I'd like to replace my existing BCD fuel pump, but I'm at a bit of a loss as to what to replace it with. The pump I have on the car still works, but it's getting too old to have faith and trust in it. I've already repaired it once before, but that was ten years ago. The motor had failed on it, but I was lucky to get just a replacement motor from Superformance in the UK, but that was while it was under previous owners. The new owners don't carry those replacement motors anymore. The pump portion I believe is original so that would make it 38 years old now... In my quest for a suitable alternative, I've turned up a lot of junk from the aftermarket and am running out of choices. I've gone through the threads here in F'Chat and alot of people recommend the Facet, but I had a Facet on the car before when I was repairing the BCD and I hated how loud it was. I've seen Pierberg (sp?) mentioned also, but I can't seem to find these locally (Vancouver, Canada), but maybe I'm looking in the wrong places? Finally, I would just like to have a BCD pump, because it does run the quietest, it's compact, it puts out a lot of volume (but reasonable, Weber-friendly pressure) and what was originally on the car. Does anyone, or any supplier have a NOS BCD pump stashed away?... These weren't just used on Ferraris, but in many other Italian/European cars as well, so there should have been many of these made back in the day. I kick myself to this day because after I first repaired it, there were NOS pumps being sold off on ebay from one of the parts suppliers and was thinking of getting one as a spare just in case... D'Oh! Thanks in advance. (Photos below taken ten years ago during that repair) Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
A friend of mine uses one of these and it is much quieter than OEM. Carter P4070 Carter Competition Series Electric Fuel Pumps
Just a comment on the Facet - that's what I have installed and to get it to fit on the GT4 I had to make a little riser plate so that it sneaked past the filter housing. I used the same mounting tabs on the facet and didnt alter it all, just raised it 1.5 inches or so. Worked out fine but this would not meet your approval having seen some of your attention to detail, Peter! But just thought I'd mention it as it may be another strike against the Facet in your eyes. I used it as it was readily available and reasonably priced, and should be the right volume/pressure. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Peter I do have one of these pumps that I believe is NOS that I would sell. But I put one of the Carter pumps mention above on my Maserati Bora and have been very happy with it. These old pumps are not that reliable, even though you have had a good experence with it.
Midwest Bayless has one though not cheap. These show up used on Ebay from time to time. Fuel Pump - Electric - w/Carburetor - BCD (Fiat 124, 128, 131, Scorpion, Ferrari) - OE NOS
I searched the threads here as well and in the end went with the Facet. That thing is so loud! I think it's a hoot. With a carb car you have to let it run for perhaps up to a minute before you can crank the car. I love it.
the OE pumps are rotary pumps, which is why they hum instead of click, and are so quiet. I have one on my '74 Fiat 124 as well and I like it best. That carter pump someone referenced looks pretty - is it rotary, or does it click? One option is to get a "fuel injection" style pump, as they are usually rotary. Since they are higher pressure you'll have to run a pressure regulator between the pump and the carb. I use that setup on my Fiat 850 and it works well. Lastly, Dave at Apple Motors in Denver rebuilds the OE style pumps : Apple Motors Jonathan Denver, CO the FiatRN
Really? Quiet? Not only have I read it here, but various auto forums that come up in google searches have many people complain about the loud noise from Carter pumps... I recently bench-tested a Holley RED pump and that thing howled... Like I said, I had a Facet on the car and I found it way too loud. Believe it or not, it overpowered the Borla exhaust which I don't think is a hoot ... I want to hear that, not the fuel pump! Carter pump is rotary - see above comments. I've heard about that as well - using a FI pump with a return-to-tank pressure regulator. I'd consider it, but not keen on trying to tie-in a return line into the existing fuel hose system... Thanks for the Apple Motors reference (will add it to my Favorites).
You must have saved this link in your Favorites, because it doesn't show up when you search their catalog now. If you look closer, this link is dead as the "Add To Cart" button is inactive (and therefore NLA. If you search using the BCD's P/N, it just references to their Carter pump they sell).
The Facet Bendix successors are indeed quite loud, even with the rubber mounts. The Pierburgs are a bit less noisy but still very present. Two pumps which are less noisy (similar to the BCD Coronas) are the classic Mitsuba fuel pump and the Hardi 18812 fuel pump (similar to classic SU pumps), but not sure if they are available where you live.
Thanks for those suggestions. The Hardi would probably only be able to come directly from Europe, but the Mitsuba maybe sourced locally. A moot point anyways as I do have a NOS BCD on its way to me (should arrive in the mail in the next couple of days).
Recently the fuel pump in my 76 GTB became very noisy (bad bearings, I think). So I decided to install a new pump and researched Facet and Pierburg, and read a comment on this forum by alhbln (who always has good technical advice) in which he suggested a German pump by Hardi. You can find specifications here: HARDI - Electric fuel pumps for carburettor I had a difficult time finding a US distributor, after much searching found one in Northern California. He is Basil Adams phone 707.762.0974 (I have no vested interest). The pump I selected is Model 13312 which puts out 2.2 psi. My unit has the inlet and outlet fittings 180 degrees apart, a model exists that has the port configuration at an angle similar to our original pumps. I have installed the pump and ran it today, it is quieter than my old pump and makes a slight clicking noise about every second. I installed a gauge into small outlet after the carburetors and measured 2.8 psi with the system plugged. There was no smell from the carburetors so no worry about lifting the needle valves. It was an easy installation, its about as close to a plug and play pump as you could want. Not vitally important - but it cost less than a Facet from Superformance. Attached are 3 photos; the first shows a dimensional comparison, the second shows the bracket configuration (there are two screws placed into the center of the mounting holes), the third is a picture of the unit installed. Hope this helps others contemplating a fuel pump change. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
So I just installed the facet pump on my gt4. So far it works well. The noise is really only a factor prior to turn over when I engage for a few seconds to pressurize the system. It's a curious sound lower in frequency kind of like an electronic fart tone. Once the engine fires though it is a non issue.... Can't hear it over the music of the engine, gearbox, induction etc. Blaine
Hello Peter, I see, the thread is more than one year old. But I'm curious. What fuel pump did you finally purchase ? I have the same thoughts like you. Preventive replacement of my now 34 years old, though working, fuel pump. At least I would like to have a spare pump in my boot while travelling longer distances. At the moment I tend to the Mitsuba. It seems to be one of the most reliable and most quiet pumps. I don't know, whether the delivery volume is sufficient for our cars. But the pressure is Weber-friendly and in the installation instructions I cannot read anything about the paper filter problems, which Pierburg describes. I also thought about the Pierburg E1F, but Pierburg writes, that there must be no paper filter between tank outlet and pump inlet. Unfortunately this is what we have. But nothing without any problem. The Mitsuba pump has only 6mm in- and outlets, while we need 8mm. I have added a pdf with instructions of the Mitsuba from a big german spare parts dealer for classic british cars. English language from page 3. Best Regards from Germany Martin Image Unavailable, Please Login
I have a few more miles on the facet pump and I've noticed that the car seems to run smoother. I used to have a distinct off idle hesitation on acceleration. This would not occur when at cooler temps but got worse as the motor got warmer. So far I haven't had the car up to full temp but I've had it close and no hesitation at all yet. This leads me to wonder if the hesitation issue was related to an insufficient fuel pressure issue. Does anyone know if a lower than ideal fuel pressure can result in off idle hiccups? I don't even know if the original pump had low pressure but it was making a squealing noise which sounded like "change me before I die and strand you somewhere horrid". Anyway, will update once I've driven the car up to full warm/hot condition but so far it's accelerating much better.
Martin, have a look at the Hardi pump, it has the correct fuel pressure and is easy to source in Germany. I have one installed in both in my 246 and 308 GT4, without any issues so far. Grüsse aus Berlin, Adrian
Hi Adrian, thanks for that hint. Which Hardi pump did you install ? The 18812 ? Maybe you can point me in the right direction. Best Regards and thank you in advance Martin
The off idle hesitation has been fixed, apparently, by the new fuel pump. I had the car up to temperature and the stumble is gone. So if any if you are having this problem you may want to eliminate fuel supply/pressure as the culprit in your troubleshooting.
My BCD pump may goes off anytime, so I am preparing to order one now. Looks like there is still no reproduction for BCD ? And Hardi pump probably the best fit ? Anyone has installed Hardi pump and does it work well for 308 carburetor GTS (psi, gph, etc) ?
I have the Hardi pumps both in the GT4 and GTS, and they work quite well. Best replacement of a BCD from my experience.
Hello. Have you tried the Pierburg? I like that it uses the same gear construction as the original BCD. That is - it is smooth continuous fuel delivery, and doesn't pulse. That said, I have had reasonable luck with a Facet. Don't love the sound.
I tried a E1F series Pierburg in the 246 GT, but found it to be a bit too loud, so eventually replaced it against a single Hardi. The Facet Red Top pump is not my first choice, it does looks similar to the earlier Bendix pumps but the fuel pressure is too high (up to 0.55 bar), so it would require installing a pressure regulator. In the 246 i had quite some issues with vapor lock in hot weather until i swapped the Red Top against the Hardi. And it's way too loud for my taste
I just picked up one of these-$50 from Jegs. This thread is a few years old-anybody had luck with these?
