening now. Car has 6,700 miles.
     
  6. Piper

    Piper Two Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Jun 6, 2010
    22,717
    Northern Virginia
    Full Name:
    Bob
    In a pre-OTO you're sweating pulling out in traffic esp uphill, significant delay getting 1st to engage. But the twin plate is all but instantaneous.[/QUOTE]

    bob , can u explain what do u mean? I never experienced these issues , the 1st gear engage realy quick in sport mode and shift realy fast ( not as fast as DCT in my california but ok ). also never had problems driving in steep hills.[/QUOTE]

    You might have significant play in your suspension and not realize it. There's no interval for replacement, but they do wear out. If you have over 20k miles on your car and have never done a ball joint, I'd get a mechanic familiar with the car to inspect them.

    How I feel about the clutch slip and how you perceive it could be very different. I've had both, an early 612 as a 599 as example of a twin plate and the difference is night and day. I took pride in how well I could engage first and it can be done abruptly or smoothly, but all the wear on that single plate clutch is getting into 1st. I managed just 10% wear in 5k miles, but to get that kind of optimal wear I avoided certain things like stop and go traffic, pulling uphill slowly, leaving stoplights, all contribute. I enjoyed the hell out of my 612 while I had it, but I made it a hobby to maximize clutch for my own edification. No right or wrong, just my driving habit but I do think it saved someone someday some money.

    One thing you might also want to be aware of is the throwout bearing. If you let the tranny downshift for you all the time, you'll wear out your throwout bearing in half the time and thus can add that to your clutch service as a while-you-are-in-there item. If you don't, if you get in the habit of dropping to neutral and coasting to lights which I found much more pleasant anyway, you'll save a lot of life on it.
     
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  7. RichardGilmore

    RichardGilmore Karting
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 9, 2003
    56
    Atlanta, Ga.
    Full Name:
    Richard Gilmore
    What did FOA charge to fix your stickies?
     
  8. F612

    F612 Formula Junior

    Feb 5, 2018
    360
    Leeds,AL
    Full Name:
    David D. Hood
    I think it was $1600 but I’m at the lake and docs are in town.
     
  9. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Lifetime Rossa

    Jul 19, 2008
    31,518
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    There are so many versions of F1 software for the 612 it is difficult to make general conclusions. Originally 180 ms min shift, then with HGTC/HGTS 160 ms, then at the same time HGT2 originated, 125 ms for all 612s, and with the 599 twin disc clutch and Superfast I software, 100 ms. Each upgrade was accompanied by improvements in smoothness, clutch life, and engagement algorithms. A lot of difference between the original F1A software and any of the improved versions.
     
  10. matt dodwin

    matt dodwin Rookie

    May 14, 2018
    44
    Full Name:
    matt godwin
    [/QUOTE]You might have significant play in your suspension and not realize it. There's no interval for replacement, but they do wear out. If you have over 20k miles on your car and have never done a ball joint, I'd get a mechanic familiar with the car to inspect them.[/QUOTE]

    after owning many cars Porsche, BMW, JAGUAR , i m very impressed with 612 geometry suspension, alignment still straight as arrow and zero tires wear

    [/QUOTE]One thing you might also want to be aware of is the throwout bearing. If you let the tranny downshift for you all the time, you'll wear out your throwout bearing in half the time and thus can add that to your clutch service as a while-you-are-in-there item. If you don't, if you get in the habit of dropping to neutral and coasting to lights which I found much more pleasant anyway, you'll save a lot of life on it.[/QUOTE]

    this is the best advise for all new 612 or any new F1 owners, i followed this pattern from day one and car @ 15k miles clutch wear 56% on sd3 tool (Ferrari dealer)
    and 25% on AUTEL AP200.. ( I LIKE AP 200 BETTER :) )
     
  11. Diny

    Diny Karting

    Jun 24, 2017
    58
    In regards to the F1 transmission, I have 2 questions.

    1) At red lights, would you shift it to neutral, like you would a manual car? I know that throw out bearings can go out if you just sit at the light with the clutch in instead of shifting it into neutral with the clutch out.

    2) Can you turn the car off in gear? I know you can, but should you? In my manual cars, it's a habit of leaving them in gear and with the handbrake on. But what about this? I only equate the 2 because, if I'm not mistaken, the transmission is the same as the manual cars but what changes is how the gears are selected, so perhaps some of the same principles apply.
     
  12. Piper

    Piper Two Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Jun 6, 2010
    22,717
    Northern Virginia
    Full Name:
    Bob
    I'd already be in neutral from coasting to the light. 100% of the time.

    I dont remember the answer to turning off in gear. I remember clearly being embarrassed I couldn't get my 360 started day 1 because I'd shut it off on gear. It may be I don't recall because from then on had a habit of always shutting down in neutral. But the 612 is pretty much a stretch 360.

    Sent from my SM-N960U using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
    Diny likes this.
  13. Anthony James

    Anthony James Karting
    Silver Subscribed

    Jul 27, 2012
    213
    Essex
    I always leave it in gear if i'm on an incline because the parking brake is ..lets say ...less then excellent. If you forget to put it in neutral before you turn the key to start...the car knows this and puts it in neutral for you. Fact. Putting the car in gear at a light takes no longer then a car that has self stop start, not an issue. If your on a hill, put your foot on the brake, engage first gear and go to the loud pedal before releasing the brake, like all standard cars. Love the sound and room for four humans with legs.
     
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  14. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Lifetime Rossa

    Jul 19, 2008
    31,518
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    Notes on the throw-out bearing. First, with F1 the clutch is always open when you are stopped, even in neutral. Second, the throw-out bearing is a constant contact type.

    One of our pros said the T/O bearing gets about 3 times the wear of a 3 pedal bearing. Coasting in neutral does cut down on T/O bearing cycles, even if nothing is gained while actually stopped. If coasting in neutral and traffic starts moving, either the upshift or downshift paddle will get you the same gear. That gear will be too high for comfortable acceleration. As a technique, I use the downshift paddle to get a gear and then make an immediate downshift to get a usable gear.
     
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  15. LimoParty

    LimoParty Rookie

    May 16, 2020
    7
    London
    Full Name:
    Robert
    Piper - Like your driving. I also slip to neutral downhill and when coming to a stop. Forgotten if that is a Ben Collins approved method and not bothered if I upset the Police Academy/AIM instructors! Yes, first thing I did was read the manual: 'How to start a Ferrari 612' and 'Driving the vehicle with “F1” system gears'. Trouble with four cars is each one requires a brain reset! Though I can't imagine sweating about traffic with five hundred horse, I've rarely come across anything faster.
    And thanks for more tips from tazandjan and matt dodwin. Yes, my mech is also of the 'if it ain't broke don't fix it' camp, but we always change the fluids and check everything. WRT cars for sale here in UK currently, the descriptions don't give much away regarding servicing or options, but maybe I can't read between the lines yet. So I may as well only look at ones that appeal to me visually. Oh it is fun on here.
     
  16. Piper

    Piper Two Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Jun 6, 2010
    22,717
    Northern Virginia
    Full Name:
    Bob
    Not liking pulling out into traffic uphill in a turn had nothing to do with power at all, but just a disdain for undue wear to the clutch. And really end of the day that's the main reason I got rid of the early 612. The tragedy of the F1 is they were just nearing perfection when they retired them for the DCT.

    I know what you mean about the brain reset. Porsche the key is on the other side, and the shift is in entirely different places from the MB to the Cayenne to the Ferrari. Happens all the time. :)

    Someone mentioned the parking brake earlier, I swear in the 612 it was nothing more than an attractive nuisance. In my business there's a saying, the only thing worse than a lack of security is the appearance of security. Parking brake lever on a 612 is like a diving board on an empty pool.
     
  17. m5shiv

    m5shiv Formula Junior

    Feb 25, 2013
    836
    SF Bay Area
    Full Name:
    Shiv
    #67 m5shiv, May 23, 2020 at 3:38 PM
    Last edited: May 23, 2020 at 3:43 PM
    I agree with the parking brake but not much else. I have almost 30K on my 2008 since almost new, I drive it without any special operating modes. There is only one thing I do differently compared to the other cars:

    Reversing uphill out of my garage.

    I must wait until the car is slightly warmed up, then I accelerate hard in one clean motion to prevent the clutch from slipping and self destructing. I also come down the hill in neutral, because the software really struggles, pulling the clutch in and out continually at low speed.
     
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