News

Another Dino on BaT

Discussion in '206/246' started by swift53, Jul 1, 2019.

  1. swift53

    swift53 F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 17, 2007
    4,443
    E.S.
    Full Name:
    Alberto
  2. cls

    cls Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 12, 2007
    1,435
    Los Angeles/Montreal
    Full Name:
    Chris
    Doesn't look bad. Some details to work on. Running condition is unknown and it doesn't look like 4k miles to me. I guess we'll have a clearer picture of the market after this.

    edit: reading through the comments makes me wonder...
     
  3. HMB-Dino

    HMB-Dino Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 28, 2010
    1,803
    Pebble Beach, CA
    Full Name:
    RonG
    E-series front end, E-series engine, E-series license plate light, E-series style steering column switch and cover. As they say, if it looks like a duck and it quacks like a duck, then it's probably a duck. This ain't no M-series Dino, especially an early one. Some of those incorrect items are `possible' in a very, very late M-series, but certainly not in an early one.
     
    Porsche Pete and Nuvolari like this.
  4. TheMayor

    TheMayor Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2008
    70,817
    Vegas baby
    Very close to my old car #00908. I had spinner knock offs.

    Mine had the clear flush blinkers and yellow rear blinkers.

    But where the plate light is on this I had a trunk button. The plate light was by the rear plate.

    Mine had electric windows and no cranks.
     
  5. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
    Honorary

    Mar 2, 2005
    12,139
    01208:
    The welding of the metal plate with the chassis number stamping looks very very strange to me.

    Marcel Massini
     
    Porsche Pete and UroTrash like this.
  6. Nuvolari

    Nuvolari F1 Veteran
    Sponsor Owner

    Sep 3, 2002
    5,059
    Toronto / SoCal
    Full Name:
    Rob C.
    Nothing about that car is consistent with a 01200 range of serial number Dino. It totally looks like a later E series that has had its serial number changed. BaT should pull this auction
     
    Porsche Pete and UroTrash like this.
  7. 19633500GT

    19633500GT F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 9, 2010
    5,599
    Connecticut
    Full Name:
    Ken S
    Marcel, what do you think of the sellers comments in trying to back up the "6 or so" different chassis plate configurations on these ? (paraphrasing, as I am by no means any type of expert on 246's, yet his defense of it's strangeness made me ponder...)
     
  8. Nuvolari

    Nuvolari F1 Veteran
    Sponsor Owner

    Sep 3, 2002
    5,059
    Toronto / SoCal
    Full Name:
    Rob C.
    I suspect the seller was unaware that the ID plate of their car had been tampered with and now is left with an expensive problem on their hands. If they did know then trying to sell the car on BAT is about as dumb a move as possible. Too many eyeballs with the ability to comment.
     
    Porsche Pete, LARRYH and UroTrash like this.
  9. 4CamGT

    4CamGT Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 23, 2004
    2,096
    Southern California
    The data plate and the VIN plate with stamping look original from an M-Series. The VIN plate looks like it was forcibly welded on top of the original VIN plate. I would be curious to see what’s under that plate! X-Ray?

    With all the production numbers, engine/gearbox numbers, wheel date codes it would be possible to really narrow down a VIN range. It would also be interesting to contact DOT with the M number to see if it was imported through DOT. It would give the importers name, where imported and date when arrived in the U.S.. If it was, they’ll share the info. Dick Merritt, if he’s still there, is who to contact. He’s one of the founders of FCA.

    Note: Not all Euro spec Dinos were imported to the U.S. via DOT.

    https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/contact-for-dick-merritt.229550/
     
    cls likes this.
  10. HMB-Dino

    HMB-Dino Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 28, 2010
    1,803
    Pebble Beach, CA
    Full Name:
    RonG
    At this point, with so much of this car clearly an E-series, it may be worth removing the VIN plate to identify the real VIN and market it as what it really is. Also, as I've stated on BaT, showing the engine # and body # would further determine its real identity.
     
    Porsche Pete likes this.
  11. swift53

    swift53 F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 17, 2007
    4,443
    E.S.
    Full Name:
    Alberto
    Therein lies the problem. Let's assume the chassis number is another, then the current docs. will not support this car
    one iota, and could lead to a fraudulent and uncomfortable situation. The plot thickens...

    Regards, Alberto
     
  12. 19633500GT

    19633500GT F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 9, 2010
    5,599
    Connecticut
    Full Name:
    Ken S
    I would wager BaT is acutely aware of the comments thus far and are examining themselves and weighing options.
     
    swift53 likes this.
  13. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 6, 2002
    70,562
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    Is this a Euro car, originally??

    It's pretty well known that an owner could buy a "new" Ferrari and have them carry the OLD VIN plate for avoiding taxation???

    The later series (per the book) do not have the "stacked " appearance of the VIN plate welds, but this one does.
    The best explanation, to me, would be an owner trading in an early car, welding the VIN onto a later series, and driving it back home.

    Customs would say: "yep, red Ferrari....what's for dinner?" and waved them on through!!
    :D :D :D

    You guys certainly are schooling them over there!
     
  14. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 6, 2002
    70,562
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    As you point out, give you the engine and transmission ID numbers and you can sort it, in 15 minutes.

    But the physical features of the car "don't lie" either unless the "mystery resto" was a huge undertaking!!
     
    Porsche Pete likes this.
  15. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 6, 2002
    70,562
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba

    I have a grinder and a Sawzall.....:D :D :D

    But, looking at the VIN itself, the numbers and "stars" look fairly legit.
    The mounting raises eyebrows, until I see the pictures from the Dino book on the early cars.
     
  16. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
    Honorary

    Mar 2, 2005
    12,139
    Body number should be stamped on hinges of trunk lid.

    Marcel Massini
     
    Porsche Pete likes this.
  17. HMB-Dino

    HMB-Dino Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 28, 2010
    1,803
    Pebble Beach, CA
    Full Name:
    RonG
    As I understand it, trunk hinges only have the chassis # starting with E-series...not so for earlier cars.
     
  18. Nuvolari

    Nuvolari F1 Veteran
    Sponsor Owner

    Sep 3, 2002
    5,059
    Toronto / SoCal
    Full Name:
    Rob C.
    I believe Marcel was referring to the body number which is indeed stamped on the hinges as well as assorted other places around the car.
     
    Porsche Pete likes this.
  19. HMB-Dino

    HMB-Dino Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 28, 2010
    1,803
    Pebble Beach, CA
    Full Name:
    RonG
    Oh right, body #...but the Compendium says that didn't happen until E-series (pg 243).
     
  20. swift53

    swift53 F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 17, 2007
    4,443
    E.S.
    Full Name:
    Alberto
    #499, L series, written in chalk behind all sorts of nooks and crannies, under the seats, and behind the gauge cluster

    Regards, Alberto
     
    Porsche Pete likes this.
  21. TheMayor

    TheMayor Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2008
    70,817
    Vegas baby
    Mine also did not have Daytona seats and had no headrest per say. The headrest was not on the seat but attached to the upholstered area behind the seat. They were not attached to the seats.

    I also had a strange chrome footrest in the passenger seat which I assume was for really small people to put their feet. :)
     
  22. HMB-Dino

    HMB-Dino Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 28, 2010
    1,803
    Pebble Beach, CA
    Full Name:
    RonG
    That's because your Dino is an L-series and you're pointing out some of the differences between L's and M's.
     
  23. TheMayor

    TheMayor Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2008
    70,817
    Vegas baby
    Yah I'm not sure where that point was. But its somewhere between these two numbers which aren't that far apart.

    If I remember, the steal in my doors was not stamped 908 (the serial number) but instead I believe 406. So I always wondered if that as 406 after the end of the 206 Dino Gt.
     
  24. sixcarbs

    sixcarbs F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 19, 2004
    6,049
    SF
    Seller finally replied today. He used a lot of words to not answer anything.
     
  25. swift53

    swift53 F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 17, 2007
    4,443
    E.S.
    Full Name:
    Alberto
    How long does it take to post the requested numbers? One line about this issue, and the rest is of no interest, as we all know the funky details.

    It appears that mystery, is the word here. If I were the seller, before the issue escalates, I would disappear with car, quietly, return it to the owner,
    and let said owner sort it out until the numbers issue is no longer a topic. But then, damned if you do, damned if you don't. If BaT takes the auction off, this car is burned.

    Poor #01208 needed to be vetted properly before offering it for sale. Specially in such a 'public' venue.

    Would 'anyone' here, have looked over the number plate issue, and just nitpick on the rest?
    We always nitpick on every car and see how many mistakes we can spot, a detective game..., but on a chassis plate? No, I did not think so.

    This car, no matter what, has a scarlet letter. I would not take it as a gift. Well... for parts, maybe:)

    Regards, Alberto
     
    Porsche Pete likes this.

Share This Page