No black one, mostly metallic red, green and blue, also a white one all naked coming straight from Scaglietti.
One has to be very brave with the interior as well a decent stripe along with painted shields to try make something of it
The table below lists the performances of the cars and some of the characteristics of the Ferraris V12 front engine models, except the special Editions, produced from 1966 onwards. Comparing this information allows a better understanding of how this class of Ferraris has evolved over the last six decades. POWER It is notable how from 1966 to the present day the power of the V12 engine has increased more than two and a half times. This was achieved fundamentally by increasing the capacity of the engines. This increase in engine power radically changed the power to weight ratio of successive models and as an example, it can be seen that the F12 B has a PWR value that is practically double that of the 275GTB4. Interestingly, the V12 on the 275GTB4 at maximum speed was more rotating (8000 rpm) than the engines of the 365 GTB4, 550 M and 575m that followed it. In terms of the increase in engine power in this V12 class, the new models always presented a higher power value than their predecessors. However, there have been three decisive power increase moments in this class. In 1996 the 550 M V12 had 133 cv more than the one of its predecessor 365 GTB4. Later in 2006, the 599 GTB V12 appeared with 103 cv more than its predecessor 575 M. Finally, in 2012 the F 12 B V12 was revealed with 120 cv more than its predecessor the 599 GTB. MAXIMUM SPEED In this period of almost 6 decades, the top speed of models in this class increased by 82 Kph, going from 258 Kph in the case of the 275 GTB4 to > 340 Kph, stagnating at this value after the launch of the 599 GTB. However, it took 28 years for a large quantitative leap in top speed to occur. This happened in 1995 with the appearance of the 550 M whose top speed is 40 Kph higher than that of the 356GTB4. FIORANO TIMES As the Fiorano circuit opened in 1972, there are only time records for models launched from that date onwards. Since the launch of the 550 M in 1996, all models in this class have had a Fiorano lap time approved by Ferrari and hence the great strangeness surrounding the fact that a lap time for the 12 C has not been revealed. There are 21 years in between the 550 M and 812 SF and in this period, the Fiorano lap time of the Ferrari V12 front engine models, excluding the special Editions, has been reduced by 11 seconds. The biggest reduction occurred between 2002 and 2012. First between the 575 M and the 599 GTB (2002-2006) in which the Fiorano lap time was reduced by 5 seconds and later, between the 599 GTB and the F12 B (2006-2012) in which an additional 4.1 seconds were removed. The remaining differences are of approximately 1 second and therefore less significant, occurring between the 550 M and the 575 M and also between the F12 B and the 812 SF. My conclusion is that the class of front engine Ferraris V12, not considering the special Editions, reached its peak with the appearance of the F12 B. Although the 812 SF and the 12 C are better cars and technologically more advanced using innovative systems and having much more sophisticated driver aids than those of the F12, the fact is that even with all that they are not much faster in terms of Fiorano lap time. Since at best the 12 C is only marginally faster than the 812 SF at Fiorano is an indication that we have probably reached the end of the line for this class of cars and not much more can be extracted out of the naturally aspirated V12 engine.. As we have become accustomed over decades to seeing that the next Ferrari was always faster than its predecessor, we will probably have to change the paradigm to: The next front engine Ferrari with an aspirated V12 engine, if there will be another one, it will no longer be faster non more powerful than its predecessor. Then what will differentiate the new car from its predecessor will be mainly the design and the more advanced features introduced due to evolution of technology. Image Unavailable, Please Login
Fabulous write up Mario, thank you for the effort, it gives a nice perspective on the Ferrari V12 line. What I can add is it seems to me, beginning with the 365 and continuing through the 575, the V12 was seen as a GT car. Yes, very sporting of course, but GT none the less. So when they made a special edition of the 550 and 575, they looked to make these cars open, which is nice, but it does not add more performance. I think they tried to turn this into a front engined supercar with the 599, but did not quite hit the mark. The 599 GTO sought to bring a huge performance improvement over the GTB. Now the focus on the special, or limited, edition is performance. And so, they made many improvements, and for the successor, they built a new chassis, and the F12 was born. It was a bullseye from the start. The 812 pushes deeper into the front engine V12 as a supercar concept. The shifts are faster, the sound is louder, and the handling is better and more refined at the same time. (The F12 suspension could be undone by a road with repeating bumps). The TDF was a huge step ahead. Again, it is about performance. The successor, the 812, has the headline about the power. When they were released, the front engine V12s were the flagship models for the production line. Cylinders=power. Simple to understand. But I found the 812 SF to be a car that was a little bit at odds with itself. On the one hand, it is wildly powerful and capable, but on the other, it is physically large and at times wants to be a GT, but the ride is firm and the sensations are a little too overwhelming to be a great GT. I think they struck a better balance on the GTS model, where things are relaxed just a touch, and I think it’s better for it, in terms of overall use. My opinion is the GTS is the sweet spot for a modern V12. The Dodici Cilindri seems to be going back to a more GT approach. They now have other models with more power, where cylinders alone = power. So I think they’ve given the V12 a place to be the emotional flagship. And if this is true, that the Dodici is now in the GT family vs the Sports car family, then what if they don’t need to release a Fiorano lap time? Do they release a time for GT cars like Roma? Another follow on thought, if the Dodici has moved into the GT family, will there be a limited or special series model? Time will provide answers. First, however, we will need to live with it to truly understand.
Well said @Caeruleus11, as usual. "Emotional flagship" is a perfect moniker. And what's wrong with that? I, for one, am glad that Ferrari can simultaneously make ballistic cars like the SF90 XX and cars that tug on their drivers' heartstrings in different ways. Just like my two Ferraris, which are so fantastic and so different. And each makes me appreciate the other more. Whatever my reservations about the design, I think it's wonderful that Ferrari is making this car. They deserve a lot of credit for it.
Jerry excellent analysis as always and I agree with everything you said. Now I'm almost convinced that the 12 C really marks the change of paradigm in this Ferrari car category.
Very nice summary on the front mid V12s. Ferrari realized we have reached the apex in what the V12 can do especially as a front mid engine car. I have no issue with the emotional flagship (heritage) classification of the car. It is what it is (boy I do hate that line). But the design of the car is polarizing at best and then to ask $500K+ for a car that doesn’t look it and doesn’t perform it and using an engine which has had its mechanicals and tooling previously depreciated with the 812C is Italian chutzpah at its finest.
I think that is a completely reasonable way of looking at the Dodici. But the other side of the coin is they want to continue the front engine V12 lineage into modern times, and this is how they have decided to do it. Let’s face it, if we are fans of what came before, then we would have probably said, make the new car like the 812 or F12, but even better. If the styling looked like that, then we might all instantly love it, but a few years into production, it might turn out that new car buyers aren’t that excited about something that looks like what came before. I think going with a change is a good idea, they have to design a car that will remain relevant to the market not just at debut, but for many years. From a sales perspective, we can judge its success or not based on how it does. We can debate if we think they hit their marks in terms of the styling. Time will tell.
One rather obvious explanation for conflicting Fiorano lap times could be this: Ferrari added GPF to 812SF for later production models. I have always wondered how did they do that without reducing power/torque or adding weight. Perhaps there was a performance drop after all. Raffaele de Simone's comment could therefore mean that 12 Cilindri is 'way faster' than GPF version of 812SF.
The Aston Martin Valkyrie, with its naturally aspirated 6.5-liter V12 engine with 1,001 horsepower output, is proof that it will not be necessary to increase the capacity of the 12C's current V12 nor resort to hybridisation to reach the 1000 HP barrier or even surpass it. Obviously, it will have to be a different engine from the current one in the 12 C but that is something that is perfectly within Ferrari's reach. Apparently the strategy followed by Ferrari was to transform the 12 C into a comfortable GT, stagnating its performance in relation to the 812 SF. However, it seems to me that there are still customers for a future Ferrari front engine with an aspirated V12 whose power is closer to the territory of the SF 90. Some will tell me that a new naturally aspirated V12 engine with 20% more power will have great difficulty complying with the draconian Co2 emission rules imposed by the EU. Perhaps this is true, but we should not forget that E-fuels are here to stay and are the future solution to this problem.
It is highly unlikely that Ferrari will push dynamic and power performances for next V12 front engine models, it is very unlikely we will ever see a performance oriented VS for such range, I doubt there will be a 12c competizione, as now the focus is for very powerful but comfortable GT with low aero...so it does not make much sense to push the boundaries for a compromised car which is still slower than the next V6 sport model. On the other hand, this is very positive since having a purely elegant and classy GT line with 12C and Roma, Ferrari can now go full wildness on 8 and 6 cylinders range, keeping pace with Porsche GT2/3RS, Mecca LT and Lambo SV versions. Having said that, I'll miss the aggressive gorgeousness of F12 TDF and 812C.
I am not convinced that Cosworth's efforts have resulted in a durable engine (go at least 50,000 miles without require full rebuild), they have no history of building a V12 that is durable and not requiring full rebuilds (transmissions too). Satisfactory for boutique cars where mileage will not be added in any appreciable amount. That means you can take shortcuts in a 'race engine' that is not intended to last to that of a general street car will be burdened with such design over time (i.e. requiring full rebuilds). Ferrari publicly disbanded their V12 development team, very unlikely that will change, quite possibly ever change. Not saying the 12c is the last V12 model but engine-development wise, it's over for now, it's already 'been over' for 3.5 years. E-fuels are never going to scale to 100% replace traditional gasoline, period. The best they can do is to do a very low-end blend with traditional gasoline that would be inconsistently available at best. Not including use in very limited situations such as motorsports where 100% E-fuel can be used due to the comparatively small amount required (in comparison to general street usage needs).
If so, it means this class of Ferraris with an aspirated V12 front engine stagnated with the 12 C and what comes next, if it comes, will be more or less the same in terms of powertrain, only with improvements resulting from technological evolution. If so, we will have a successor basically like the 12 C but with a different design. In the past, a good part of the customers who bought models of this class were not looking for this, but rather expected a new model that was more performant than the previous one. Times change and desires change and this is fundamentally good for Ferrari because it eliminates the financial and technological effort inherent in developing a new naturally aspirated V12 with greater power.
Why would Ferrari give up offering a limited VS and VS Aperta? They never really add any power just aero, brakes, and one tech upgrade. And a helping of flaps and gills. Sell every one and add excitement back into the range. Remember - they will be the last ones!! Sign up now.
Without a pollution control device, this engine produces about 900 hp. It is at the end of its development and will culminate in the Competizione version. It will be used for Icona and in principle it will be the end of the species, unless he decides to build a new V12 hybrid, which is not a question today There is nothing more we can do apart from hoping for some recycling ...
Will they do a 12 Cilindri M or refresh? Or is it 4-5 years of 12 Cilindri + Competizione and then the range V12 is done?
Unless Ferrari designs a new V12(very unlikely as the new F80 hypercar is a twin turbo V6 hybrid), the only way we wring better performance out of the frontmidV12 is going hybrid (an anathema for many here) or adding lightness. Decontent future cars or go carbon fiber chassis ( can they go lighter on an aluminum frame? Probably using AI design technology it’s doable) An 830 hp 3200lb wet front mid with RWS would be a formidable performer while retaining classic Ferrariness
Ferrari already said they don't like the idea of a hybrid V12 due to the additional weight. It will be interesting to see where and how this goes.
Of course they can. Any engine engineer (called "motorista" in Italian) is capable of developing any kind of engine. The company has a huge depth of talent, they weren't relying on Leiters for the V12, he was just another engineer. The question is whether they want to invest in a new V12, given the regulatory pressures.
The front of the 12 C and the released F80 show similarities regarding the black band and the headlights. In the past, in the days of Montezemolo, there was no similarity whatsoever between the front of the V12 front engine model and Ferrari's number 1 super sports car. I don't know if this new trend is good or bad but nowadays in terms of design, everything seems to be possible at Ferrari. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login