belt change, how many years should it be changed?

There IS NO answer you'll find saying: 374 days of use, the belt failed.

There IS NO answer you'll find saying: I drove 30,785.4 miles and the belt failed.

There's not answers like that....in my Ferraris I have:

14 year old timing belts
6 year old timing belts

and finally, 1 year old timing belts.

I parked the first two cars, and crashed the last one into a Christmas Tree outside the Galleria..

You are due for belts, man, under the "every three year" criteria all here posting have cited, it's Ferrari Tech Bulletin. Ignore it at your own peril.

And as some have pointed out, a Bozo can change your belts and tensioners and they'll fail next week, so be careful.

You missed my comment on the cam variators, there was ONE Ferrari recall on them, and they still can snap off. So check that item too. Have yours been changed? Torqued correctly? (New tourque spec. on the bolts, lower)

 

Why is it so difficult to understand that the factory, who have done the only statistical study on V8 belt failures, recommends a 3 year belt change interval for all V8 models? As Rifledriver said, that tech bulletin has been posted here multiple times, at least three by me. If you want to make up your own interval based on hearsay to save yourself a few bucks, go for it. Neither Brian nor I will be paying if something goes wrong.

Shortly after the 575M came out, Ferrari introduced a new, improved drive belt. They promptly put out a bulletin extending belt change intervals for 575Ms to 5 years, like Brian said. They did not do that for the V8s because their statistical evidence still said 3 years.

Remember, that is a belt change and that is not tied to any other maintenance, except possibly tensioners. The 15K and 30K services are completely separate procedures unless you run up 30K miles before the three year interval expires.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

$1 a mile?

There was a 360 owner posting here from Oz that had to sell his 348 to support the rebuld from his cam variators, that were replaced at a Ferrari Dealership during the recall!

They probably over torqued them, to the old values.....

You cannot learn "too much" about these cars, and truthfully the timing belts are about the easiest question you can ask.

The original interval on my 1976 cars was what, Brain.....52,000 miles? Or something like that.

But times have changed!

 

Do us all a favor and buy a Buick.

 

You'd save even MORE money driving a 348, there's only ONE belt...

 

Alan- I think when the early belt intervals were published, Ferrari thought the EPA required them to last 50,000 miles and 5 years, like the early EPA smog/emissions gear. So they made it 52,500 miles and crossed their fingers. Took them a while to figure out they did not have to last that long.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

Perhaps you want to have a poll or two if you want to gather data.

Poll 1: For people who have had belt failures: What age?, What mileage?

Poll 2: What intervals do people currently change their belts age/mileage?


-Jim

 

thanks,

 

Been done....a bunch of times. Nothing solved, nothing learned other than there are people that want an exact answer to a subject for which there is none and never will be. It all comes down to someone who either bought a car or wants to buy a car with service requirements that he does not want, or cannot, bear the burden of.

There are a lot of things I want that I have just had to accept that I cannot afford.


What I love is it always comes down to some jerk who wants to tell us that the people who have the knowledge and try to help all have ulterior motives and are not to be trusted. In my case that got old in April 04.

F him.

 

I could not find any definitive info either (after searching this site) so I am going to go with 5 years on mine. (I need the money, I am on a tight budget, I am saving up for a buick and night school.)

 

Brian- Clueless is as clueless does. Hopefully they do not come to your shop for help. You have way more tolerance than I would, and my cluebag is way less filled than yours.

Have fun reinventing the wheel. The pros like Brian make a good living from know nothings and never listens. Helps him get a better deal on the valves, guides, etc the "experts" destroy along the line.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

Nothing too positive coming out of this thread. Let's put it to sleep....

 

i agree,the guy just asked a tech question .hes probably curious allother cars are rec at 90k miles or 5 years .one rec is buy a buick lol .

 

Eric- Affirmative. Belt threads always seem to be prolonged by folks who are too lazy to read the megabites of threads already posted on the subject. Pay your money and take your chances.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

Agreed. I mean quite frankly, the belt service must be done. Whether it's 3 yrs, 3 yrs 6 mos, 3 yrs 9.8 mos, or 4 yrs, what's the difference. And why take the chance? Just think, we've got it much easier than earlier Ferraris. And if you really don't want to pay for one, go buy a 430 and be done with it.

 

Eric- Chains are a good solution. Worked well on the first two Ferraris I owned. Looking forward to my next chain-driven valve train, if I can afford it.

Belts are not that big a deal on a 360. Not as if you have to pull the engine. Could be a lot worse. Look in the TR/348/355 threads.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

Correct, he asked a tech question and got some very good answers and some even better references that he chose to ignore in the first case and was too lazy to explore in the second. When I did not tell him what he wanted to hear he chose insults instead. It is a very common theme here to take that position with the very sources trying to help and who do have information based on facts, experience and expertise. When one of those sources is me, one of a very few left trying to help I don't like it and do not apologize for expressing it.

 

Belts are not that big a deal on 355/TR/348 either. Ferrari cannot be blamed for designing a car that had high cost per mile when it never gets driven. Belts were the best option given the state of the art of auto tech and same can be said of the packaging of the cars you mention. A Daytona, and even worse, a C4 had a reputation for very high service costs when they were new too. It is all related to the time frame and what we consider normal or acceptable. We are in a period, and have been since the TR was built where we can buy a normal car and drive it to six figure mileage without ANYTHING but gas, oil and maybe a set of tires. People react to the cost of operation of these cars with THAT as a reference point.

 

The problem, here, is that the issue of belt failure is statistical in nature. That is, there is not a single number which describes the probability of failure, but an expected number and a standard deviation to that expected number. Taken together these two numbers define a curve of probability that you will eat a motor if you don't change the belt.

It is up to you to choose how much risk you are willing to take to balance your economic utility between low service costs and eating a motor.

Ferrari wants to replace very (very) few motors (under warrantee) and sets the change interval to a low number of years. If you use your car like a Challenge driver in Ferrari Challenge racing, you should change your belt even more often. If, on the otherhand, you drive down the interstate at 3500 RPMs and constant velocity you might even get 10 years out of it.

Now that the car is out of warrantee, you get to choose the risk versus potential diaster costs associated and come to your own conclusion.

This forum suggests you choose wisely.

 

No excuse on a 308. I run mine in for new belts every 3 years, period. I can't even remember what I pay but for belts only on a 308 it is just not a big ticket expense. Under a thousand dollars. As of now I have two more years to go.

That's under $27 a month mandatory expense for my QV. How about 90 cents a day? Someone here PLEASE tell me how that is a problem.

No one should be allowed to purchase a 3X8 unless they commit to this minimum of 90 cents a day expense. Should be a federal law.

 

This is the kind of data I am after, none of the results of the searches I did reveal actual mileage and or age of the vehicle, just a few anecdotes.

 

STL- Not available except at the factory. Ask them. Good
luck.

Not too many people with a hobby of maintenance statistics. Nobody except the factory could generate statistically significant data at any rate. Anecdotal is the best you will find here.

Like Dr Tommy said, if you cannot afford to keep to the factory recommended maintenance schedule and cannot do it yourself, maybe the wrong car for you.

Taz
Terry Phillips

 

As I suggested before, why don't you create a poll titled "What age/mileage did your belts fail?"
Create some buckets for:
Years: <3, 3-4, 4-5, 5-6, 6+
Miles: <15K, 15-20K, 20-25K, 25K-30K, 30K+
No failure:

I have seen polls done before, but I don't know how to create them. See thread below as an example.
http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=191587&highlight=poll

Maybe this will give you an idea of how widespread the failures are, see whether the failures were more age induced or mileage induced. Obviously there are other contributory factors like how the car is driven etc. Then you can decide how to interpret the data yourself.

-Jim

 

On the 430 I don't have to worry. I changed the belts on my 348, 355 and 360 every 5 years and didn't have a problem. HOWEVER, I drove those cars at least once a week, listened for noises indicating that the tensioners were makes noises. Never had a problem, but then again, I'm a bit of risk taker.

When I bought the Mondial, the belts hadn't been changed for 7 years, but he'd only put 3k on the car in that time period, but we still changed the belts, put a new water pump in, and changed the tensioners. I'll do the belts again in 2012, which will be 5 years.

Art

 

My 308 has 105,000 miles now. I have been planning on a pretty impressive rebuild. It doesn't need it now but one day it will get a little tired...

Anyway, a few years back I was toying with the idea of running a "belt test". After my next belt change (which was 4/09) I was just going to run it until the damn things broke just to see how long it took. When it did blow I would either salvage what I had or just buy a used longblock and ship it off to Norwood or Carobu or some other high end shop for an upgrade rebuild.

I was talked out of it real fast. My luck it would go in the worst possible location at the worst possible time.

So I am back to belts every three again.