Anyone have experience buying/selling a car overseas? | FerrariChat

Anyone have experience buying/selling a car overseas?

Discussion in '308/328' started by rgamoras, Jun 30, 2008.

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  1. rgamoras

    rgamoras Karting

    Jun 18, 2006
    53
    Benicia
    Full Name:
    Richard Gamoras
    I have an interested buyer (actions are louder then words) for my 308. He lives in Europe and is currently arranging payment and shipping through a shipping agent either through the Port of Oakland or the Port of Los Angeles.

    Has anyone experienced payment through a 3rd party? From what he indicates, he will arrange payment through a shipping agent. The shipping agent will confirm funds received from the buyer and provide me with a copy of the check. I will then have my bank ensure that the check is good with appropriate funds; then when that checks out okay, I bring my car to the port to be shipped and in return I am handed the live check in exchange for my vehicle.

    Does that sound right or shady? Anyone have experience with buying or selling their car overseas?
     
  2. irondogmike

    irondogmike F1 Rookie

    Sep 8, 2006
    2,532
    San Diego area
    Full Name:
    Michael Tucker
    I would get a 4th party in this so if someone doesn't come through this 4th party might help,have you asked any dealers like bmw or others if they have dealt with overseas shipping?
     
  3. Wade

    Wade Three Time F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Mar 31, 2006
    32,793
    East Central, FL
    Full Name:
    Wade O.
    I sold my Ducati 1098S, with a trailer, to someone in the Czech Republic. His friend met me and inspected the bike here in Florida. Deposit was made through PayPal. I accompanied the friend (third party) to his bank (fourth party) where they wired the money to my account. At the bank eveyone's ID was presented, no worries at all. When the funds cleared I delivered the bike, by then the buyer was in town to take delivery.

    Bottom line? Conduct the business at their bank.
     
  4. rgamoras

    rgamoras Karting

    Jun 18, 2006
    53
    Benicia
    Full Name:
    Richard Gamoras
    Thanks for the advice. His friend happens to be in town this weekend on vacation with his family. He is willing to provide an international cashiers check; however, I need to check with my bank if they would be willing to accept it. If so, then I will have his friend take the car on his behalf.

    Alternatively, the bank to bank wire may be the only other option. I would just have to check if his bank (international bank) would be able to wire to my bank, Wells Fargo.
     
  5. greyboxer

    greyboxer F1 World Champ

    Dec 8, 2004
    12,665
    South East
    Full Name:
    Jimmie
    #5 greyboxer, Jul 1, 2008
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2008
    Be very very careful

    In Europe this is not unknown as a classic scam that involves a fake cheque which is only discovered by the bank after the car has been handed over leaving the vendor without car or money

    http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=195241
     
  6. Hans

    Hans F1 Veteran

    Feb 17, 2006
    7,734
    Hilversum, Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Hans Teijgeler
    What country is your buyer coming from?

    Many countries in Europe have abandoned checks LONG ago. Personally, the last time I wrote a check must have been 18 years ago. It's all electronic these days.

    Having said that, bear in mind that your buyer will be just as anxious as you are. For him to wire a large amount of money to someone who might not even own that Ferrari is pretty nerve wrecking too! So I can understand his wish to have the shipper at least see that a Ferrari is getting handed over before he's releasing the money.

    If his friend is indeed in town, he can verify that there is at least a car to be shipped. But still, if he were to wire the money then, he'd still not be sure that you would drive the car to that port. So all in all, using the shipper to arrange the handover (keys versus check) doesn't sound too weird to me....

    Hans
     
  7. Sailawaysg

    Sailawaysg Rookie

    Apr 11, 2008
    47
    I just sold my 308 to a guy in Brazil (I'm in the US), full payment has been made thru paypal and wire transfer, so I guess I'm covered. I'm about to send the title today. I have a bill of sale and he has good feedback on ebay so I feel confidant that everything is cool.
    Good luck.
     
  8. switchcars

    switchcars Formula 3

    Jul 28, 2005
    2,223
    Full Name:
    Doug
    Wire transfer only. Cashier's check could be a scam. PERIOD.
     
  9. floridajustice

    May 19, 2008
    10
    I wouldn't release anything until the funds clear and are in your account.
     
  10. fluque

    fluque Formula 3

    Jul 30, 2004
    1,759
    Above 2240m
    Full Name:
    Fernando
    +1000 Cashiers checks from an int'l buyer is always fishy.
     
  11. Robb

    Robb Moderator
    Moderator Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Feb 28, 2004
    14,341
    Full Name:
    Robb
    Cashiers checks ALWAYS take 10 to 14 days to clear. Happened to me on both sides of selling and buying with different banks so I know it is true.

    I always thought it was an automatic guaranteed transfer once presented. Not true. Wire Transfer is the only verifiable way to "instantly" have funds dropped in your account so that you can hand the title over that day.

    I sold my 911 to a buyer in Oregon. He flew in with a cashiers check and drove back. It was deposited into my bank. They informed me about the 10-14 day rule. I sent the title to him via fed-ex after it had cleared.

    No problems, but unless it's a wire, I'd hold onto the title until you are sure. That way if the cashiers check is fake, and they are out there, then you still have the title to deal with your insurance or the authorities.

    If the buyer is using a cashiers check, they should understand the time to clear and work with you so both parties are protected.

    Robb
     
  12. magnum

    magnum Formula Junior

    Feb 21, 2008
    877
    Barcelona, Spain
    Full Name:
    Antonio
    Hi rgamoras.

    I've just bought a 308 QV in SC. I'm from Spain and the transaction has been done under eBay. I've made the payment in 2 separate parts, through a bank wire transfer. There are several problems like the transfer needs almost 3-4 days to be completed. The money needs 3-4 days to be transferred from the bank in Europe to the USA bank. You must pay attention because not all the US banks accept European transfers. This situation is very hard for the guy that is waiting the money!
    Another question is that the buyer sends the funds without any proof. Maybe you can show to him some car shots from another guy... And it's easy to made a fake Certificate of Title or Car License with Photoshop... It's a risky way to do business because you don't have 100% warranty about the transaction. It's risky for the seller and for the buyer, so both are scared at the same time...
    Don't accept cheques. If you're a buyer, don't pay by Western Union, pay by Paypal por money wire, because they're trackable.
    Under eBay the feedback is a good way to judge if a guy is "clean" or not.
    I've tried my forwarding agent to do the second half of the payment, but he doesn't want to take any responsability about the money... so is another risky part!
    Well. I've made the second payment without receiveing any "proof". Only the eBay feedback was my warranty -it was a very stressfull operation for both parts-. You need a little bit of faith to complete the transaction...
    Finally everything was OK, but the delay on the money wire transfer and to receive the "real car proofs" for the buyer have been a problem.
     
  13. rgamoras

    rgamoras Karting

    Jun 18, 2006
    53
    Benicia
    Full Name:
    Richard Gamoras
    Fellow F-Chatters, thanks again for all your input and advice. It is being well taken! I have been in contact with the buyer daily through email; his EBAY user account has 100% positive feedback.

    I confirmed that his shipping company has contacted my local shipping company. Once I deliver the car to the port, he will do a bank-to-bank wire of funds. I also checked with my bank who confirmed they will be able to receive delivery of international funds as long it is converted in U.S. Dollars. Once the funds are deposited into my account, I will contact my local shipping company to give them the green light to send the vehicle.

    Alternatively, I spoke with Bruce, owner of www.fantasyjunction.com who indicated that he will would handle the receipt of payment and shipping for us, for $1000 bucks.

    So I have a couple of options, however, I am opted to go with the latter part and pay the $1000 because Fantasy Junction has been importing/exporting cars for years; they know how to do this. I will also have peace in mind knowing that I am not going to be scammed and kissing my car goodbye to international waters.
     
  14. desire308

    desire308 Formula 3

    Oct 19, 2007
    1,433
    Florida
    Full Name:
    Peter W
    #14 desire308, Jul 1, 2008
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2008
    I sold a car to a fellow in Germany. He sent a PayPal deposit and then had a broker/shipping company handle the pick up and payment. I verified the company [in Miami] and when I received the cashiers check [from a US bank, also in Florida] I went to my bank, verified the funds were indeed good and the bank manager released the funds.

    It can be a hassle but a lot safer then depositing a MO and have it turn up bad a month later...which I had happen in the past and it sucks ;)

    If you have access to a reputable agent it's worth the money.
     
  15. 4RE-MAN

    4RE-MAN Karting

    Oct 10, 2005
    74
    W.PALM BEACH, FL.
    Full Name:
    EDDIE JELLEY
    I just sold my 911 on Ebay to a fellow from Germany. He has excellent feedback.
    He requested my name , address and bank acount #. He claims that he will wire the funds.
    Is it safe to give out my acount # to a stranger???
    I have no experience in this matter. I was thinking of opening a new acount, just to get the funds and then close it.
    Please help-
    Thanks-
    Eddie Jelley
     
  16. rgamoras

    rgamoras Karting

    Jun 18, 2006
    53
    Benicia
    Full Name:
    Richard Gamoras
    Hi Eddie:

    I will soon to be in that situation; and always hesitant to give out personal financial information especially account numbers. If I do a bank-to-bank wire transfer, then I will in fact open up a new account for that purpose then close it afterwards. Or, as indicted in my earlier post, I may have the consignment company (3rd party) handle all the transactions, i.e. payment/shipping on my behalf. They are the experts in my opinion. -rich
     
  17. desire308

    desire308 Formula 3

    Oct 19, 2007
    1,433
    Florida
    Full Name:
    Peter W
    If you have the abilty to open a sepperate account for that purpose it sounds like a good idea...as long as they can't access any other info. They usually require more info than he is requesting, i.e. routing number, etc.

    BTW...I have been told wires can be reversed ;)
     
  18. rgamoras

    rgamoras Karting

    Jun 18, 2006
    53
    Benicia
    Full Name:
    Richard Gamoras
    I have spoken to my bank today (Union Bank of California); wiring instructions to the buyer should include your bank Routing Number, your bank Swift Number and your Account Number. My bank also indicated that the wire transfer must be converted in U.S. dollars. I am not exactly sure how that works.

    Based on everyone's responses, I am more and more inclined to have the entire transaction, i.e. payment and shipping to a reputable 3rd party who has experience in the import/export/purchase/sell of vehicles. -rich
     
  19. 4RE-MAN

    4RE-MAN Karting

    Oct 10, 2005
    74
    W.PALM BEACH, FL.
    Full Name:
    EDDIE JELLEY
    Hey Rich,
    Why do you think that a 3rd party would be any more trustworthy?
    The gentleman buying my Porsche has communicated rather well so far....
    I will consult my bank on Thursday morning. I'll let everyone know my bank's response.
    When I bought my 911, I wired the funds to Vegas and it was nerve racking to say the least.
    I'm so thrilled to finally have my 308, that I guess a little grief is certainly worth it!
     
  20. bpfordfan

    bpfordfan Rookie

    Nov 2, 2006
    16
    I also just sold my 6,000 mile 1977 308 GTB to a person in Brazil and had no trouble at all. I used a broker out of Florida that had the car picked up at my house by his driver. He did all of the title and paper work for the deal, and I was paid in one day. If you would like the contact information let me know.
    Brian
     
  21. rgamoras

    rgamoras Karting

    Jun 18, 2006
    53
    Benicia
    Full Name:
    Richard Gamoras
    I guess it would depend if the 3rd party is known and reputable. The 3rd party I plan on using is a local consigner, which I have visited his warehouse frequently to checkout his cars. Otherwise, I would ask fellow chat-members if they know any 3rd party agents/brokers.
     
  22. rgamoras

    rgamoras Karting

    Jun 18, 2006
    53
    Benicia
    Full Name:
    Richard Gamoras
    Thanks Brian. I will let you know!
     
  23. 4RE-MAN

    4RE-MAN Karting

    Oct 10, 2005
    74
    W.PALM BEACH, FL.
    Full Name:
    EDDIE JELLEY
    Went to the bank, The advisor told me that it is perfectly safe to receive a wire transfer and give the acount #.
    She also felt that opening a separate acount for this purpose was a better idea. So, I did.
    Now I guess I'll just wait..............................
    Heck, I waited 20 years for my 308 !
     
  24. rgamoras

    rgamoras Karting

    Jun 18, 2006
    53
    Benicia
    Full Name:
    Richard Gamoras
    Here is the latest. I been in contact with the potential buyer almost on a daily basis via email. He is from Denmark. His friend who is to be vacationing here in California is supposed to be here this weekend and will be looking at the car on the buyers behalf.

    In addition, I just visited the shipping company here in Oakland earlier today (keep in mind, this is the shipping company that the buyer recommended) and spoke with the shipping manager who confirmed that she has been in contact with the buyer and the receiving company in Denmark. So when we are ready to do the transaction, I will drop my car off at the shipping company with keys, title and bill of sale. The shipping company confirmed that they will hold/store the vehicle and the buyer will wire the funds into my account. Once the funds have cleared, I will give the shipping company the green light to ship the vehicle.
     

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