Alternator strangeness. Calling stooges. | FerrariChat
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Alternator strangeness. Calling stooges.

Discussion in '348/355' started by mj_duell, Nov 6, 2010.

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  1. mj_duell

    mj_duell Formula 3

    Nov 20, 2004
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    Mike
    #1 mj_duell, Nov 6, 2010
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2010
    O.K. two weeks ago my battery light started coming on at about 4000 rpm and then would go off below that rpm. Called Ernie and he figured it was the voltage regulator. No problem, I called and order a Regitar VRH2005-4A to replace the troublesome OEM Transpo regulator (part #IN220) unit in my Nippidenso Alt. Now I put the new regulator in following the instructions in this thread: http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=142329 went like clock work and then I bolted the alt back in. Now the fun begins. The second she fires up I get the battery light. I figured I must have done something wrong but I unless the part is bad I can't see how. I put a meter on the battery terminals while running and I am pulling 14.6 volts. I check again with the car off and I pull 12.96, the the alt is charging and the battery is good. I retested with the meter and was able to repeat the results. So why the battery light? I rechecked the plug at the back of the alt. and it looks like its in all the way and I do not see any other issue. One other thing, this alt was rebuilt in a local shop last spring. I assumed the rectifier and other parts are new so I did not replace the rectifier when I changed out the regulator.

    Advice?

    Thanks,

    Mike
     
  2. FandLcars

    FandLcars F1 Rookie

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    #2 FandLcars, Nov 6, 2010
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2010
    Mike - if it's not the alternator, maybe it's actually a bad battery light circuit. Have not looked at how that light is activated, but if you have a wiring diagram, maybe a look for possible problems there would be worthwhile. Best of luck finding the problem!

    PS - I'd verify you have good grounds in both the alternator and warning light circuits.
     
  3. UConn Husky

    UConn Husky F1 Rookie

    Nov 11, 2006
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    #3 UConn Husky, Nov 6, 2010
    when I rebuilt mine, I had the shop I bought the parts from put it on an alternator dyno to make sure the voltage and current output was good (great shop in Canton, I can find the name)

    Aside from that, I'd suspect grounding straps
     
  4. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #4 Steve Magnusson, Nov 6, 2010
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2010
    One other (easy) measurement that you should make is to measure the AC voltage between the battery terminals when the engine is running -- should be a low value like 0.1 VAC maximum (a larger value would condemn the rectifier). If that also measures OK (and you've got the proper ground paths in place), then you'd have to conclude that you have a problem in the rectifier -- which essentially has two sections. One "half" that feeds the "+" battery cable and one side of the warning light and the other (identical) "half" that feeds the other side of the warning light. If all the measurements at the "+" battery terminal are OK, that says that that "half" of the recitifier is OK, but, if the warning light stays "on", there must be something wrong in the other half. Good Hunting!
     
  5. Chris Honeywell

    Chris Honeywell Karting

    Nov 11, 2007
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    #5 Chris Honeywell, Nov 7, 2010
    Did you put the little wire back onto the alternator think on mine it was a small green one, with that not connected the light will come on same result if its shorting somewhere i think..
     
  6. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #6 ernie, Nov 8, 2010
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2010
    Mike,

    Did you ever look at the bullet connectors, or replace the whole damn thing? Why Ferrari has the car running through the starter then the battery is beyond me???? Any other car I've owned I could disconnect the battery and it would continue to run on the alternator. But not my 348. Disconnect the battery cable and is will drain the battery FAST then die.

    So you may want to look into that. As I told you on the phone I got rid of the stupidass bullet connectors altogether years ago. Solid cables for both the positive and negative.

    One other thing is have a look at the condition of the wiring on the green plug that connects to the regulator, on the back of the alternator. You could have busted/frayed wires?

    I HATE electric problems.
     
  7. mj_duell

    mj_duell Formula 3

    Nov 20, 2004
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    #7 mj_duell, Nov 8, 2010
    O.K. here is an update. The problem was simple but unexpected. The new Regitar VRH2005-4A regulator is bad. I pulled the alternator today do to frustration after cleaning contacts and triple checking everything. I took the alt. down to the shop that did the rebuild on it last spring and told them to fully test it and see what they came up with. I got a call a couple hours ago and they said it was a bad regulator. they switched it out for a Transpo regulator they had there and it came back to life. Now, I told them why i do not want the Transpo regulator and I want them to hunt down a USI unit as Ernie had suggested. I get the alt. back on Thursday so we will see. They were unable to specify were I could get a green connector plug like the one on the end of the wires going to the alternator, I will look around. If anyone knows where I could source one that would be great. My wire running into the current plug are cracking and should replaced for good measure.

    Now I am also about to order a complete wire kit to replace the bullets after I complete this post. I could not agree more that the OEM set-up is just plain bad and not very effective at keeping solid current running.

    Steve Magnusson - great info. thank you very much for that post. That will be great for future diagnosis.

    --Mike
     
  8. f355spider

    f355spider F1 World Champ
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    May 29, 2001
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    #8 f355spider, Nov 8, 2010
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2010
    Aeroengineman had the same thing happen to his ND alternator (in his F355) when he installed the new Regitar VR and rectifier. The VR was bad!

    There may be a quality issue with them....but at least so far, it seems they are DOA, not failing in service.
     
  9. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #9 ernie, Nov 8, 2010
    Thanks for the update Mike, and keep us posted. The USI regulator shouldn't cost you more than $40-$50 MAX. I hope they credited you for the defective part you got sold?
     
  10. mj_duell

    mj_duell Formula 3

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    #10 mj_duell, Nov 9, 2010
    Hi Ernie,
    I'm going to send the Regitar unit back and see what they say. I'm sure it will be fine. I ordered my new cables last night so no more bullets! I also talked to Ricambi about the belt and they do have the longer version for the ND alternators. I am sending the other one back. Hopefully by this weekend all will be well and running!

    --Mike
     
  11. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #11 ernie, Nov 9, 2010
    Just take your old belt and get it matched up at the parts store.
     
  12. mj_duell

    mj_duell Formula 3

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    #12 mj_duell, Nov 12, 2010
    O.K. problem found and fixed! The new regulator was not the issue. Shortly after reinstalling the alternator if failed. It was fine at idle, but after two quick throttle blips to 4000 it failed. It would then show me the battery light intermittently and was really driving me crazy. I took the alternator out again and this time went to a different rebuild shop that could test the alternator at a higher rpm. they completely stripped the alternator down to its bare parts and finally discovered the issue. I am posting this in case it ever happens to other 348 owners with Nippondenso alternators.

    I am relating what I saw and do not know the part names. There is a small wire that follows the rotor shaft from the brush area and turns under a plastic disk to go into the area with the bundled wires. It is soldered into place. Under very high RPM it can break just enough to intermittently break contact and you will lose charging. It was very hard to find this problem and they had to completely take the alternator apart to fix it. It was in expensive to fix however.

    I just happy the 348 is back together and working again. At least I know that all my connections, bolts and clips are up to snuff, seeing I only took them on and off 5 times :).
     

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