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AustrianGP 2020 Pre-Race thread

Discussion in 'F1' started by jgonzalesm6, Jun 3, 2020.

  1. Isobel

    Isobel F1 Veteran
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    Jun 30, 2007
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    No March ever had a Porker. Arrows or Footwork or whatever had that boat anchor.
     
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  2. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 F1 Veteran
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    Ferrari: Mugello test on June 23 with Leclerc and Vettel.
     
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  3. william

    william F1 World Champ

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    You are right, it was a Footwork, and it didn't work.
    You cannot do a V12 on the cheap, and that was one of the rare flops made by Porsche.
     
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  4. Mitch Alsup

    Mitch Alsup F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
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    I seem to recall the 917 being a great success--not in F1--but a great success nonetheless.
     
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  5. Isobel

    Isobel F1 Veteran
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    Big expectations from everyone that season until the team recognized the PU was truly Peeuwww and they subsequently dusted off Cossies from the season prior halfway thru.

    Nice driver pairing too, Stefan and Albo, got to see them in action in Montreal with the 12 where they barely scraped through pre-quali...
     
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  6. william

    william F1 World Champ

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    Unlike the V12 that powered the Footwork F1, the flat-12 on the 917 wasn't 2 flat-6 engines cobbled together in a hurry though.
    It drew from the experience with the flat-6 and flat-8, but was purposely designed as a 12 cylinder engine.
    Porsche design team also created a flat-16 in secret, but prefered to put turbos on the flat-12 for the 917-30 CanAm car instead
     
  7. Korr

    Korr F1 World Champ
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    I'm looking forward to this season.

    It could be Coulthard's year.
     
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  8. Bas Jaski

    Bas Jaski Two Time F1 World Champ

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    you mistake my post for being very serious.
     
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  9. Mitch Alsup

    Mitch Alsup F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
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    One interesting thing about this engine is that they tapped power out of it in the middle of the crankshaft in order to keep crankshaft vibrations in check. a pair of 1/2 as long cranks shafts are a lot stiffer than one longer crank; and of course it was one solid piece of steel.
     
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  10. william

    william F1 World Champ

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    Yes, doing so they also added an other bearing (now 8 instead of 7) and reduced the torsion stress on the crankshaft.
    The drawback was that they increased the friction surface. But then, everything is a compromise in engineering.
     
  11. absostone

    absostone F1 Veteran
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  12. ingegnere

    ingegnere Formula 3
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    Oy, already being out-developed. What have they been doing since they got back to work? Is the budget cap already in effect?

    Also curious how FIA made sure nobody was working during lockdown and if all teams are equally handicapped by the precautionary measures or are some disregarding these.
     
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  13. ingegnere

    ingegnere Formula 3
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    #88 ingegnere, Jun 21, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2020
    ... and they increased the length. I remember a quote from someone in the Footwork (formerly Arrows) team saying they knew they were in trouble when they saw how long it took Porsche to unroll the drawing of that engine when first shown to them, LOL.

    Good story in Autosport where Newey says he turned down the Porsche engine for Leyton House - because of its size - and instead asked Ilmor to design them a bespoke engine. He also explains how this did not sit well with his boss who wanted to be associated to the prestigious Porsche name.

    https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/150081/the-lost-f1-team-that-launched-newey

    Like I wrote, good story, except for incorrectly attributing the first raised nose car to Newey where Byrne had designed one (though more stepped than raised) with small splitter on the Benetton in ‘86.
     
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  14. DeSoto

    DeSoto F1 Veteran

    Nov 26, 2003
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    They weren´t very good at Indy, either. After that and the F1, I think that Porsche doesn´t want to go back to single seaters anytime soon (I´m excluding Formula E as those are like fast golf carts).

    Regarding the 917, probably the engine was not that great, but there were other things that made the car succesful, i.e. the aero work of John Wyer and (the biggest advantage probably) that Porsche spotted the loophole in the Gr. 5 rules one year earlier than anybody else.
     
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  15. william

    william F1 World Champ

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    In 1979, Porsche was enticed to enter Indy, and by all account would have been very competitive.
    Their flat-6 was given a boost pressure value between the 4-cyl and the V8, and Porsche worked on that basis.
    It was said that under pressure from US teams that used V8, USAC changed the boost pressure limit for 6-cyl engines for 1980: I don't know if that's true.
    Their engine would have been uncompetitive with the reduced boost, so Porsche withdrew before the season started. That's the story anyway...

    Porsche came back in 1987 with its own chassis, and that didn't work. Switching to March chassis the following year didn't bring more than a few podiums.
    So they left after 3 years this time. On the whole, Porsche was disappointing at Indy, in contrast with its success in GT and sportscars.

    In 2 years, the 917 won every world endurance championship races bar one: Sebring was the exception.
    At Sebring, ALL the 917 retired after front hub failure; a 908 almost won but finished behind Andretti's Ferrari.
    A batch of hub bearings had been wrongly fitted without being tested first; a rare lapse of attention in the Porsche organisation.
    The 917 was fragile if over-revved, and most of the failures came after missed gear changes.
     
  16. jpalmito

    jpalmito Formula 3

    Unofficial words from Italy suggests our car will be hugely modified for Austria.
    If it's not the case, I have to admit Binotto would lose some credibility in its ability to run this team.
    Wait and see ..
     
  17. Bas Jaski

    Bas Jaski Two Time F1 World Champ

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    If they haven't done a big update then this team really is doomed.
     
  18. classic308

    classic308 F1 Veteran

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    In the three volume book on Porsche it was said that the Porsche v12 weighed almost 100 lbs more than the Ferrari v12 according to an engineer familiar with both engines. Porsche really mailed it in on that motor.
     
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  19. william

    william F1 World Champ

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    Porsche engineering is usually very good, but with that engine they made a real cock-up .
     
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  20. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 F1 Veteran
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    Yep, better in a real car than doin virtual stuff behind a TV.
     
  21. Ferrari 308 GTB

    Ferrari 308 GTB F1 Veteran

    Feb 21, 2015
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    Vettel looks scared
     
  22. DF1

    DF1 F1 World Champ
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    For me was almost -'' why am I doing this now??' impression.....
     
  23. fer312t

    fer312t Formula Junior

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    Painful reminder of how good the gloss red looked :mad:
     

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