96 355 dropping a bank of cylinders. | FerrariChat

96 355 dropping a bank of cylinders.

Discussion in '348/355' started by emac, Jan 30, 2015.

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  1. emac

    emac Formula Junior
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    Sep 14, 2014
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    ernest
    Well, my honeymoon was short-lived. I only have a few miles on the car, that was supposed to be completely gone through before I bought it and started getting some problems.

    After I drive it a while it goes into a limp mode. Then all of a sudden comes back to life. No lights. It is possible there isn't a bulb in the SDL on the dash, as the CEL bulb was missing! Seems like the driver side (5-8) is going out. Car has Tubi exhaust.

    I reset codes and now get 1445, 1447, 1454 as pending. I did some reading and it seems the cat thermocouplers may be the issue. I also read that you can unplug the cat ecu and run it without??

    I am going to look closer and see if I have the black ecu's or the green ones. Any other advice to help me troubleshoot would be greatly appreciated. My hands are getting dirty way sooner than I expected! Thank you.

    ernest
     
  2. F355Bob

    F355Bob Formula 3

    Most likely cat ECU.It would randomly go into limp home mode. I had this problem on my 95 that I chased for two years off and on. Disconnected ECUs and never had a problem since. Don't know if you can just unplug on the 5.2 cars.
     
  3. emac

    emac Formula Junior
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    Thanks. I just found a great post by "Ernie" on diagnosing this issue, so I have a few things to go on.
     
  4. Badabing!

    Badabing! Formula Junior

    Mar 30, 2014
    731
    NYC
    Also check out post by DrBob101 or contact him. I believe he knowledgeable in this area.
     
  5. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    Emac. If the bulb is out or black tape over it, you have one less monitor to determine what's going on. You said the cel bulb was out so does that mean you took apart the dash pod? If you didn't I would suggest checking that and correcting it. Make sure you turn off the battery switch to avoid an airbag light.

    If you are losing a bank 5-8 it is most likely the drivers side ecu/tc fault. The best way to accurately determine what's going on is to tap the output wire of the ecu and using a dvom see what the main ecu is responding to. If you don't want to do that then you are resigned to swapping things around until the problem goes away. With a functioning sdl you will then be forced to just driving and hoping it's fixed.

    I would make sure the light is installed and not blocked out then tap the outputs and determine where the problem is coming from then fix/replace parts.

    FYI. There is a current fchat member whose sdl system probably saved his car by functioning properly. I would not suggest disabling it. Simply unplugging the ecu does not disable it either.

    Let me know if I can help.
     
  6. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    Emac. If the bulb is out or black tape over it, you have one less monitor to determine what's going on. You said the cel bulb was out so does that mean you took apart the dash pod? If you didn't I would suggest checking that and correcting it. Make sure you turn off the battery switch to avoid an airbag light.

    If you are losing a bank 5-8 it is most likely the drivers side ecu/tc fault. The best way to accurately determine what's going on is to tap the output wire of the ecu and using a dvom see what the main ecu is responding to. If you don't want to do that then you are resigned to swapping things around until the problem goes away. With a functioning sdl you will then be forced to just driving and hoping it's fixed.

    I would make sure the light is installed and not blocked out then tap the outputs and determine where the problem is coming from then fix/replace parts.

    FYI. There is a current fchat member whose sdl system probably saved his car by functioning properly. I would not suggest disabling it. Simply unplugging the ecu does not disable it either.

    Let me know if I can help.
     
  7. bobzdar

    bobzdar F1 Veteran

    Sep 22, 2008
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    Unplug the cat ecu on that side and see if the problem goes away. If it does, swap thermocouples side to side and see if the problem moves or stays on that side. If it moves, you've got a bad thermocouple. If it doesn't, you have a bad cat ecu. I would replace if you have cats, if you don't I'd just unplug it and not worry about it.
     
  8. emac

    emac Formula Junior
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    Hey guys thank you so much for the info. I read several posts late last night and i am feeling more comfortable about how the system works. My Saturday is shot for wrenching but i may get some time to look at it in Sunday. I just wanted to thank you and i will keep you posted as to what i find.
     
  9. emac

    emac Formula Junior
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    Many thanks to Bob for talking to me today about testing my ecu's. What a great guy. One ecu (bypass) was stuck on 5 volts output. Swapped it to another position and got the same output voltage. So, that seems to narrow it down to the ecu and not the thermocouple. Fingers crossed.

    On my car I have two black epoxy ecu's and one green one. A black one seems bad.....wonder if I should bite the bullet and get two? I will update this thread when I get the new one, as I hate threads without an ending!
     
  10. tbakowsky

    tbakowsky Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Sep 18, 2002
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    Grab the green units. It's preventative medicine.
     
  11. emac

    emac Formula Junior
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    Got a new Cat edu and put it in last night. Cranked the car and still had a blinking SDL. Check for codes, and had some pending codes, cleared codes. Started again and no SDL. I took it for a drive and it ran great. SDL started blinding after a few miles, but it never went solid and ran fine. I had some minor brake squeall, so I decided to bed the brakes with some hard stops to clean them up. After the second or third braking the SDL stopped blinking, and didn't come back on. Drove around for ten or fiteen minutes more and it never came back on. Weird? Maybe I have a loose connection or a short in one of the TC. In any case, thanks to you guys, I am comfortable with the problem, if it continues. Thanks.

    ernest
     
  12. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    Earnest at this point I would run the positaps into your cockpit and monitor the voltages real time. Tap the signal wires, get 3 -6' lengths of 16/18g wire , terminated the ends with an insulated terminal, get your DVOM and drive around and check the voltages. You will know immediately where your problem is. If it is an intermittent TC connection your can prove it out by swapping that TC or just getting a new TC.

    The other option is getting one known working TC and using it and seeing if the problem goes away.

    Not a very elegant diagnostic method IMO.

    Here is where you can get the positaps if you can't find them locally. Not many stores carry them.

    Posi-lock and Molex Permaseal Connectors
     
  13. GTO Joe

    GTO Joe Formula 3
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    Great web site Dr Bob, thanks for posting it.
     
  14. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    Yes. Joe the guy who runs that site is a great guy and very knowledgeable about connectors and proper crimping etc. he has some good tutorials on that on there and has sourced crimp tools at good prices as well

    He is a Jersey guy and a new proud owner of a red NSX so busy his chops if you talk to him. 😉
     
  15. ready321now

    ready321now Formula Junior

    Jan 5, 2013
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    #15 ready321now, Feb 6, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 25, 2015
    My SDL used to be present at startup, but would go away after driving and warming up the car. Thinking that heat was "curing" a potentially loose connection, I used contact cleaner on the 3 ECU's, and the problem seems to have gone away!

    I would like to see if swapping the ecu's indicates anything in your case.

    I have met up with BOB for cars and coffee before, and he has a very clever way to monitor his voltages, as described in this thread. Bob, hey buddy, did your SDL go away yet?
     
  16. emac

    emac Formula Junior
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    #16 emac, Feb 9, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 25, 2015
    I think I may have stumbled on to the problem tonight!! I kept getting what appeared to be normal readings from the ecu's but still had a flashing SDL. I read a bunch of old posts, and someone posted that their Bypass ecu and cat ecu plugs were swapped. Low and behold, so were mine! I swapped the plugs, reset codes and ran the car at idle for a good long time and it seems to be working. No pending codes, I think I was getting 1448 a bunch, which according to [banned user] is the bypass circuit. Thank you Bob for texting me back and pointing out that the cat ecu plugs are the same color (black) and the bypass is grey. Alll the rubber seals in the plugs were blue.

    Right after some back patting, I noticed a small clutch fluid leak, in the clutch housing! I have to stop looking so closely at stuff. More parts on the way.
     
  17. bobzdar

    bobzdar F1 Veteran

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    Good job! Gotta love it when it ends up being something simple like that.
     
  18. emac

    emac Formula Junior
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    At least it is doing something different now!
     
  19. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
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    That swapping of connectors must have been the last mechanic who did the major engine out. I did it once on my cars, very easy to do. I am never doing that again. I am extra careful around that neck of the woods now.
     
  20. emac

    emac Formula Junior
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    Yep, that would make sense, as the major was done right before I got the car. He must have been in a hurry, because I found a few missing/loose screws. The pulled SDL and CEL bulbs really pisses me off. F'in lazy. I am in the process of "speaking" with them.
     
  21. GTO Joe

    GTO Joe Formula 3
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    Chalk another one up to the Forum knowledge bank, this place is great. Glad it worked out for you.
     
  22. mimo alking

    mimo alking Rookie

    Aug 6, 2010
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    Mimo
    Dear All,
    First thank you for your good and valuable information which you are sharing, actually I started to have a problem on my car (5.2) last year after major service, its just that I don't feel the 375 HP from it ! Its feel like below 250 HP. I don't have SDL OR CEL, both lights are working.
    Fuel pump pressure is normal, new spark plugs, new air filters, both engine banks are working. When I start the car initially, it will run normal but not 375 HP ! after couple of kilos driving, its goes buckling sound, bubble or like some electronic issue... when i accelerate, it doesnt accelerate normal and RPM moves very slow, please if you have any suggestions or advice, I really appreciated.
     
  23. emac

    emac Formula Junior
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    For a start, I would suggest pulling the codes and make certain the bulb in the SDL/CEl is working when you turn the key on.
     
  24. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Aug 10, 2002
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    Classic. Just because there are receipts for a job does not mean a good job has been done. Add that to people who call a beltchange a major service and you got failing Ferraris that were "serviced."
     
  25. ready321now

    ready321now Formula Junior

    Jan 5, 2013
    490
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    so wait, I'm a little confused. If your ECUs were swapped why would that make the car run on 4 cIlinders? I have a P 1448 that pops up after every ecu reset...im losto...please educate me.
     

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