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812 Spider

Discussion in 'FF/GTC4Lusso/F12/812S' started by MalibuGuy, Sep 22, 2018.

  1. klinkman

    klinkman Formula Junior
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    Jan 29, 2018
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    Eric C
    Congrats as well.
    Wonder who is going to get to the finish line first. ;)
     
  2. deltona

    deltona Formula 3

    Aug 7, 2009
    1,332
    UK
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    Justin
    UK dealers have been given a list of ‘first customers’ for the GTS.

    Dealers require a £35k deposit by next Wednesday 18th September to secure those first cars.

    Criteria for these first cars is at least 812 ownership/order along with Portofino or Lusso.

    Dealer demonstrators mid 2020, first RHD customer cars end of 2020 early 2021.

    I’m in. :)
     
    JagShergill likes this.
  3. Michael Kulisz

    Oct 21, 2018
    11
    Full Name:
    Mike Kulisz
    Also in on 812 GTS. Just confirmed my SF90 yesterday as well! Excited for everything Ferrari ATM, no better brand!
     
  4. jpalmito

    jpalmito Formula 3


    Very interesting
    Thanks a lot.

    Just one question ,
    Because of all those future regulations, do you think it is plausible they will replace V12 front engine range with a V12 rear mid engine range ?
     
  5. MDEL

    MDEL Formula 3
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  6. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota Formula 3

    May 29, 2019
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    A.B
    No
     
  7. Maloja

    Maloja Karting

    Oct 19, 2016
    107

    I have also put in an order for an 812 GTS yesterday but I currently „only“ own a GTC4Lusso ;as well as an F12 but have no order pending for an 812SF.
    My dealer at Gohm in Germany told me it is certainly good that I currently own these two V12‘d ( had for a couple of months also an FF before the GTC4Lusso arrived) but it will be up to Ferrari to decide if it will be sufficient to get an effective 812 GTS allocation.
    What do you guys think in terms of allocation probability? Thanks!
     
  8. davide b

    davide b Formula Junior

    Mar 6, 2007
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    montecarlo
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    davide
    From what I know Ferrari require a gt car, not specifically an 812
     
    635CSI likes this.
  9. Art_collector

    Art_collector Rookie

    Jul 13, 2019
    37
    Do some one have a photo of the options of the grey 812 GTS?
     
  10. Ltfor3

    Ltfor3 Rookie

    Oct 14, 2013
    23
    FL
    Full Name:
    L.T.
    I am trying to get on the list and should know soon. I currently have a '17 Cali T SH and just sold a '15 458 Speciale. I also have an 812 on order for October/ November delivery. What are my chances?
     
    of2worlds likes this.
  11. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2011
    5,691
    Bournemouth, UK
    Ferrari doesn't regard the 812 as a GT anyway. They are right, you know...
     
  12. JTSE30

    JTSE30 Formula Junior

    Oct 1, 2004
    839
    Austin TX

    My concern is the future sound/noise regulations with new testing procedure that must be tested using the loudest exhaust settings (so hybrid/ev mode do not apply, closed/vs/open exhaust values must always test with open exhaust valves so maximum noise is tested) are what is going to reduce the aural driving enjoyment. Interestingly, GPF helps reduce exhaust noise levels so Ferrari does not have any incentive from a regulatory standpoint to make the car (any they make) louder. "Hot Tubes" such as that in the F8 (and in use with many other manufacturers) where engine noise is piped into the cabin because the exterior exhaust sound levels are dramatically reduced will become prevalent in all exotics over the next few years, at least those sold in EU and due to homologation expenses for various exhausts it is quite unlikely a smaller company such as Ferrari will make different exhausts.

    That said, placement of engine in the chassis will not matter so moving the V12 behind the passenger compartment is not going to help solve any regulatory requirements in any way I can conceive of.

    I think it may be where there are no more V12s in regular production. Know this, the new sound regulations are ever tightening:

    Image Unavailable, Please Login

    And interestingly, the 812 with its 588 kW engine (800PS, 789bhp), at 6.5L is actually subject to the lowest sound requirement! 588/6.5 = 90.46kW/l, so the "<= 120kW/l" setting above applies! Versus the F8 with its 529 kW engine (710bhp) at 3.9L (529/3.9 = 135kW/l) is subject to the higher level (<= 160kW/l), how does that make any sense?

    So, the F8 can be louder than the 812 based on the above table!

    So Ferrari needs a high horsepower low engine displacement to dial into the sweet spot greater than 160kW/l, for instance, 800 PS engine using 3.6L displacement.

    All that said, a small V12 block, rear-mid-engine, making 800PS is unlikely, but, with combined output with a hybrid system then it could happen.

    But Leiters has already said no to hybrid, downsizing and turbocharging, so, a larger block V12 would seem to be only option (besides staying same size) but is subject to quietest noise regulations and, well, I doubt the V12 will continue as they would have to make it small. But, if they did decide to make a 3.6L V12 it would have to be rear-mid-engine because that is the only way electric motors can fit up front to drive the front wheels, no room for that plus an engine up front and they would need to do that to get more power because a 3.6L V12 with all the tricks, naturally aspirated probably could only make 450-500hp at the most.

    Tough decisions to be made, lots of forcing from EU regulations suffocating
     
  13. JTSE30

    JTSE30 Formula Junior

    Oct 1, 2004
    839
    Austin TX
    Interesting, are you working with MAG in Dublin OH? Did you happen to order your 812 this past April? Give them a call, but know this, MAG does not receive a lot of allocations so they are going to reserve those for their top clients, that is my presumption. Best to give them a call and get on the list now...
     
    of2worlds likes this.
  14. Ltfor3

    Ltfor3 Rookie

    Oct 14, 2013
    23
    FL
    Full Name:
    L.T.
    I’m actually in FL most of the year and deal with Ferrari in FL. My sales guy is actually at the plant this week and we are touching base next weekend. I have updated my location. Thx.


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
  15. jpalmito

    jpalmito Formula 3


    Thanks again , very instructive.
    We can only hope they will find a way ( technically) to let the glorious V12 in the regular range.
     
  16. F2003-GA

    F2003-GA F1 World Champ
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    Nov 2, 2003
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    Jaz
    IMO Innotech sounds better
     
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  17. JTSE30

    JTSE30 Formula Junior

    Oct 1, 2004
    839
    Austin TX
    Agreed, but, appears completely impossible, at least on the exterior of the car (another reason the 812GTS has to be now, and quite possibly too late already because the exhaust sounds will be quiet per EU regulations

    As a comparison:
    https://www.counterspacegarage.com/blog/publications/these-stock-cars-fail-laguna-seca-sound-limit/

    excerpt:
    During the majority of track days held at Laguna Seca, cars whose noise levels are measured to be over the 90dB threshold get a mechanical flag for a sound violation.

    and:
    Many sports cars sold in the US market are already too loud for Laguna's sound limit in stock form. For example, all of the following models in showroom trim are known to get flagged at Laguna Seca for being too loud:
    • Ferrari 458
    • Ferrari F430
    • Audi R8
    • Lamborghini Huracan

    so, note, the limit for 2020 for the 812 is 70db, using the new testing procedure which does take a blend of constant speed plus wide open throttle to achieve its rating, all cars no matter what (at least made for EU) will become more and more quiet as these 'noise regulations' are implemented...

    see page 10 here for some details of how sound tests determine sound level:
    https://www.unece.org/fileadmin/DAM/trans/doc/2010/wp29grb/ECE-TRANS-WP29-GRB-52-inf07e.pdf
     
    of2worlds, Bundy and jpalmito like this.
  18. italiafan

    italiafan F1 Veteran

    Jul 19, 2006
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    Stickbones Swagglesmith
    I’ll be keeping my 16M...guessing it to be around 200db! :D
    Maybe that’s why my tinnitus is getting so bad...worth.
     
    stavura, of2worlds, day355 and 4 others like this.
  19. klinkman

    klinkman Formula Junior
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    While it’s true many of Laguna’s days are under a restricted limit, there are opportunities. One is coming up I will be attending with the 812 that is 103db. All is not lost
     
  20. sampelligrino

    sampelligrino Formula Junior

    Apr 16, 2017
    671
    what a buzzkill. I can even try to force myself to understand the need for GPF as an emissions/environmental thing, but sound??? cmon

    Apparently regs are making EVs has some noise too, for safety purposes, FFS... can't wait for when all cars have to be 40.73db, or else....
     
    stavura, of2worlds, Bundy and 2 others like this.
  21. JTSE30

    JTSE30 Formula Junior

    Oct 1, 2004
    839
    Austin TX
    40 would be average decibel for inside a home with background noises, a/c, frig, etc...
    here's short list

    Average decibels (dB)
    Leaves rustling, soft music, whisper
    30

    Average home noise
    40

    Normal conversation, background music
    60

    Office noise, inside car at 60 mph
    70 <=== 2020 regulation for 812 ! averaged, not max, car can be louder at max volume but, must average out at 70dB!
    that's thru July 2022 and then it gets even quieter!
    'active noise cancellation' (ANC) will likely be required at that point


    Vacuum cleaner, average radio
    75

    Heavy traffic, window air conditioner, noisy restaurant, power lawn mower
    80–89 (sounds above 85 dB are harmful)

    Subway, shouted conversation
    90–95

    Boom box, ATV, motorcycle
    96–100

    School dance
    101–105
     
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  22. LandandcarsAZ

    LandandcarsAZ Karting

    Jun 14, 2018
    174
    Scottsdale AZ
    Full Name:
    Robert
    Novitec will be making a killing with these regulations.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    JTSE30 likes this.
  23. MalibuGuy

    MalibuGuy F1 Rookie

    Sep 18, 2007
    4,548
    Malibu, CA
    Can anyone confirm the exterior and interior colors of the 812 Spider featured in the official video?

    To my eye the exterior is the new launch Grigio GTS and the interior is ciocolatto with contrasting stitching maybe silver?

    Anyone know if the central tunnel was in Nero or ciocolatto? And if there was an accent color line?

    The seat trim looks to be standard full electric.

    Dash and carpets are Nero.
     
    of2worlds likes this.
  24. 4_Eff_Sake

    4_Eff_Sake Formula Junior

    Jul 30, 2016
    482
    Australia
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    Scott

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