The 599 doesn’t seem to have any direct influence that I can see. Manzoni was open about consciously trying to interpret the Daytona for the 812SF.
Come on guys, back to 167 and a little joy at the start of summer. Look at that bonnet, it opens almost like a Monza ! Have a good summer everyone, enjoy your cars !!!
Ha! You are such a tease!! I keep reminding my dealer that I’m on the list as soon as announced! Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
so, my assumption is the hood opens like this (rather than the full cowl rising like the Monza): Image Unavailable, Please Login because airbags underneath pop if there is a pedestrian collision, but, that allows the front engine profile/hood/bonnet to have a lower stance because it does not need to be "so tall" with padding that would otherwise be required for pedestrian impact protection, just like what Jaguar did years ago: https://www.popsci.com/12-gauge-shotguns/article/2006-03/hood-explodes-safety/
The 'no back window' is a terrible idea, has zero merit, is a design failure, it is not a delivery truck! and, no, there is zero aerodynamic benefit to no backwindow+L-shaped things, the 812c is not what Ferrari wants you to believe: https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/posts/148205615/ Hope that changes for the reveal and the car has a proper back window.
So at the end of the day why do we think they chose that design as opposed to having a rear screen? They didn’t make that decision for no reason
My theory is: For the 812c, Ferrari hired an outside firm to design an aero package, the design they came up with and patented, was foolish and impossibly complex, requiring the back hatch to rise/lower, but, it was too late, Ferrari already "baked" that into the design (no back window) and then promoted it to the press as being what it was originally intended, though, it obviously is not (based on patent which I reviewed in my link), but, Ferrari has too much ego to admit it is nothing other than a gimmick. Now, moving forward, why would F167 have that same idea? Unless it too had that design "baked" in years ago (F167 has been "in process" off/on since at least 2017!), maybe Ferrari has figured out how to make the aero idea work, we will see, but I doubt it, too complex, so, chances are the F167 will suffer foolishly with no back window just like the 812c since they were designed, more or less, at the same time...
Its because Manzoni designs are disjointed with accents that sometimes seem really out of place. A wide hatchback with a large concealed rear glass is such an example.
I think rear window will be in place . This is just a mule or just for a joke they didn’t use rear window due to many replacements on 812 sf
So, by any chance is this mule actually the soft top Roma spider? The rear window would have to be soft or very different to fit a soft top. Maybe the wrapped the whole thing to through us off. This model would come out before the 812 replacement, if it is indeed happening, and to my knowledge there are no spy shots of it. Timing and circumstances seem odd to me. Maybe a dumb theory but figured I would throw it out.
Do we know if the final EURO 7 emission regulations have been approved? I know that small manufacturers have more freedom to manage their emissions up until 2035 but what other restrictions such as noise etc…are due to be in place by 2025? Assuming the next 812 is a NA V12 do we think its nature / sound / emotion can remain the same?
Not yet: https://www.transportenvironment.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/2022_06_Civil_society_letter_Euro7_postponement.pdf Brussels, 30th of June 2022 Reaction to the Commission’s postponement of the publication of Euro 7/VII proposal Dear Vice President Timmermans, et.al. We are greatly concerned at the further postponement of the Commission’s proposal on the new Euro 7/VII vehicle pollution emission standards for cars, vans and heavy-duty vehicles expected since 2021 to November 2022. Once again delaying the publication of the Euro 7/VII proposal seriously casts into doubt the Commission’s commitment.... Euro 7 is still a moving target, but getting closer: https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/infographics/fit-for-55-emissions-cars-and-vans/ Watch here: https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/meetings/eurogroup/2022/11/07/ # # # Safety, Sound, are handled separately...will most definitely affect the F167 (812 successor) as it will be first delivered to customers after January 2024, expect it to use hot tubes... Image Unavailable, Please Login https://www.researchgate.net/figure/fig2_315704371 https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Danijela-Miloradovic/publication/315704371/figure/fig2/AS:613906628218907@1523378154949/figure-fig2.png and then another level down in 2026: https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1124281_new-european-regulation-means-future-sports-cars-wont-be-as-loud The new European Union regulation, No. 540/2014, aims to reduce noise levels from the current 74 decibels to 68 decibels by 2026. The only place you will be able to "hear" your car is in the cabin via hot tubes/or artificial sounds via the stereo speakers...! sad times, expect more 'noise suppression' tech in all cars...those that survive... https://vervetimes.com/nissan-discontinues-gt-r-in-europe-over-noise-regulations/ https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-10-16/rolls-royce-s-new-car-was-so-quiet-at-first-it-made-drivers-nauseous https://www.wardsauto.com/news-analysis/tenneco-moving-toward-noise-cancellation-system https://www.eenewsautomotive.com/en/how-to-cancel-engine-booming-noise-and-enhance-driving-conditions/ a bit too authoritarian: https://www.transportxtra.com/publications/local-transport-today/news/71031/spain-cracks-down-on-vehicle-based-environmental-and-noise-pollution
Excellent literature thank you. Indeed the sound and purity of those engines may never be the same again sadly. The 812C already doesn’t sound as exciting and angry as the tdf ( and 599 gto) and it is not subject to the eur 7 new requirements as yet
You are welcome. There is no doubt cars, as originally produced, from this time forward will ever sound great again... True on the 812C, it is affected by GPF and noise regulations that came into effect for new models first delivered after Jan 1 2020: https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/consumer-news/86494/eu-lower-conventional-car-noise-make-electric-cars-louder The European Parliament has approved a law to reduce new car noise-levels by 4 decibels via a three-phase plan which will begin in 2016. The legislation will also require all electric cars to make an articficial noice to warn pedestrians of their presence. The European Union will implement the first part of the three-phase plan as of July 1 2016. The second phase will come into effect from 2020, and the final part in 2024. The first part of the EU's proposed plan will only apply to new engine noise limits in new vehicle types. The second and third phases will bring in lower decibel values and also include all new vehicles produced (i.e. existing models still in production from previous to 2020/2024) in 2022 and 2025, two years after they begin. The new legislation will require car manufacturers to use EU-wide labelling to display the noise of their cars in decibels which are similar to the labels already in use for displaying efficiency ratings and noise characteristics on tyres for sale across the EU. EU aims for 25 per cent decrease in noise pollution by 2026
This video gives you a sense of the loss of sound, after the first minute or so, skip ahead to 6m 12seconds (through 7m 5s) gives a good mix of old and new and the sound that has been lost, note, when the squealing of the tires is louder than the exhaust...hmm
Indeed the sound of the FXXK Evo and 599XX in comparison to the 812C is if another dimension. Clearly something is lost. The Comp still sound ok but nothing compared to its predecessors probably the last special series V12 with a good sound. The SF90, Roma and 296 sound awful, really awful
It is what it is. We 'll just have to adapt. BTW, I hate the obnoxious noise that Harleys make. I am glad we won't get any more of that... You can't compare road cars to track cars. BTW, in Europe we have noise limits even in tracks nowadays.
Found one with the F12 TDF (significantly better than 812C...) watch this segment for full sound at launch: 2m18s - 2m22s
