Are 3X8 Prices REALLY Going Up? Value vs Price

I'd argue that you need to include a small "time" factor too (i.e., a 15 year old 308QV with X miles is worth more than a 25 year old 308QV with X miles) -- so they have gone up a bit

 

If that is true... then the good news is they did not loose value... unless you dont maintian them... so they are still a loosing proposition, but just on the maint..... my opinion.

I think in 10 more years, 348's, 355, & 360's will really hit bottom... with all the high cost deferred maint... it will not be pretty! which will make 308's a total bargan... like the 356 Porsche... then prices will climb...

 

Add the price of maint. (10-12 grand maybe) insurance, title fees etc. and the investment looks less like an investment. If you add ear to ear grins into the mix though and it's a sound investment.

 

Its all relative...

If you put 50,000$ into a ferrari in 1999...you likely outperformed the markets for several years... At least the ferrari didn't lose 80% of its value like some tech stocks...

Think of the ferrari more as a hedge against inflation...

 

The problem with your analysis is that, it seems to me, that 57K mile qvs are not fetching anywhere close to $45k. I am in the market and have been watching it. Forzamotorsports sold an 85 euro with 4xK miles for $34K if memory serves. There was what looked like a very nice green 83 ..went for low 30s, there was an 85 euro qv in oregon (40K miles) on ebay...went for low 30s. Eddie Cox sold his 85 QV (very low miles and reportedly in superb condition, although needing belt service) for $36K. I know the theory that ebay is a dumping ground but still there are exceptions and that doesn't explain the Forza car. I think the mid 40s is 57K 328 territory.

So IMHO the market says we are all still losing money on these cars. Perhaps one day the 308 will go the way of the 246 but I can't help but feel that the financial mess the Mr. Bush has produced and this global warming deal will exert huge downward pressure on these kinds of cars for the forseeable future. So enjoy them for what they are...toys and use your investment money for...investments.

 

Tommy
You are wise and see where the hard cold facts lay. I agree with you.

I believe the 308 actually has a brand problem that inhibits it from reaching better prices.

First problem is that it is sandwiched inbetween older models with collectibility cache and newer models with huge price and sex appeal. The 308 stands as the middle child so to speak.

Secondly, we all know that the early glass and carb cars are worth more because they fit the traditionalist model but the cars after that only seem to reflect the increase inflation except for a few unique models that are outside the traditional line. The trouble is we associate these together bringing the equity down in one model and the equity up in another. Hence, equalizing the value without considering the characteristics of value.


Essentially, we lump all 308's as a single idea instead of categorizing them as unique and individual models. We put early 308's with Mondials and then again with 328's which dilutes the model brands. We even do this on the Fchat site.

Also, you need to account for the frezy and large quantiuty of baby boomers buying their dreams in American cars. That will pass and the next generation will be buying their dream cars. So, until Gen X starts to get alot of money and Baby Boomers loss control the auction floors the prices will stay down.

When you look at the numbers the original 308 GTB should be considered a collector car. It has the lineage, the low quantity built, watershed moment in car history and hollywood dribblings. I believe that as owners we do our cars an injustice by thinking of them as "ferrari entry" models and try to associate them with more expensive models for cache. Perception is reality in the car sales world. We need to create our own perception of these cars and stop lumping them in with others. The middle child has a personality and is unique therefore in demand. Ultimately the original 308 series may become extinct at the rate the cars are dissappering. Which could become a good thing.

Time will tell. But in the meantime, keep telling people they are rare and handbuilt. Two characteristics money loves.

Tim

 

i do all the work that i car myself (eg new clutch and steering box last year). this is the first car that i've ever kept careful records on and despite the savings on labor the cost of parts and with the enormous amount of defered maintenance that needed doing to make the car safe for trips, i have spent well over 10K on an 81 gtsi that i bought 4 years ago for $30k. the car burned three valves last summer and is now getting a new ignition system courtesy of nick forza. in short, it's been a lot of fun, but an investment it's not. i expect to be buried with the car since i will never recoup the cost of making it right. thank god i get a big kick out of driving the thing. regards, jon s

 

Ten years and one month ago, I bought a 87 328 GTS red/tan with 33K on it for 40,200. It was a solid car with great records, but not concours. At the time, 33K was considered a bit high mileage wise. It needed tires and it had been a while since last belt service though not many miles on it since. I'm guessing an identical car today might bring 44-45K although now 33K miles might be considered somewhat low. By the way, I think '97 was the bottom for 308's and 328's, but not 348's. They went up some '98-'00, then down some '01-'02 and now back up some. As noted above, factor in inflation and they are cheaper than ever.

Dave

 

True. Given what I've spent on my 328 (maintenance/replacing worn bits), I'm 'behind' already in the strict accounting sense. Mostly I just look at it as bargain compared to the modern crap in the same price range, and also a bargain as one of the better Ferraris that happens to be fully depreciated.

Time is erasing both cars and the 'brand' perceptions. We no longer sit around bashing the 246 as a Ferrari wannabe, and ultimately people will walk up to 308/328 and see it as the only attainable Ferrari from the days of hand-assembled body-on-frame methods.

No one has mentioned this yet, but 348 prices are in the toilet, and the 360 Modenas are sinking down to $100K. Relative to other 'used car' Ferraris, the 308/328 are holding their own incredibly well.

I wouldn't worry about the 308 being perceived as the 'entry' Ferrari. It's good marketing, and time will ultimately nudge the 308 the way of the 246. Then the 360 will be the 'reliable, disposable entry-level Ferrari'. It will take 10 years.

One last comment: The 308s will always live side by side with the 328s, and except for the distinct and rare 'glass 308s I think that 328 will fare better over time on account of its integrated bumpers. Blame it on NHTSA, not Leonardo. Fact is, for the general public, the 308 and 328 are the same car.

 

It depends on the year. The 70s 308s are going up in value. The early 2 valve ones are keeping up with inflation and the late 88.5 and 89s are rising 7 to 12 percent.

From 2005-2006 Low mileage queen 89s went from 65,000 dollars to 75,000 dollars. That same car stayed steady from 2006 -07
When it comes down to it its a comodity. The price is what someone will pay.

There have been several 328s at auction that went for big money with alot of miles. That yellow 89 at Barrett-Jackson went for 60,000 and it had about 47,000 miles. And a Kruse car went last December for 40,000 dollars and it had 99,980 miles on it. JJ

 

I wouldnt want a 25 year old 360 with the F1 gearbox, not so sure about reliability either. Special equipment to reset the release bearing position for the computer, yuck! Not to mention cost of parts. Entry level perhaps but the bar will be much higher making entry much harder to reach as well as to maintain. Glad I got in when I did.

 

But it wont stay that way. In any car make or model you could find, the earliest examples of a particular model have almost always stood head and shoulders above its brothers. Take for example a Dodge Challenger, the 70 is the most expensive, the 74 is downright cheap. Ditto the Cuda, the TransAm, among other examples. The value of the carbed 308 will eventually surpass the later cars and stay that way. The early carb cars will surpass the later, the glass cars will surpass all 308's. Its just a matter of when.

 

This 348 sold for about $50k this year:

1995 Ferrari 348 Spyder
Yellow
45k miles
Asking For: $52,000

Here are my pics with the car:
http://benzfanz.com/Ferrari348Spider/
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

I would put those garage queen '89 328's in their own category. You're "not allowed" to drive them because that turns the odometer, so they're useless. And I wouldn't call them much of an investment even if you park them, stare at them, and just follow pricing trends to see if you made a couple grand, seeing as they were at $250K in 1990. (The one that comes to mind is the 300-mile black/black '89, which is both amazing and somehow pointless -- hard to explain. You can't drive it over to the tire place to get new tires, because that would add 10 percent to the total mileage over the last 19 years... )

As I've said (and Winston Goodfellow wrote in Forza), IMO the $10K premium for '89s isn't money well spent. The premium for 'glass 308s likely will be someday. However, overall I agree with Dr. Tommy that looking at any of these cars as an 'investment' is basically foolish. Just drive it and enjoy it.

 

hey, you sound like this guy:

http://www.azcentral.com/specials/special43/articles/0627cars-dreamcar0701-ON.html

"I never set out to be a car collector, but I grow sentimentally attached to them."

Especially his 308.

"Yeah, this baby is going with me to the grave."

~shahedc
.

 

Everyone says the breaking point is between the carbed vs. early 2V injection. 1980.

It is actually, IMO at the Catalyst vs. Non Catalyst point at the end of 1977, when engine specifications such as cam duration and profile started a downward trend to accept the cats...

So the 1975 76 glass, and 1976-77 steels are the last ones....

But it'll be a long while if ever to reflect in the market, as the later cars went up in production numbers every year as FIAT money took hold....

No offense to the later cars, it's just apples and oranges, IMO.

 

Blame the media for lumping them all together.....even the Cavallino Value Guide doesn't split it correctly........where's Alicia??? LOL!

 

The point could be made however that any newer car would be following a depreciating curve..........308GTBs were already a flat line when I bought my first one years ago, and remain that way......

So we are not beating inflation or making the average yield of the S&P500, but against any later from of transporatation we are driving for free, less the cost of maintenance........

Defer all that and you are golden!

You also end up with a barn full of cars, all needing "something or other"....ROTFLMAO!

 

I agree with you. I paid the extra so I could have a great car. I got it with a bit over 4000 miles and I have over 7,000 on the car now. I still believe the car is worth every penny of 70 to 75k somewhere in between. In fact I believe its worth that because I did the full 30k service put in a Hyperflow did the AC and drove the car almost 3000 miles in a year. The fact that I drove the queen means that its now a Driven Queen. Even with another 5000 miles its still a 65,000 plus value car because it is afterall still an 89 red tan 328 Gts Ferrari that is Loved. Oh FYI I know someone that just sold a 12k mile 89 red tan gts for 76,000 dollars. JJ

 

Agree 100%....pretty darn sweet to driving almost for free if you had to sell. Maintence is everywhere.

Funny thing i keep ready is how the 246 is so wonderful, anyone actually know or talk to anyone that has one that hasnt spent a **** boat of money on those ? I know of 2 that went for either full paint jobs and interior for 40K....or full out engine/mechanical...so to me its all relative...they maybe worth big money, but only the ones that have big money into them as well.
Its all relative.
The 308 will come in due time.

 

Never any such thing as an "entry level" Ferrari. The factory merely offered a selection of V6, V8 or V12.
You pays your money...