79 308GTB fans don't power up when temp rises | FerrariChat

79 308GTB fans don't power up when temp rises

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by CCCVIII, Dec 8, 2006.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. CCCVIII

    CCCVIII Karting

    Dec 7, 2006
    186
    Oakland, CA USA
    Full Name:
    Jerry Turney
    The 1979 308GTB fans don't come on when temp rises. Engine temperature runs at +/-185 degrees while crusing. But, in traffic temperature climbs unless AC is switched on.

    Both fans power up when jumped directly with 12v.
    Right fan powers up when AC is switched on.
    Radiator bimetal thermocouple produces 100ma+ at +190 degrees.
    Fuzzes are correct & fucntional.

    What next should be checked when trying to get the fans to come on?!

    Jerry
     
  2. 410SA

    410SA F1 Veteran

    Nov 2, 2003
    8,511
    West Coast
    Full Name:
    A
    Have you checked the contact connection points. My XKE had the same problem and I unclipped the wires from the fan to the the power source at the connectors, cleaned and roughened the metal ends with a metal file and reconnected them. The fan worked perfectly after that.
     
  3. CCCVIII

    CCCVIII Karting

    Dec 7, 2006
    186
    Oakland, CA USA
    Full Name:
    Jerry Turney
    Good suggestion. I've removed them and reinstalled. But a good cleaning could do it. Thx. Jerry
     
  4. greyboxer

    greyboxer F1 World Champ

    Dec 8, 2004
    12,702
    South East
    Full Name:
    Jimmie
    Remove & short together the two wires on the thermostat on the radiator - if both fans come on the problem is the switch or the contacts to which the wires are connected - its usually the latter - I'm pretty sure there are threads here about replacement thermostat switches if necessary
     
  5. CCCVIII

    CCCVIII Karting

    Dec 7, 2006
    186
    Oakland, CA USA
    Full Name:
    Jerry Turney
    410SA,
    On another subject, how do you place your picture next to your ID on these threads?! Thx. JT
     
  6. f355spider

    f355spider F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    May 29, 2001
    18,054
    USA
    Even if the radiator thermo switch appears to test okay, I would replace it...get one for a 1979 VW Rabbit...about $17. They even make them in two temp ranges...get the lower one.
     
  7. AZ308GTS

    AZ308GTS Karting

    Apr 16, 2006
    182
    Phoenix,AZ
    You have a bad relay. Might as well replace them both while you're replacing relays and it won't hurt to clean all of the fuse contacts while you're there as well. Be sure to get the correct relay, they may all look the same and fit in the same hole but......
     
  8. fletch62

    fletch62 Formula Junior

    Mar 8, 2004
    333
    Fairhope, AL
    Full Name:
    Larry Fletcher
    You can jump the relay with a wire and see if they come on. I think it is pin 30 and 87, there will be a diagram on the side of the relay. They are standard bosch relays try A&F in oakland they can get them without "The Ferrari routine of grabing your ankles"
     
  9. CCCVIII

    CCCVIII Karting

    Dec 7, 2006
    186
    Oakland, CA USA
    Full Name:
    Jerry Turney
    All,
    Thx for the info.

    Does anyone have data re the radiator bimetal thermocouple's amperage?
    Milleamps increases as temp rises starting at 70ma @ 170 degrees increasing to 104ma @ 195 degrees. Is 100ma+ enough to trip the relay?

    And, a $17 rabbit thermocouple (+relays) won't break the lunch budget - so to speak.

    Back at you in a couple of days.
     
  10. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    26,931
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
    #10 Steve Magnusson, Dec 9, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    The switching device mounted in the bottom radiator tank is a bimetallic thermostatic switch or thermoswitch (not a thermocouple). It should have an abrupt conductivity behavior change with temperature (cold=open and warm=closed).

    The internal switching coil of a ...113 Bosch relay draws 140~160 mA at 12.6V (and it decreases a little as the coil warms up). If the engine is running (i.e., the alternator has raised the voltage slightly), it might draw a little more current, but your measurements seem much too low for actuating two ...113 relays -- you should be measuring ~300 mA total flowing thru the thermoswitch wires if you directly connect the GV (yellow/green) wire to the N (black) wire with your ammeter leads.

    I think it would be highly unlikely for two relays to fail simultaneously, so if you're only getting 70~100 mA, you've got some high impedance in a connection (or the thermoswitch itself -- if you're leaving that in the circuit when making the current measurement).

    The next thing to do would be to use your ammeter to connect the GV wire at the thermoswitch to the "-" battery terminal:

    If that works (but touching the GV wire to the N wire doesn't work), the N wire is not well grounded.

    If it's still dead, follow Larry's suggestion to remove those ...113 relays and touch a jumper wire from the 30 terminal slot to the 87 terminal slot (either middle 87 or bottom 87 -- it will have a female metal terminal)
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  11. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

    Jun 20, 2003
    6,689
    North shore, MA
    Full Name:
    THE Birdman
    If one fan comes on with AC, you can rule out that relay. I find it hard to believe it's the relays. The things that generally can cause this issue (in order):

    1. Thermostatic switch in the radiator, or more often the connectors on it.
    2. Relays (but rarely BOTH like Steve said).
    3. Fuseblock. On the right fuseblock, the rightmost pair of fuses both get their current through the busebar on the back and the through-rivets. When the rivets corrode, it creates resistance, which makes heat, and the fuseblock melts. Now one or more of the contacts on that bar stops working. It is my experience that 90% of the time a non-functional fan in a 308 has a bad fuseblock.

    An injected car always seems to melt the left fuseblock on the fuel pump circuit. The carbed ones always seem to melt the right fuseblock on the fan circuit.

    Check power at the bottom of the right two fuses on the right fuseblock.

    Then e-mail me for the replacement. ;)

    Birdman
     

Share This Page