Appeal Court Meet to Rule on Diffusers

Will be interesting to see which way this one goes but I have a hunch the diffuser will stay...look how much extra money is being made because of the so called change in winners.. cynical but who knows...

 

Williams owes money to Bernie. He won´t let them down.

 

I say keep the diffuser and let development nature take its course. Enough with the politics. F1 should be played out on track not decided in the courts.

 

I agree but everything about F1 seems to center on politics and money, for example I think its plain stupid to allow no testing during the year. Its got to a point where I think teams need to stand up to the FIA and Bernie instead of just rolling over.

 

This is the only decision that is logical to me; the "other" teams have already spent a great deal of money and time on their own double-decker diffusers, so throwing everything out would be a baby with the bathwater scenario. Of course, as Ferrari 360 CS aptly put it, logic isn't always a deciding factor in FIA and FOM decisions.

 

I can't wait to see how this weeks episode of the F1 Soap Opera turns out. I think I will stick to reruns of Green Acres with Arnold the pig or watch Mr Ed, at least these shows are closer to the truth than F1 these days
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

The lawyer representing Renault at the diffuser hearing in Paris on Tuesday confirmed the French team is ready to deploy its own version of the controversial design.

The legal representative, Andrew Ford, told the FIA's Court of Appeal judges that Renault started work on the concept and asked representatives of the governing body if it would be legal.

"It is not that Renault missed the boat (...) it is because the FIA said it was illegal," he said.

Ford revealed Renault could immediately deploy an initial version of the design, theoretically in China this weekend, should the court throw out its appeal against the stewards' rulings authorising the controversial diffusers.

In Australia, Renault, Ferrari and Red Bull protested against the Brawn, Toyota and Williams cars. In Malaysia, BMW Sauber followed suit.

Those seven teams are present in Paris on Tuesday, as is McLaren, who is siding with the anti-diffuser teams but is not expected to actually address the court.


Ferrari's QC Nigel Tozzi - involved for the Italian team in the spy saga of 2007 - led the anti-diffuser argument, slamming Brawn's submission that the appeal is "vindictive" on the basis that the contesting teams did not think of the divisive concept.

Referring to former Ferrari Technical Director Ross Brawn, Tozzi said: "Only a person of supreme arrogance would think he is right when so many of his esteemed colleagues would disagree."

The Ferrari counsel also did not hold back on criticising the FIA, noting the inconsistency of having told some teams the diffuser concept is illegal, and then green-lighting the similar solutions of other teams.

"The position of the FIA is totally baffling. We urge you to save the FIA from itself," he told the panel.

http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/090414151443.shtml

 

I agree with both sides of the argument but it seems unfair to let them race these diffusers while more then half of the teams were told it was illegal. An Those other teams pretty much gave the races to these other team with them equipped. i wihs they would have set the rules in stone from the get go or had no rules. Racing is not meant to be equal through out down to a T i know this but for half of these teams they hadn't even thought of doing this so they are very far behind an money has been spent else where.

 

No one told the other teams it was illegal. They themselves believed them to be illegal.

 

Not correct.

Renault and Red Bull both asked.

The legal representative, Andrew Ford, told the FIA's Court of Appeal judges that Renault started work on the concept and asked representatives of the governing body if it would be legal.

"It is not that Renault missed the boat (...) it is because the FIA said it was illegal," he said.

 

Yes they did tell them. Thats what makes it so disappointing. And for them to still be taking it to appeals an I'm sure they will let it pass.

 

OK. Renault has, as of yesterday, said they asked. I've not heard or read anything about Red Bull. Provide a link please.

Also the report from Renault is that they asked "someone" within the FIA if theirs would be legal. Who that is I don't know, it certainly doesn't appear to be Charlie Whiting. Also just because they showed them their diffuser design doesn't mean it WAS legal. Could it be that they came up with a clever design that wasn't as clever as the other three and it WAS illegal?

Just because they asked doesn't mean they've been wronged. I'm also highly dubious of Renault "asking" someone about it. Funny how the day of the hearing this is the first time we've heard of it. I smell B.S.

 

This line seems to sum of the state of F1 these days: "F1 is about the clever engineers making other engineers look stupid". Now, as long as the fickle 5 doesn't pull the rug out from under those smart engineers...
CH

 

Charles the only ones talking crap are The FIA it's because they don't know there arse from there elbow, What are we meant to be believe when, both Bernie, and PornoMax both stated from day one they don't know whether it's legal or not!! expect trouble, I mean WTF, fight it out yourself's, and then we will see what happens, then we will adjust accordingly, it's pathetic. Yet again PornoMax is to blame, he is just obsessed with revenge, not real issues.

 

Funny, yet truly sad.

 

ANy news yet? 1:31 am here on wednesday morning.

 

Steve, dont be fooled. These guys know what is legal and what is not. They leave things like this purposly open to interpretation so they can have a lot more latitude when it comes to decisions which involve keeping things close till the end. Do you honestly think that they would leave something as simple as a defuser so open to interpretation when in years gone by everything in the wing including flexation was measured to the millimeter. Bargeboards also comes to mind. Clearance under the car as well. I will bet that once this is settled that something else will pop up that will require intervention. If and when it does....I will be finished watching this BS. They must really think we are all stupid......Maybe we are.

 

Not yet - From the F1 site:

Which will be Thursday monring for you (?)

 

Just because you only just heard of it isn't grounds for further conjecture. You decry the evidence but have none of your own beyond suspicion and conjecture.
Renault first said that in public ages ago before the Oz GP after the Brawn rollout, as did Red Bull.
Sorry, too much effort to dig up a link. Search yourself. They're out there.

Between the FIA telling Renault and RB "no go" and the Brawn roll out we had Honda withdrawing and Toyota looking to follow suite.
I'm confidant thats what's behind the FIA allowing the cars to race and thereby creating the double standard and all the confusion.
An immediate ruling against the Brawn cars would've killed off any chance for the team's survival and a ruling embracing the Toyotas could be seen as likely to tip the balance between staying or leaving F1.

So yes, Max and the FIA have caused the issue to a degree but because they've had bigger issues to get past. Four cars off the grid could've triggered a landslide.

 

I think it will be Wednesday night for me. Late night. It's about 7-8 hours diff.. Thanks mate

 

That's my impression too.

And even worse from Bernie's point of view, he'd have lost $$$ as his contracts with the track owners include huge penalties if he doesn't show up with a complete grid.

 

I happen to go along with that Franco..

But I do believe it is a little bit more than just the diffuser IIRC it's holes in it causing the problem I think .......Florian help..

BTW nice new Avatar. .

 

Exactly.

Who knows how Bernie would've reacted and what other fall out would occur, up to the whole card house coming down.

 

Well yes agreed, but as per norm we as fans have to suck it and see, logic and fair play seemed far removed from this sport.