Attention 360 Owners...Important Info.

I had mine go in my 2001 spider and it meant an engine rebuild. The whole parts and labour was covered under warranty in the UK with no issues at all.

Check with FNA - it seems to me that labour for an engine rebuild is covered due to the defective variator but not covered for preventative work. Tell them you intend to rev the car repeatedly highly on a track and see if they want to cover the labour on the small job or the larger reuild.

 

i thought you were kidding...i checked and you aren't kidding. LOL.

ferraristinks.com is available also

 

would someone please mind explaining exactly what this variator is / does, why it fails and then what happens. toned down for the non-engineer types would be helful, thanks.

 

If you have heard of variable valve timing then you are half way there. 360 has two variators on the exhaust (one for each bank) that change the timing of the exhaust valves to open and close earlier or later. The duration will still stay the same since that is controlled by the cam lobes. The variators have an inherent design problem. Ferrari re-designed them back in 2001 and updated them apparently as late as 2003. Mechanically they have changed the length of the variator shaft to probably make it stronger. They started failing in the challenge cars first and then a few road cars with blown valves pistons and variators got cars sidelined. Do you know what happens if the timing belt breaks...similar catastrophic failure can happen if a variator fails. Ferrari had a recall to replace variators on all challenge cars but not the road cars. Now they have recalled the road cars to replace the variators to avoid major failures in the engines.

 

how could a dealer refuse to do authorized warranty work because they feel they are not being fairly compensated?? sounds like if it failed they would be responsible regardless.

i have never owned a new ferrari but it has become painfully obvious that FNA has no interest or control over their dealers. could you imagine any other brand of dealer making the same claim? something goes wrong with my BMW, they fix it.

Time for FNA to start cracking down on these shady dealers, shady deals, "preferred client" lists, scams etc. and all the rest of the junk that has given many of their devoted customers and wannabe customers a bad taste.


sounds like LFSC should be losing some f430 allocations, that'll teach em.

 

that does make a difference if it is a case of FNA claiming a 5 hr job actually takes 10 hrs.....

a good friend of mine owns a german imports service shop, and the mechanics are almost always able to do repairs below book times especially if its a bigger project where labor overlaps.

just out of curiosity, what the diff between FNA book and actual tech time on a 360 belt rep?

 

That is a very good example of just what is happening. And yes your friend is correct, the German car companys are well known in the industry for extravagant flat rate times.
The labor times in the Ferrari books have gone in recent years to an all inclusive system in most cases. An example of the problem in practice, if you have to replace part "A" the time is one hour. But you have to remove part "B" to get to it and part "B" takes two hours. You can't add part A and B together on a warranty claim. Ferrari admits to the dealers that these issues exist but as far as they are concerned "To bad, that is what the book says that is what we are paying". It is an extraordinarily unfair sys. In practice on customer pay work we try to determine from experience what a reasonable time for an average Ferrari mechanic to do the job properly, some do it faster some slower.

 

I am thinking of pruchasing a 2000 F1. How do you recognize the problem? How do you know that something is wrong or if it will cause problems with my particular car?
Thx.

 

My experience tells me that dealers are indeed squeezed between factory-owned importers and customers (at least those who complain), but that's normal somehow: it is the situation of any sales force, whether owned or franchised.
Long waiting lists don't help to be customer-oriented.
A core customer base that pretty much accepts any BS because it corresponds to their vision of automotive darwinism - if you are not prepared to pay ridiculous amounts on parts & labour resulting from poor quality, you don't deserve to own Ferraris - doesn't help to fight complacency.

In my experience, a good solution is to hold dealers to the standards you expect from them, BUT also help them by writing to your national importer and, if required, to the mkg department in Maranello. FNA, to use that example, has an easy play if they're shielded from customers.
I speculate that the core issue is in Maranello, at least for all importers owned by Ferrari Spa. Give the hardest time to the people who are the closest to the decision centers.

And if you get too much nonsense, be resolute about moving to competition. Devout, blind passion is our worst ennemy.

 

question - does the strad share this sub-optimal variator with the 360? or was the whole shebang fixed/updated in 2003 as 412fly implies?

can someone with the TSB post the range of affected vins?

doody.

 

This campaign involves all 360 models with engine numbers below 60796 only (vin range; 114015 to 123399). I believe it covers Model year from 1999 through early 2001.

 

i'm about $65k in depreciation of where i'd like to own one.

 

I can relate to that, but as the saying goes, grass is always greener ...

 

Hey Tom,

Don't be frustrated, especially since you have owned Ferraris before. I think there is something special about Ferraris and that's why we are atrracted to them from childhood. Modern Ferraris by far are better built and more trouble free than those of decades ago. But they are no Toyota or BMW. Look on the bright side as I do where I chased this issue all the way to the national director at FNA with lots of lip service but finally getting a piece of mind that yes, the parts are faulty and they MUST be replaced. Believe me, some guys have lost months of using their cars and over $20K out of pocket expense dealing with this issue. I still think 360M is by far the best looking and most exciting car to look, hear and drive.

Cheers,
Matt

 

will a ppi be able to detect this problem? should i insist on having them replaced as a purchase contigency?

 

That is where a person that knows those cars specifically comes in. During a PPI the service records for the car as well as the TSB's and recalls should be reviewed. If some or none of that is made available, replacement would be wise.

 

thx.

 

Gentlemen, The US government has a website where all such defects and service bulletins are supposed to be listed http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/tsb/tsbsearch.cfm. I did not find the bulletin which covers this topic but I believe that Federal law requires such a disclosure and if it is safety related for the vehicle manufacturer to remedy the problem. It also lists 201-816-2651 as the official telephone number for inquiries. It was interesting to see some of the other recalls and service bulletins(only available through FOYA) for a fee. FNA has a history of not doing anything unless you scream loud enough.