Anyone got the 348 Head Torque settings please? | FerrariChat

Anyone got the 348 Head Torque settings please?

Discussion in '348/355' started by ItalianCarNut, Mar 29, 2015.

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  1. ItalianCarNut

    ItalianCarNut Rookie

    Jan 4, 2015
    10
    Hi Guys, can someone please give me the Head Nut Torque specs for a Ferrari 348. Also the torque setting for the front Crankshaft bolt? Cambelt broke and am now in the process of reassembly again, thanks for anyone who can help with this :)
     
  2. plugzit

    plugzit F1 Veteran
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    Dec 1, 2004
    7,684
    Redondo Beach, CA
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    Bruce Bogart
    download the WSM at ferraridatabase.com
     
  3. Brewman

    Brewman Formula Junior

    Apr 3, 2012
    417
    NC Mountains @ Boone
    Full Name:
    Joe
    This is the link to the site where you can download the WSM. Follow the two step procedure for torqueing the heads or you'll most likely end up buying more gaskets. Also pressure test the cooling system prior to installing the motor to check for leaks at the heads. This is covered in the WSM as well.

    All Ferraris
     
  4. ItalianCarNut

    ItalianCarNut Rookie

    Jan 4, 2015
    10
    thanks for that, was needing the torque settings when not using the ferrari factory tool though as dont have that
     
  5. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
    18,214
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    Tim Keseluk
    #5 2NA, Mar 31, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    The method is described on page B24 of the Workshop Manual.

    Torque each nut (previously lubricated with Molykote) to 60 Nm and subsequently turn each an additional 90 degrees.

    Because of the design of the head you'll need a tool like this. It can be made quite easily from a 15mm box-end wrench and an extension.
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  6. driesen ronald

    Aug 30, 2015
    18
    Antwerp
    Full Name:
    Driesen Ronald
    I use this key, first 6 kg/m -second 8 kg/m -and end with 10kg/m -- no 90° - it takes 6 minutes to torque 1 head, - after 2 year I have no problem or leaks at all.
     

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  7. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
    Consultant

    Nov 29, 2001
    12,811
    San Carlos, CA
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    Mitchell Le
    I don't agree with your 100 NM method, but that is ok. It's your engine you can do what you want. I would follow the 90 degree method. I work a lot on Porsche engines where they also flip flop between numerical setting and degree settings. It seems the degree specs are more prevalent for Porsche now.
     
  8. FlyingHaggisRacing

    FlyingHaggisRacing Formula 3

    Jul 2, 2013
    1,369
    The possible problems of going on NM alone are written up in many places, but the LS guys still use it.

    But with that said, 90deg is a right p.i.t.a. to do, as it takes several swings of the spanner to get 90deg. and the HE tool makes it a bit of a fuss.
    and funnily enough as I did this process a few times this past year, 90deg sort of results with 95-100NM.
     
  9. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    26,850
    socal
    You want to torque the way the manufacturer says to do it. There is good reason for the angle method verified scientifically in the torque signature analysis. TSA helps to verify componentry is up to the task ferreting out things like thread failure, embedment, and heat cycling effects to name a few.
     
  10. driesen ronald

    Aug 30, 2015
    18
    Antwerp
    Full Name:
    Driesen Ronald
    There is also a good reason to refuse the 90 deg method - after all not all nuts have the same end torque ! , and the two method end in 100 kg/m.
    But using a tool with the point of application in line with the 15mm key, and making 3 rounds, 6 - 8 - 10 Kg/m - al nuts have the same end torque and the head torque goes smoeth on - no transformation at a single point ,(90° !!) what result in leaks. Thread failure , embedment and heat cycling - they are NOT the result using the Kg/m method. And read the manual - it is aloud that a litle leak apear at the outside !! Come on now I have NO leaks at all. ( problems with Porsche are for an other forum )
     
  11. ES Motorsport

    ES Motorsport Rookie

    Jan 2, 2018
    10
    Full Name:
    Richard Anstess
    Hi all,

    I've clicked on the links above but they redirect to dodgy sites!

    I'm rebuilding a 348 now and I'm desperate for torque settings for the cam fixing caps - I have a partial Ferrari doc here that is saying 0.8Nm which sounds way to little??

    Thanks in advance for any help :)
     
  12. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic F1 Rookie
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    Dec 22, 2011
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    Yes, the specified 0.8 Nm torque in the Workshop Manual is definitely wrong. The standard torque for M6x1.0, Grade 8.8, fasteners is around 10 Nm (varies between 9 and 12 Nm in various tables). The tables that state that the torque values given are for lightly oiled fasteners usually specify around 9 Nm. Perhaps the variation 9-12 Nm I mentioned is because some tables provide torque values for fasteners that are lightly oiled (lower side) and some for dry (higher side). I have just done the camshafts on my Jaguar V8 engine which has M6x1.0 Grade 8.8 bolts for which the Jaguar specified torque is 9-11 Nm. The 348 cam caps have M6 nuts on studs but still the torque should be the same as for bolts, i.e. somewhere around 10 Nm. Perhaps Ferrari meant 8 Nm, not 0.8 Nm, so I would go for 8-9 Nm, lightly oiled.
     
    ES Motorsport likes this.
  13. ES Motorsport

    ES Motorsport Rookie

    Jan 2, 2018
    10
    Full Name:
    Richard Anstess
    Much obliged for the detailed reply- I guessed as much from the 512TR spec sheet which uses the same. Thanks again from France :)
     
  14. driesen ronald

    Aug 30, 2015
    18
    Antwerp
    Full Name:
    Driesen Ronald
    Dear friends - After many +/- 7 years - I have to replace my head gaskets - water pump problems and overheating ! The torque specifications came back in picture. I read now in a Ferrari manual the torque specifications for the 348 are 6Kg/m + 90° = in total max 7Kg/m -- 10Kg/m is TOTAL WRONG !!! I buy now Elring head gaskets (496.330 for the 360GTC Modena ) by Spareto ( +/- 40€ each ) - this gasket is a replacement for the original 830.721 old type for the 348. But attention for use the 496.330 you have to punch a 8.3mm center hole in the left under corner. The info flyer from the 496.330 gasket gives also torque 60Nm - warm up to 80° - loosen and tighten each bold ( or nut ) relaxation time and re torque. I heat the engine up ( out of the car) to +/-80° with a fries kettle and a small water pump.
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  15. Ferrarium

    Ferrarium F1 Veteran
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    Jul 28, 2018
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    Eric
    I bought new Elring gaskets for the 348 and did not have to punch any holes. The manual torque specs and procedure is indeed correct and does not sound anything like what you’re saying.

    After the initial torque sequence I let it sit overnight then recheck torque before moving to the 90 degree part.
     
    FloridaIsland348 likes this.
  16. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
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    Nov 29, 2001
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    Did you find that the torque has loosened up sitting overnight BEFORE the final 90 degrees?
     
  17. driesen ronald

    Aug 30, 2015
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    Antwerp
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    Driesen Ronald
    Dear veteran - I think you buy not new Elring gaskets but old stock - Elring has stop the production years ago , now you can only buy new gaskets from a Ferrari dealer, and they are from Reinz.(photo 1) With the old stock gaskets are no problem they are specially for the F119 engine. Now produce Elring a new gasket, and they are normal for the 360 GTC Modena, but are also usable at the F119 engine look at the flyer with the torque specifications (photo 2) Photo 3 = the new Elring on the F119 engine - the new gasket have 3 oil drain holes, but is no problem - cut the rest off - but in this gasket is the 8.3 mm center hole not present . Take note from the flyer - they says warm up the engine - at none info is standing you must wait a night for further action with the 90° job !! Note - 2new Reinz gaskets =+/- 500€ + tax + post =+/- 600€ ! 2 new Elring gaskets 2x38€ tax included +20€ post = +/-100€
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  18. driesen ronald

    Aug 30, 2015
    18
    Antwerp
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    Driesen Ronald
    The job is already months ago done, and the result is perfect - no leaks - high speed motor power - no problems. - Attention - the explanation is in fact for the 360 GTC = 60 Nm ,-- but for the Mondial = also the 348 = 60Nm torque on the nut all ready a clamping force 80 Nm on the stud !! - I am no Ferrari technician but they shall give with pleasure an explanation what the difference between the both engine is. Thanks a lot.
     
  19. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
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    Nov 29, 2001
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    How do you warm up the engine to 80 degrees C?
     
  20. driesen ronald

    Aug 30, 2015
    18
    Antwerp
    Full Name:
    Driesen Ronald
    I use a french fries kettle , and warm up the water around the 80°C - in the kettle I place a small water pump connect with the engine,( remove the thermostat ) and pump the water into the engine water pump inlet - the outlet from the water back into the kettle . With a digital themp gouge you follow the themp. It take +/- 3 hour to warm up the engine.
    Remember - torque the studs to 60 Nm - After this action I have warming up to 80°C - stop the pump and warming up - wait 15 minutes and torque with 70 Nm - look out 70 Nm = for the F119 engine 93 Nm clamping force - I made a big mistake 9 years ago ! Of course you can also 60Nm + 90° finish .
    An other remark the new gaskets from Elring ( buy from Spareto 38€ tax included ) have a feeling like glue film surface.
     

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