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Anyone here consider the mp4-12c?

Discussion in '360/430' started by carbonm, Jun 7, 2016.

  1. vrsurgeon

    vrsurgeon F1 World Champ
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    Dec 13, 2009
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    Maybe so, maybe not.. there are different costs of ownership in the UK and the US for Ferrari's.. and there are different costs for McLaren's as well. I don't think they'll be collectable anymore than an Aston is collectable here. The problem is the better models that came after and the limited and ungodly expensive parts network. I suspect that like Cayenne buyers will jump ship to Lexus in a heartbeat while 911 buyers are always Porsche buyers... McLaren buyers will not have the same brand love. At least, I don't see it in those that I've know who have had them. Great car, but no nostalgia associated with it..
     
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  3. Ingenere

    Ingenere F1 Veteran
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    A lot of new McLaren buyers are the gotta have the latest/greatest types (as are many Ferrari owners). But as the brand matures and enthusiasts take hold, there will be brand loyalty and collectability. Enthusiasts need access to a proper diagnostic tool and parts prices need to come in line with reality.

    After 30 years of Ferrari ownership, I can see what McLaren is doing and it really is quite incredible. After getting a 570, I am a believer. Because I am like Trev, I will find cost effective ways to keep the car on the road. They are actually easy to service. The internet horror stories are in the minority. The vast majority of cars are great.

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  4. Samuel Misrasi

    Samuel Misrasi Karting

    Jun 7, 2019
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    I wouldn’t touch one outside of the warranty period.
     
  5. hwyman

    hwyman Formula Junior

    Jun 25, 2015
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    The MP4 was a bold entry and an amazing display of engineering know how no doubt. Like everything else no amount of R&D can replicate 5, 10 years of actual use. I think the P1 and Senna will be collectible cars.. the MP4 probably not since the newer models are much better. I feel that way about the 991 GT3RS as well, the 991.2 is better and the 992 will be better yet. The 458 has the fact its the last NA car as a feature, but I doubt a 488 will ever be worth more than an F8, just like whatever comes after the F8. Analog cars are gone, tech and speed seekers will want the newest thing, collectors will want extreme exclusivity like these 1 off million dollar plus cars.
     
  6. vrsurgeon

    vrsurgeon F1 World Champ
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    I personally think of it as "experiences" and why will a person pay for a given experience.
    Muscle cars were in (yes past tense) because some balding, fat, middle aged guy was finally able to buy the car he wanted in high school or wanted to re-experience his youth with his high school car. Millennials don't care about that experience.
    IMHO the flappy paddle experience is similar between the 458, 488 and beyond. If the F8 gives a different "feel" to the car, then the experience will be valued over the 458 and 488 experience. Note, I'm not sure "more power" is enough to significantly change the experience on some of these newer cars. Haven't ridden/driven enough McLarens to know the difference in feel and driving experience between the models if there is indeed one or if people will crave it or pay for it.
     
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  8. Smiles

    Smiles Moderator
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    I found the mp4-12c very boring to drive.

    The 570 was prettier, a little faster, but no more exciting.

    Matt
     
  9. _JERRY_

    _JERRY_ Karting

    Feb 1, 2016
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    I feel the proportions of the car, its a lil too small for an exotic.
     
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  10. greyboxer

    greyboxer F1 World Champ

    Dec 8, 2004
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    Given the knowledge you have previously shared that comes across as quite a recommendation (even with the qualifications)
     
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  11. 360trev

    360trev F1 Rookie
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    The 12C is a highly complex software controlled car and its vastly different depending where you've got your handling and powertrain settings applied, track mode changes things considerably. The differences are very pronounced. Also active panel and manual gears is a must.

    I still feel the software for the box is programmed for emissions so changes up waaay too quickly, especially in race mode and doesn't hold a gear long enough so you literally must drive it for fun in fully manual gears mode. So when you want to overtake you don't have to drop down as many as 3 gears to get in the rich torque power band. Also you must be driving the later software which yields faster more intelligent shifts, 616hp stock and improved sense of humor for traction.

    I also fitted an Akrapovic Titanium system before I even drove the thing and yet I still feel its way too quiet, therefore Sports cats are a must too. The 360 screams and sounds waay better but the torque you get when 12C hits its stride just hits you like you've just added several more litres of capacity.

    That's the funny thing about the 12C, the minute they upgraded the software all of the driving reviews and impressions went out of the window, it became a different car...

    Also I have fitted 675LT ultra lightweight rims and they have a built in wheel spacer in the offset so handing limits are improved and its a big difference again. Car can really hold on much more than you'd expect, literally hurts your insides under higher g corners.. Impressive impressive car..
     
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  13. 360trev

    360trev F1 Rookie
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    Thank you.

    It really is an amazing car. The carbon tub makes a big difference to handling as its just so super stiff and the airbrake has to be experienced to understand the difference it makes. With upgraded Pagid pads and some good tires the car feels like it's setup for the track out of the box. Even now with a light fettle very few cars can keep up.. That's Impressive in itself.

    As for values, time will tell but I get the impression they will go up and especially the 675LT too.
     
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  14. 360trev

    360trev F1 Rookie
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    It actually is a impressive experience to drive and feels very modern still even next to latest batch of hypercars but that is only in the right modes and only when your 'on it'. Someone competent at a track will shock you how good it can fly around destroying all but the fastest toys.

    At normal everyday speeds I can understand what people are wondering what all the fuss is about. In normal powertrain and handling modes the car drives like it's a luxury saloon which actually isn't what I want from an occasion car. Does at least mean you could drive it every day if you so wished.

    I also felt the car should have come with the MSO carbon front bumper as standard, totally transforms the look, way more aggressive. Don't forgot you have some cool party tricks too like dihedral doors which make it an event.fit the optional carbon P1 seats and they are amazing too and then you can put in harnesses.

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  15. Ingenere

    Ingenere F1 Veteran
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    Great shot. That doesn't look like IOM! :)
     
  16. RedTaxi

    RedTaxi Formula 3
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    Hmm, Trev is starting to sway me....
     
  17. saudio

    saudio Karting
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    I currently have a 2013 12C spider and a 2008 F430 spider 6MT gated. I churn through my fun cars about every 2-3 years, so the 12 C is coming up for sale and I have my sights next on a 488 Spider. Nothing to add to the 12C conversation, it is without any question the most car you can buy for the money, and it is that because of it's reputation for expensive repairs. I found that even adding in the cost of extended warranty, it's still an incredible value so if you don't have the stomach for risk, you can get the warranty and drive worry free. The F430 is noticeably slower, period, but still enough of a different experience that when a manual came available I grabbed it. If I was comparing an F1 430 to a 12C, there would be no choice. 12C all the way. If anybody is looking for a great example 12C spider with warranty, ping me, and if anybody wants to trade a 488 spider for my F430 spider gated manual, I'll chat with you as well. ;-)
     
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  18. redspyder

    redspyder Karting

    Jul 10, 2012
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    Buy a 12C! I've own a 360 spider for 8 years and an 12C Spider for 5 years. Sold the 360 a few month ago and replaced it with a 488 Spider.
    I love my 12C and will keep it forever!!! AWESOME EXOTIC!!!! Lot more car for the $$$$$$ and it's a super car!
     
  19. _JERRY_

    _JERRY_ Karting

    Feb 1, 2016
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    I think there is a thread about this somewhere, or even on a youtube video. The 12c is gonna depreciate worse than a 430 in terms of flat out sale price; that and, one is turbocharged whilst the other is NA. I'm by no means a mechanic, but i've always firmly believed, on a flat-ground "vs" analysis, a car with a turbo will on average have more maintenance issues than an NA. I'm sure someone can show me an exception to this rule, but i'm gauging on an average, with close to similar use-conditions.
     
  20. 360trev

    360trev F1 Rookie
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    Your a bit late to the party with that information, that's the thing now, the McLaren 12C has ALREADY depreciated now so people today can bank those savings.

    Its done so much depreciation infact (due to a small minority of insta fame guys) that at its new price its currently in a great price sweet spot. I've uploaded my 12C deprecation calculator so you can adjust the specs to work out how much the car your looking at cost new. The fully spec'd cars are the best value by a large margin. Its a super car bargain and I would say chipped its comparable performance to even a 488.

    Yes around 75% of the new price is gone. So your fully optioned up 400k usd new car is now available with sub 20k miles on for 100k.. That's one HELL of a bargain if you get warranty. Its why I jumped on one. At this kind of price, the $ to performance ratio is so compelling that it has to be a consideration for anyone who enjoys seriously high performance cars. Especially considering a simple remap gets 700hp and a turbo upgrade can see 1,000hp. Nuts even by today's standards. Not much out on the road can even see off a stock 12C let alone a chipped one.

    I'm VERY happy with my recent purchase and I a $400k one with EVERY SINGLE carbon option ticked.


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